Why not offer him a four months contract next season - (July to October)?

My view is that it's still too early to offer him either. We need to go on a prolonged winning run - playing regularly at full capacity - before we can definitively say that we've turned that all-important corner.

Unfortunately, I'd imagine that if you're going to replace your head-coach with someone good, you start looking early. This doesn't mean to say that someone else is already coming, but the search may be on - which would certainly give IL a headache if Noble now proves that he's worth another deal. Though I suppose it would be a nice headache to have compared to other types I could name.

Agreed. His future is in his hands. Saturday is a huge test.

Why do people think 2010 will see some big transformation of the side player-wise? Now TL has been given a new deal there are not that many players out of contract at the end of 2009 who will be on a significant wage.

Bailey, Phelps, Smith and Carmont are the most senior players out of contract. That will not IMO give a huge wadge of cash to play with. The quota also goes down so I do not see what the significance of 2010 is.

The team won't change that much IMO and so given it is already "his" team as near as should make no difference (not that they odd player not being his signing should anyway) Noble needs to be judged at the end of this season at the latest because that is when his contract is up.

Otherwise it will always be "next" year when Fielden's contract is up or Feka's or Hansens etc.

Three and a half years is long enough to form an opinion based on his record if he deserves a new deal or we may end up with Cullen MkII.



Any coach from the top half of the NRL would be a prime candidate IMO. Getting one depends on if IL's persuasive powers are up to Mo's.

Dave

Im speculating, but Tommy & Bailey are supposed to be on huge ££££, I imagine Tommy has resigned for more realistic terms and Bailey/Coley going should free up the money to recruit the prop we are desperate for.

I would expect to see some movement in terms of a halves/hooker as we need to balance the playing roster in those positions.

The squad might not improve in terms of numbers etc, but the quality should spread a little further around which will improve us.

That depends on what sticking with him means. Another one year deal and another year of dross performances would IMO be too high a price to pay just because no one else was available. He would also have another contract IL would have to pay-up if things did not improve. Sometimes you just have to let people go and then search for a replacement.

There being no one else available better if the current employee is judged sub-standard is just about the worst reason I can think of for giving someone a new deal.

Dave

No one is saying keep him if he is substandard, but if we truely have turned a corner and the side are now developing the ability to play with the style we have for 3 weeks on a consistant basis, why would we remove Noble?

Cullen won nothing and is never likely to Noble has won everything and is very likely to again

We will have to wait and see but I doubt TL will have signed for peanuts being a world cup winning international. It may be less than before bug significantly so? I have my doubts.

As to Bailey he was hardly top drawer but of course he was a Mo signing so who knows.

I just don't think there is any radical change going to happen that should be an excuse to give Noble another year. His contract is up and so he should be judged on what will be the last 3 1/2 seasons come the end of the 2009 campaign.

Dave

Dave, I sometimes think you argue to convenience. How can you possibly say that the odd player makes no difference when you, yourself have argued the opposite on many occassions. Next season we are problably looking at 2 or possibly 3 new signings. Depending on who they are that could make the world of difference to this team! However I do agree with you that there is enough playing personel showing that they are of the right quality for Noble to be judged from here on in. Why do I say 'from here on in', in effect wiping out the poor start? Because I think it has taken the signing of Gleeson, plus the 'settling in' periods of Smith and Phelps, not to mention our front row finally starting to show they can match it with the rest of SL in order for us to start playing how Noble wants us to.

Im not suggesting Tommy will have resigned for peanuts though am i? It was announced Richards had resigned for less, I merely put the point across that Tommy is likely to have been offered a similar fair but more resonable deal.

Bailey I would suspect is over paid for the calibre of player he is given he was a Maurice signing.



There wont. But if the team can continue with its current form, and who knows, won a trophy, then he will rightly be judged on that and given a new contract.

This is key, the seaosn has really started now, its sink or swim time, Saturday is massive in relation to everything Noble is trying to do and everything IL expects.

Which is turn the club around from a miss managed club on a downward spiral to a club that has now good foundations and has been within 80mins of a Grand Final for the last 2 years and is very likely to win silverware or at least make a final this year. The team is starting to come together now and play the way he wants them to he deserves to get chance to finish the job he came to do and no doubt I.L. will give him the chance

He has won nothing at Wigan and if he fails to deliver this year any significant improvement he has more in common with Cullen than his own past record. Past success is no guarantee of future performance etc.

Dave

It takes time it is not and never was an overnight fix like so many others the club tried and failed in

Running the club is IL's job. Coaching the team is Noble's and Noble will rightly be judged on his success or failure on that score. So far the facts are we have gone backwards each year under Noble. Verifiable facts not opinion.

Two brief flurries in the playoffs mask two very poor league campaigns and they were a big reason why we only got within 80 minutes of a grand final and not to the final itself. We were spent from having to start from lower down the league. But this has already been said before and I thought was pretty much accepted as the accepted wisdom on his record. It is not what you are cracking it up to be by a long chalk.

When I pay what I do for season tickets two wins and a loss meaning an exit from the play-offs do not make up for the previous league seasons dross performances two years running.

Dave

We have?

Sorry I thought we came 3rd in the competition last year?

What exactly are these facts that you speak of?

3 1/2 years is the time he will have had by the end of this season. That is plenty of time. 3 1/2 years is not an overnight fix and one of Noble's biggest failings is his failure to get what on paper was a decent side to perform in 2007 and 2008. Please none of this "it wasn't his team" rubbish because that is no excuse and never was. God knows where it came from in the first place.

Dave

Ahh. Dave O treating his opinion as fact again.

You don't get it do you Dave O (or maybe you do, but are unwilling to admit it).

Superleague, in it's current form is nothing more than a few teams "Jockying for position" until the end of the season when a cup competition kicks in.

Now you may not like that, but that is the framework in which teams operate.


As many of us have said, form at this part of the season is relatively unimportant. It's form in September/October that matters.


If you don't like the rules, then write to Red Hall, but to criticise a coach for applying himself within those rules (and doing so very well), is illogical.

Frankly it suggests a level of intelligence much lower than I know you possess.

It came from common sense. Exactly the same thing happened over at Man U and no-one would argue Fergusson is a poor coach because he took a while to 'get his team together' before finally going on to win something. Don't forget he was o the verge of being sacked too when fans got impatient! I know hindsight is 20/20 but surely there is a lesson to be learned there given we have finally started to play the type of rugby we have all been crying out for! Let's see how we go from here and just give Nobby and the team our full backing as fans. We have our part to play too. If, as you say, it's a false dawn, then fair enough, but until or if that proves to be the case....

He truely cant win. We are now playing the rugby people want, but the fact is has taken the team time to gel into a new style isn't good enough.

I would love these people who throw around phrases like "sub par" & "unacceptable" to have a go themselves.

Now you are just taking the Micky the club was in a terrible state when he came and it was a 5 year plan that was put in place not a 1 year or even 3 year. Relegation fodder 1st year to 80 mins of the playoffs second and 3 year and i do believe we will make a final if not win something this year. As i see it if you don't like the way the team play for half of the year don't renew your season ticket until the half year deals come out. things needed fixing at the club and we are very close now to all the repair jobs being completed Tunnel vision is no good look at the big picture we are getting there.

You know very well what they are.

There are three records you can judge him by. His record in the playoffs, in the cup and in the league.

We finished the same position in the play offs in 2007 and 2008. So no change but no improvement either.

2008 we exited the cup earlier than in 2007. The means we went backwards in the cup competition. Or do you dispute that?

2008 we recorded fewer league wins than in 2007 so we went backwards yet again. We even ended up with a negative points difference in 2008 which was again worse than 2007. So we went backwards here as well.

So overall in the three competitions we have had no change in one and went backwards in the other two. Now you would have to be a pretty odd person to conclude anything other than we went backwards on that evidence. I am sure however you are poised at your keyboard to argue otherwise.

Dave

1. Playoffs - we came 3rd. With the imbalance in the squad that he inherited, it was probably the best we could have done.


2. Cup - 2 years isn't statistically significant. A sample size of 2 would be laughed out of any serious statistical analysis.

3. League - as I have said, is irrelevant.



Tell me why I am wrong.