So after all their whinging and moaning Mr Walsh is fine fit and raring to go, maybe No1 Saint will eat humble pie, this is Rugby League not netball get your players to man up,

Quote ="Sunshine state"So after all their whinging and moaning Mr Walsh is fine fit and raring to go, maybe No1 Saint will eat humble pie, this is Rugby League not netball get your players to man up,'" Somehow I doubt it. It was as bad as Raynors on Tomkins!!! www.redvee.net/forums/showthread ... enge/page5

Quote ="Sunshine state"So after all their whinging and moaning Mr Walsh is fine fit and raring to go, maybe No1 Saint will eat humble pie, this is Rugby League not netball get your players to man up,'" Somehow I doubt it. It was as bad as Raynors on Tomkins!!! www.redvee.net/forums/showthread ... enge/page5

I appreciate what the Saints fans are saying on their forum regarding injuries i.e. we don't want to see more players injured whether they play for St Helens, Wigan or otherwise. It's terrible when a player gets injured particularly if they are away from the game for a lengthy spell on the sidelines. It's a short career and in an ideal world we wouldn't see injuries of any sort despite the physicality's of the sport.

However, I do think some perspective is needed. Calls for the RFL to ban this, ban that & ban whoever will lead to the taking away some of the great things we enjoy about Rugby League. The contact and the aggressive nature of the sport is part of the fabric of the game.

Common sense says, each case should be reviewed individually rather than it being a blanket cover e.g. in the case of the shoulder charge. More and more Rugby League fans seem to be moaning about "cheap shots" and "acts of thuggery" when in most cases these incidents are blown way out of proportion by passionate fans who are caught up in the heat of the moment and also the bias towards their own team.

I really do not want to see an over-sanitised product and no, I don't want that to come at the expense of any players' career either. Surely there has to be a balance?

Seen it on Wigan TV and I can't believe Brown is moaning about it. He's quite clearly just trying to plant a seed in referees and the RFL's minds.

Glad Walsh is ok after the accidental collision with his own man by the way.

Well if they view us that bad the next time a Saints player wants a testimonial against us just tell them to sod off, Wiganers paid good money for James Robys' day and good luck to him he deserves it the good player he is but the abuse our players get is just not worth it.

Glad he is ok, glad Roby got a well deserved testimonial match... Been worth it just for the bleating stains...

There is a genuine reason why Brown is bleating.

He took the team he coached last season down another place in the table. The "rookie" coach who took over from him at Huddersfield last year took almost the same players to league leaders..

He's under immense pressure at Saints, just as the likes of Millward and Noble were at Wigan.

He is just ting himself because he knows all hope of saints season rest on Luke Walsh. Personally I don't see the improvement everyone else sees in saints, the only decent signing they have made is Walsh and he could still be a flop

I have been saying this for weeks, apart from Walsh there other signings are hardly marquee.

Amor is a good signing and Masoe could be if his hearts in it. I'm not sure that they'll add enough to see them challenge for a trophy but they'll certainly be more of a threat then last year.

If Walsh stays fit all year and plays well they could come close IMO.

If they'd have brought in someone to play him with or had a good quality young half back coming through I'd think they would be right in the mix. None of Walsh/Turner, Walsh/Hohaia or Walsh/Wilkin are top quality half back pairings IMO (Walsh/Gaskell could have been!), though I may be wrong . They'll be much improved on 2013 anyway.

Kyle Amor will prove to be an excellent signing for us, and Masoe will give us the same impact that Pettybourne will provide for you.

I agree with you. But the difference being, we didn't need Pettybourne to win the GF. Yes we have lost Mossop, but I think most observers felt that he was far from being our best prop. I think that Friday proved we have six good props, with Hopkins and Burke to add who were not even selected. Our pack will be improved from last season when it was good enough to win the double. Wigan are not standing still.

I agree, and I never suggested otherwise. Is defensive always your default stance?

Sorry I was trying to engage in debate.

I was trying to make the point that whilst Saints have improved their squad, I believe that despite losing a proven match winner in Sam that Wigan's squad is an improvement on last season when it was good enough (or lucky enough) to win the double.

Haha I was only joking mate.

I'm not sure I'd agree that your squad is stronger this season. Sam Tomkins is a world-class player and in many ways is irreplaceable. Bowen is also class but I'm not sure he will have the same impact that Tomkins did. Hampshire is also potentially awesome but he is a year or two off that.

I also believe the experience of Richards will be hard to replace as well as his reliability with the boot. Charnley and Smith can both kick but they're a bit more hit and miss than Richards. You've also lost a steady, reliable, experienced player in Hansen and I don't think Clubb or Bateman are at that standard.

Having said all of that, I think Pettybourne and Sarginson will be great additions to your squad; I was impressed with both on Friday. I can also see Flower having another big year and emerge as one of the top props in the league, as long as he curbs those late hits on little half-backs.



Overall I think your squad is slightly weaker than last year, largely down to losing Tomkins. However it'll still be strong enough to be in the top 4 and challenging for both trophies, which hopefully will be the case for Saints too.

No problem. Wouldn't really disagree with any of your points. I do think that Bateman and Clubb offer more than Hansen. But I know that quite a few Wigan fans disagree with me on that point. I thought that Smith was our best player on Friday and kicked well. Don't forget that when Pat Richards came he wasn't a regular place kicker. Whilst Matty doesn't have Pat's range he can be accurate, with practice. By the way, I'll bet that you hardly recognise Smith as the same player who played for Saints? i know the reasons for letting him go, which were sound at the time, and who knew that Eastmond was going to go? But Smith has emerged as a genuine talent, and also shows the value of good coaching. I also believe that players like Taylor, Crosby, Farrell, McIlorum, Charnely, Smith and Green have plenty of improvement in them and are far from the finished article.

How much we miss Sam will be the key issue. But in a way, by the time of the playoffs we had become far less reliant on him (he only scored one try in the last 3 months of the season - though he still made plenty).

As for Saints everyone agrees that they will have a better season, with many picking them for the LLS or better. My big question is - do you have the right coach? I think to draw a comaprison with Wane. When do you hear him complain about foul play? Never, because it sends the wrong messages to the team. It is just excuses. Wigan didn't win on Friday because of a late hit on Walsh. They won a tight game because in the end they were that bit better (IMO of course)

Agree with all of that.

I think the jury is still out when it comes to Brown, and that's probably the case for most Saints fans. I did have some sympathy for him last season because the injury list at times was ridiculous. I remember London away and Widnes at home in particular, I am sure we were in double figures for players missing. However he did also seem to tinker unnecessarily a few times as well. He is very impatient in terms of giving combinations time to develop, he chops and changes too hastily at times.

With regards to Smith, obviously with the benefit of hindsight it was a mistake letting him go. He is no world beater but he does exactly what is required of him. Good kicking game, good hands and can also spot a gap for himself now and then. I don't think he is what we need now we have Walsh, but over the last couple of years he would have been ideal. Obviously at the time we had Eastmond and he was looking like the best thing since sliced bread at one point. At the time nobody batted an eyelid at Smith leaving as we had Eastmond, so it'd be unfair to criticise the club too much on that decision.

You are right about the injuries. It also affected Royce Simmonds who got sacked after losing 4 games all without his best player (was that fair?). But again complaining about injuries is something Wane never does. Last season when, as you rightly say, you missed 10 players at one time, Wigan were leading the league after ten games having played the whole time with vitually a second choice pack. Wane sees it as an opportunity to play the youngsters and is always positive about ANY given situation. (As you can tell I'm a fan of SW!!!)

Haha, yeah I did get that impression!

The Saints pack will be good this year and Walsh will do the business.
Trouble is for Saints as I see it is that Turner is a centre and not a stand off. Whether they already have a 6 lined up for next year or not I don't know but to me Turner won't do it at 6 stand off. Walsh needs a better half back partner.
The two centres we saw in Percival and Jones are young and not ready to go and do a full season in one position in the first team. Swift is a good finisher and Makinson is a good player. I just wonder where the tinker man will swap his squad around from and too.

Saints need to stop bleating on about this and stop being spineless.

Nathan Brown needs to stop these outbursts and painting them in a bad light, man up Brown and get on with it, the game is being diluted enough with out your contribution.

And it's also been noted over on the Saints forum that their moderators and still acting like a bunch of little power mad school girls. Pathetic.

Thank you to everyone who has messaged me over the last few days on text and twitter. I am totally fine, I've been for a scan and have a fractured orbital which will heal over time. Who cares? It has until February to get better!!


Blake greens attitude after the grand final, chalk and cheese.

Quote ="Aboveusonlypie"My big question is - do you have the right coach? I think to draw a comaprison with Wane. When do you hear him complain about foul play? Never, because it sends the wrong messages to the team. '" Never you say? www.bbc.com/sport/0/rugby-league/18538370

Quote ="Aboveusonlypie"My big question is - do you have the right coach? I think to draw a comaprison with Wane. When do you hear him complain about foul play? Never, because it sends the wrong messages to the team. '" Never you say? www.bbc.com/sport/0/rugby-league/18538370

I am genuinely at a loss to see how a player's comment after the last game of the season is in any way relevant to a coach's comment after a pre-season friendly.