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| Quote ="wigan_knight"Got to agree
The coaching team have got a big decision in the next 12 months..sadly like you said i think its going to be phelps who makes way unless he could play 6 and tomkins 7 when deacon moves to his coaching role full time. i certainly believe Cam as the game to play stand off.. IMO OF COURSE.
maybe
Roberts
Richards
Carmont
Gleeson
Ainscough
Phelps
Tomkins'"
That is an absolutely awesome set of backs when you look at it! So much pace and a serious amount of attacking potential. I would actually be more than happy with that lineup as our backs. Tomkins has already shown he is learning little bits from Deacon so he could go towards replacing him.
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| The key for Ainscough is patience. He could sign a long term deal with a club like Cas to give immediate guarantees of first team rugby, but at what long term cost? All the signs are that Wigan can be a force in years to come, sooner rather than later, and he can be a part of that if he so desires.
As someone said though, he isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, so he needs good advice and reassurance. I said in an earlier post that some tough decisions are going to have to be made in the next 12 months as we appear to have an embarassment of riches and a young developing squad who will naturally expect greater rewards. We can't expect to hold onto them all give the restrictions of the salary cap.
Interesting times ahead, and much more fun than the rollercoaster of 2006. Watching Millward after the Leigh game on Thursday brought all the memories of that bleak period flooding back.
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| What you saw tonight was classic Ainscough.
3 good tries (I think it should have been 4) BUT the miss kick to let HKR back into the game and the wrong option when he kicked towards the posts instead of backing himself to go for the try.
Had Amos Roberts played for Cas they would have won the game.
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| If Ainscough is to be in the long term a Wigan player, I feel it's vital that both McGuire and Lenegan make him aware if it and keep making him aware of it. Not being nasty but the lads not the sharpest knife in the draw, and the promise of a regular spot by a rival club may be to much for him to resist, we must ward off the likes of Cas who will no doubt try and make his move permanent.
Sadly for Ainscough wing is a position that we not only have great depth in but the players in that position are in superb form, what the solution is to bringing Ainscough into the 17 each week is I don't know, but I'm fairly sure the lads going to want to be in the Wigan 17 each week from 2011 onwards, and if he isn't he may be forced to fly the nest at no fault of his own.
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| Quote ="LovesToSpooge"If Ainscough is to be in the long term a Wigan player, I feel it's vital that both McGuire and Lenegan make him aware if it and keep making him aware of it. Not being nasty but the lads not the sharpest knife in the draw, and the promise of a regular spot by a rival club may be to much for him to resist, we must ward off the likes of Cas who will no doubt try and make his move permanent.
.'"
to be fair to shaun i doubt its anything to do with his intelligence more the fact that its a short career, that for him could be potentially a great one, and as it is his club dont see him as a first team player. if you knew you could do the job but your boss wouldnt give you a chance and someone else offered you that chance what would you do?
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"What you saw tonight was classic Ainscough.
3 good tries (I think it should have been 4) BUT the miss kick to let HKR back into the game and the wrong option when he kicked towards the posts instead of backing himself to go for the try.
Had Amos Roberts played for Cas they would have won the game.'"
This is the exact same type of post that keeps popping up regards Ainscough.
The kid has just scored 3 very good tries against a very good team. Not only that but he’s had another disallowed and was by far the most dangerous winger/back on the pitch making excellent yards on most of his kick returns but yet there are sly digs going in against him?
I actually think his kick on the last play was the right option as well and if he’d gone for the corner I’m sure there would also be other out there calling him greedy.
Again his attack far out ways his occasional flaw in defence which some on here go way OTT about.
Show me another 20 year old winger who can do what he can
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| I like Ainscough but any decent winger would have scored those three tries.
The mistake from the kick was something I have seen for four years. I believe it was the wrong option when he should have taken the fullback on.
I'm more than happy for him to get those MINOR faults ironed out elsewhere.
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| Quote ="thepriestman85"This is the exact same type of post that keeps popping up regards Ainscough.
The kid has just scored 3 very good tries against a very good team. Not only that but he’s had another disallowed and was by far the most dangerous winger/back on the pitch making excellent yards on most of his kick returns but yet there are sly digs going in against him?
I actually think his kick on the last play was the right option as well and if he’d gone for the corner I’m sure there would also be other out there calling him greedy.
Again his attack far out ways his occasional flaw in defence which some on here go way OTT about.
Show me another 20 year old winger who can do what he can'"
What did rogues say that was wrong? I pretty much agree with everything he said tbh but this doesn't mean i don't think ainscough is a good winger.
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| id stick my neck out and say i see shaun in our first team before the end of this season. that could come through long term injury or loss of form, but if he has a good month at cas (maybe a bit longer, with the option for us to call him back at any time) then he will certainly be the next cab off the rank.
and as we have all seen in ainscough, when he gets his chance in the first team, he takes it (try's on his first start for wigan, widnes and cas) this next month will really help him to grow up. last season there was so much hype around him, and even when he was playing well got dropped. i think now he realises exactly what he has to improve on. last season will of hurt him, so when he gets his next chance he wont want to let it go. so he has to do everything to keep hold of it, which means improving his defence.
i thought that tonight his defence was top notch except for one thing, sadly, like a goal keeper in football, if your a winger and you mess up, it will cost a try. that doesnt mean that other wingers dont mess up. KR targeted him tonight, and he did really well.
in attack i thought he made all the right choices, especially the kick he put in, which if he was playing for wigan, i could see ending up as a try. the cas players didnt seem as alert in attack as they could have been. his kick returns were great.
great game from him, keep it up and it wont be long before he is playing for wigan.
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| 3 tries for cas should have 4 but for ganson.great attacking player but is defence is not the best. if he can improved his defence should be in warriors first team
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| Quote ="Grego"What did rogues say that was wrong? I pretty much agree with everything he said tbh but this doesn't mean i don't think ainscough is a good winger.'"
He didn't say anything which was wrong but imo too much emphasis is put on Ainscough’s occasional faults and in no way do they cancel out the excellent things he does in attack.
Although he never actually stated it I took his post to suggest it was Ainscough’s fault that cas lost based on the notion that he said if they had Roberts they would have won. Ainscough was no more to blame for the loss than any other Cas player and I’d suggest he did his bit for the team more than most out there.
Ainscough had a quality game tonight and I honestly think if it would have been anyone else not much if anything would have been made of his one defensive mistake.
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| This is a huge problem for Wigan - some may say it is a nice problem but a problem it is.
I have constantly championed Phelps on these forums - in my opinion he will be the top fullback in Super League in 1-2 years. I believe it would be a disasterous decision to release him.
That being said, the talent of Ainscough is clear to everyone and who from Super League would you swap for Richards or Roberts at the moment?
Quite frankly I don't want any of the four to go anywhere and I want all of them in the side. But this would seem impossible. The suggestion of Phelps at centre is a poor one - he is wasted there. Maybe a small possibility could be a move to halfback for Phelps but like many now I prefer Leuluai at 7, not 9.
I haven't a clue what the club will do about the situation over the next few years.
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| Roberts is a winger. Richards is a winger. Ainscough is a winger. Phelps is a full back.
Hence, if the coaching staff are convinced Aniscough needs to be given a starting shirt in the next year or two, it should be Richards or Roberts who loses out.
To release Phelps would be a mistake, unless we have someone to replace him at full back.
Richards' contract expires at the end of 2011, Roberts' at the end of 2012 and Aniscough's at the end of 2011.
So, one of the three is going to have accept they won't be playing first team rugby for almost two seasons, and one of the three is going to have to be released at the end of their current contracts.
If Ainscough isn't an option for relase (for the record, I'd say he is), then I'd suggest it would have to be Richards to go at the end of next season. Big call for the management.
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| Quote ="forestwood"3 tries for cas should have 4 but for ganson.great attacking player but is defence is not the best. if he can improved his defence should be in warriors first team'"
He should be in it anyway at the moment with Phelps out. The way some people go on about his defence you would think no one else in our team ever missed a tackle or was responsible for the opposition scoring.
His poor defence is nothing other than a bandwagon and one which I can't fathom why anyone wants to jump onto.
Goulding was nothing special on Friday in both defence and attack but he hasn't got a label hung round his neck in the same way Ainscough has.
I like both players but IMO the debate about Ainscough all started when certain Noble defenders had to look for an excuse to justify Noble dropping him and what I can't believe is now Noble has gone Ainscough's defence is still under a microscope that no other players defence is subjected to. It's ridiculous.
Dave
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| Quote ="Panda Antics"then I'd suggest it would have to be Richards to go at the end of next season.'"
Glad you aren't on our management. Richards will become a Wigan legend if he finished his career at Wigan.
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| Quote ="CAM."icon_lol.gif
Glad you aren't on our management. Richards will become a Wigan legend if he finished his career at Wigan.'"
That's my point. Richards isn't an option for relase.
I just don't see how Ainscough can get into the team for a few years yet.
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| Quote ="DaveO"He should be in it anyway at the moment with Phelps out. The way some people go on about his defence you would think no one else in our team ever missed a tackle or was responsible for the opposition scoring.
His poor defence is nothing other than a bandwagon and one which I can't fathom why anyone wants to jump onto.
'"
exacly, he should at least be in the squad to cover for the inevitable injuries that we will get, hes a proven try scorer no one can deny that
And at 20 years of age he could serve us for a good 10-14 years, most people around here seem to struggle with the long term future, they should remember that success is built on the long term, letting ainscough go would be hypocritical aswell as a blow to the club for the medium/long term.
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| Quote ="Panda Antics"That's my point. Richards isn't an option for relase.
I just don't see how Ainscough can get into the team for a few years yet.'"
Releasing Richards may sound totally daft but he will be another year older come 2011 and will be 29 (I think). Roberts will be 32. So do we keep wingers of that vintage in favour of a Ainscough who will be 21 in 2011? How long a contract would you give Richards for 2012? A couple of years? If that meant losing Ainscough for the next 8 would you do it?
We went through a period of releasing players of around that age regardless of form when were on top of the pile in the 80's and 90's and NRL clubs do it all the time. Senior pros still performing very well are moved on in the NRL in favour of the young prospect coming up.
It's not just as simple as look at how well a player went in the season but you have to consider quota spots, salary cap and age.
Dave
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| By sending Ainscough out on loan, Michael Maguire is the second coach in a row to decide that he isn't ready for the Wigan first team.
I find it difficult to believe that he has the same unreasonable downer on Ainscough that Noble supposedly had.
Maybe there's something at the root of this, which we don't notice when all we see of Ainscough are his heroics on Sky TV.
Could it be an attitude problem? I don't know, but perhaps the time has come when we should trust the coaching staff's judgement. They are much closer to Ainscough than almost anyone on this board will ever be.
For what it's worth, I don't think Ainscough making comments on TV about not liking being sent out on loan, or even giving that impression, will help his cause one little bit. I get the feeling that Maguire runs a tight ship, and prefers people who are on message.
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| Quote ="shambawangy"And at 20 years of age he could serve us for a good 10-14 years, most people around here seem to struggle with the long term future, they should remember that success is built on the long term, letting ainscough go would be hypocritical aswell as a blow to the club for the medium/long term.'"
This is the point I was trying to make with my previous post. At the end of his current deal Pat hasn't got a lot of years left in him. Ainscough has.
Dave
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| Quote ="Cruncher"By sending Ainscough out on loan, Michael Maguire is the second coach in a row to decide that he isn't ready for the Wigan first team.
I find it difficult to believe that he has the same unreasonable downer on Ainscough that Noble supposedly had.
Maybe there's something at the root of this, which we don't notice when all we see of Ainscough are his heroics on Sky TV.
Could it be an attitude problem? I don't know, but perhaps the time has come when we should trust the coaching staff's judgement. They are much closer to Ainscough than almost anyone on this board will ever be.
For what it's worth, I don't think Ainscough making comments on TV about not liking being sent out on loan, or even giving that impression, will help his cause one little bit. I get the feeling that Maguire runs a tight ship, and prefers people who are on message.'"
He's just scored a hat trick (again) so you can't find fault there so lets [umake something up[/u about an attitude problem. Unbelievable.
Dave
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| Quote ="DaveO"He's just scored a hat trick (again) so you can't find fault there so lets [umake something up[/u about an attitude problem. Unbelievable.
Dave'"
So what's your explanation?
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| The truth is Ainscough as an [iall round[/i winger is not as good as Richards or Roberts.
He is an awesome talent and the coaching staff have recognised he needs to be playing the highest level he can in order to iron out a few minor issues in his game. I have no doubt when the time is right providing he irons out the few problems in his game and has the right attitude Ainscough will be a Wigan winger week in week out.
Until this time comes I think we have the perfect situation with all wingers getting game time at SL level.
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| I am stunned at this. I remember Robinson getting slammed for his weakness' I remember him losing us 2 or 3 games with errors under kick pressure.
Thank god he was not judged the same way Ainscough is being at the moment.
Stunning.
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| Quote ="jonh"I am stunned at this. I remember Robinson getting slammed for his weakness' I remember him losing us 2 or 3 games with errors under kick pressure.
Thank god he was not judged the same way Ainscough is being at the moment.
Stunning.'"
Exactly. There must be some reason why he's being sent elsewhere.
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