I agree Paul, although i don`t see him getting much game time initially.

I'm not saying he needs to be smahing people and doing 50 tackles a game.
Bottom line is at the moment his defence even for a half is pretty poor and does need to be better before playing SL. Which is what I'm pretty sure Whiting was saying.

Cunnigham and Newton both carried a bit of weight, and nobody on here ever suggested either needed to lose any, given a full pre-season I am sure Ellis will be ready to step up to SL.

briers,deacon,dobson,burrows and sean long are all targeted in defence but you,ve gotta see the bigger picture and look at what they bring to the team instead of looking for negatives

too many years of Horne putting massive stints defensively, at the detriment to his attacking ability at times (because he's bloody knackered), half backs are there, predominantly, to organise the team, yes they need to be defensively sound, but other areas of their game are more important.

FFS I give in. He's fooking awesome needs no improvement for SL what so ever can't tackle but fook it.

can you pick your toys up now please, and put them back in your pram?

NO and I'm taking my ball home as well.

Have to say I was quite impressed with him last night, he has a good step too which I'm looking forward to seeing.....his kicking game is what excites me most.

I'm just hoping a senior player will take Ellis under his wing and guide him....would be quite easy for a young kid letting his new found status as a rugby league player in Hull go to his head. Hopefully a new coaching regime will be in place too so perhaps I should not worry about this.

I would also like to think Robbie Paul will have had chats with him about how to apply himself for a long career in super league....

Actually thought he tackled quite well.

Not many halfbacks have a top defensive game.
A friend of mine worked at the Club under Cleall and Crooks in the 90`s. He said Craig Coleman was bollocked by some of the forwards for his weak defence . His answer was, "That is what you meatheads are on the pitch for ! To tackle and protect me!"
Ellis will be a great signing.

Andy Gregory was a real slim Jim wasn't he!

Yeah Gregory had a bit of timber on him and certainly didn't affect his game. I dont think the weight thing is much of an issue, if he needs to lose a few pounds the conditioner will get him sorted out before february next year.

conditioner, what conditioner?

The new one whoever he/she is

Hope we dont use the old slimfast

I am sure some conditioners know quick ways of losing weight

Who???

I don't agree tbh, you could be the best kicker and most creative player in world rugby... if you can't defend you can't play superleague. I've seen him make a fair few defensive errors this year (granted only when they're on tv) whilst playing in the championship, and we all know SL is a huge step up. Priority for me is his defence, only when that's good enough will he play

Ah cheers bro!

glad some people understand me on this forum :p

Not in disagreement to that, hits hard in the tackle and tries to dominate the ruck... but tackling and defence are slightly different. My initial point about defence included going for the wrong man etc... simple things that are quite difficult to learn if they don't come quite naturally, which to him i'd say they don't

Scott Dureau and Rangi Chase have missed 123 tackles between them, would you have them in our team??

Not relevant as i didn't state that he misses tackles. A stat such as missed tackles doesn't show an accurate picture of each situation, therefore your argument is void !
P.s. yes i'd take both.. although i think chase is overrated (still class)

Personally, i don't think his weight is an issue. It hasn't slowed his pace down, hasn't stopped him from scoring 34 tries and ripping up the Championship, or stopped his kicking game being so good...so why does it matter.

Although I'd never claim missed tackles was a 100% representation of the quality of a player's defence, it is the best stat that is easily accessible. I think there is a correlation between quality of defence and missed tackles, many of the top missed tacklers e.g. Sammut, Chase and Dureau have questionnable defence, but ATEOTD it doesn't matter if a half isn't a great tackler. When signing Ellis, I doubt the club went.. Ok so he can pass, kick and score tries for fun but how can he defend?