I have been posting alot on the area of expansion and other related subjects and franchising and it got me thinking about Widnes.

I have posted many times on here saying Widnes are like a second team and I would love them in super league!

But can someone with more knowledge about the club, area, team, set-up ... etc explain to me just how much potential Widnes have for the future?

Detailed answers are very welcome.

Because of the ' extra ' heads you get round Widnes the ground allways looks fuller than it really is

Widnes is a rugby league town, we dont have a football team so the main focal point is the stadium and Widnes Vikings. Although only a small town we still generate gates that better a couple of current super league clubs. Runcorn also has a few Widnes fans who often nip over the bridge to watch the Vikings. Granted Runcorn have there own football team but a very poor one at that. The community department does a fantastic job in and around Halton and has now started to branch out to Knowsley and other areas where Rugby League might not be played. The community department has also worked in Frodsham and is believed to be targetting parts of Chester and North Wales. Liverpool is another market we can tap into but have competition from St Helens.


Potentially we could generate a healthy support given the chance back in Super League. We have never been as professional of the field as we are now.


We also have a good amateur setup in the town and rugby is covered from all ages.

What about crowds? Home average potential? Away support potential? Performance on the pitch? Financial benefit to the game? Can Widnes be a force?

Yes, the average gate last time we went down was around 6,800 and that was after a very poor season. We hit the 8,000 mark quite a few times for home games and have hit 9,500 against Saints at home so we all know the potential is there. The trouble is we have been a yo yo club and have never had a consitent run (something the license would help with)

Away support has always been decent, local derby games with saints/Wigan/Wire would bring healthy gates and we dont mind travelling to Yorkshire.



Stobarts play a big part in terms of generating jobs in Widnes and the surronding area and they do have some big projects in the pipeline for Widnes. The fact that we have a hugely sucessful business man in charge is also a massive help. That in itself is a problem though as it is for most clubs with a sugar daddy. He wants to make us a club that doesnt depend on money men, he wants the fans to run the club. This would IMO mean us averaging 10,000 gates something which with a lot of hard work we could achieve.

Of course we can be a force.

As far as attendances go, we were better than Quins, Huddersfield, Wakey and Salford, when in SL. In 2005, when we were relegated and playing terrible, we actually increased our attendances. With a good team, having some modest success, we would have been getting close to the magic 10,000 imo.

..............2002 2003 2004 2005
Widnes: 6510 6511 6153 6794

Wakey: 3889 4017 4806 5100

Salford: 4199 n/a 3996 4093

Quins: 3803 3546 3458 4003

Hudds: n/a 4722 4362 5853

All those other clubs have now increased their attendances. Some of them still can't get what we were getting through the gate in 2005 even now though. There is no doubt we would have also increased our attendances if we were still in SL. We'd probably be hovering around the top 6 best supported clubs in the game.

We have everything in place that is required to be a success; Stadium, some of the best player and training facilities in the sport, Youth development, large amateur catchment area, a tradition of producing some of the finest players to pull on an RL shirt, the best attendances in our division, great sponsors and a great backer.

We have the, largely, untapped areas of Cheshire, Sth Merseyside and North Wales to tap into, as well as having a borough including of Both Widnes and Runcorn with a combined population of 114,662. Halton borough council own 10% of the club and are helping the club promote themselves in all the schools in the borough. The people of both these towns own the stadium and also attend the games. It’s not just Widnesians who attend.

WTF more could anyone ask?

In your opinion.

But that would also be a team that is trying to bring youth through and not going for the quick fix of a load of old codgers to win things, in order to desperately make up for their obvious comparitive short-comings on every other area of their licence bid.

This is a good thread which doesnt need to be ruined by Halicrap.


Back on topic, i dont see what more we can possibly do for the next license application.

I've said it before but I think under SOC, TOC and PC we have 3 of the most forward thinking business/sports men in the game. Everything they're now working towards is about becoming more efficient on and off the field and planning and building for the long term.

We have an enviable youth set up which is starting to bare fruit with the likes of Flynn, Houghton, Yates and Grady expected to figure more next year. Add to that the step ups made by Strong, Thompson, Houghton, Hulme and Mullally we now have 8 homegrown youngsters making steady progress into the first team. These are players who we would hope can benefit from the next 2 years in the Championship and can carry us into Super League.

Envious rival fans bang on about us not owning our own stadium and berate us for playing in a council owned stadium but they cannot comprehend the fact that the council built that stadium for the purpose of fielding a professional rugby club. The town's council works very closely with the club and I cannot see it ever pulling the plug on the stadium for as long as there is a professional team in the town. The stadium speaks for itself given that it admirably played host to the Challenge Cup Semi Final between W********* Vs W***n.

After attending the fans forum last night I'm of the opinion that going bust 2 years ago was the best thing that ever happened to this club. Had that not happened we might not have the great team of forward thinking people that we have running the place now.

Now that the expansion loonies pipe dreams are dying a predictable death the time now should be focusing more on towns that are Rugby League through and through which can benefit the game at all levels. Widnes is one of those towns with the desire and the means to get back to the top. I'm not against expansion by any means but it should be spread from the heartlands outwards or at the very least be given time to develop organically.

It was stated last night that the club haven't rushed out to fill their squad with over the hill antipodean journeymen and have carefully considered what will benefit the club both in the short and the long term.

Breaks my bloody heart , but I tend to agree with my 6 fingered friend on pretty much all of this , bloody mutants

I'm a Wigan fan and I think exactly the same. The proof is in the pudding. What more to the RFL want. IMO they should realise they have cocked up and put you in next time round for sure. Widnes would be like another Hull KR, but even better with the quality facilities.

Thanks for all the feedback from all of you.

I am sure if you came back to super league you could be hitting 9,000 against saints, us and wire easily. With some success, even just finishing half way up the table, having not been in super league for so long your attendances would be around 7,000. How the RFL can say Wakey offer more to super league than you, I will never know!

What sort of away support would you be bringing to our place?

I think the most impressive attribute for Widnes is the fact they have kept the youth development going out of super league. Its nothing short of amazing. You add the stadium, attendances and all the rest of the potential, I really can see why you were all so upset when the franchise was announced.

A bit of a contrast really, we cheated to stay in super league, you have been cheated out of it.

[size=200WIDNES FOR SUPER LEAGUE[/size

Cheers mate.

Never said we were mates

It's great to see fans from both Wigan clubs agreeing in this way. Widnes really does bring the world together.

Cheaky b stard

Come on sing it with me.

"I'd like to teach Wigan to sing in perfect harmony"

You've been apart too long. Same kit, same area, you're even sharing managers now.

Also add to the fact, there were more people at the fans forum last night than there are Crusaders season ticket holders, says it all really.

Only because we lent them one way back when , I'd have let them play in ' skins '

How very homoerotic.

Move the club to France might be a good start

with the amount of times you made the trip last season, you should know Halifax like the back of your hand

I'll go as far as saying we are alot more professional than most Rugby League clubs. People complain about the club and some aspects of the way it is run but you can never win with these people. Since day one I've been impressed with Steve O'Connor. I don't know about other people but I get taken in by him when I see him on the media releases and the comments he makes in the press. He's a very passionate man about life and sport in general. Not forgetting what he brings to the table is something different in respect of his experience running a family business and then heading up a section in Stobarts. We've got all these Chairman who've came into their respective clubs as a follower of that club. SOC wasn't really an RL man, probably went the odd game when he was young, might be a blessing in disguise really as he makes decisions with the head rather than the heart.

He has been a breath of fresh for Widnes since he got involved and will be a great asset in Super League for the game as a whole. He's clearly a very succesful businessman, very astute in his selection of his staff and most of all realistic and level headed. We are very privilaged as a club to have someone such as Steve involved at Widnes and it's great that a local boy done good and is putting back something into the local community which is more that can be said of other successful businessmen.

So in short, it's not just what Widnes bring to the party it's the new ideas that our Chairman brings.



I like you. Pint of brown bitter for you squire