And didnt Bradford go ' bust ' in SL before relegation ?

They bring opposition to other teams. If they went bust who would replace them? Barrow and their 16 fans which would result in you posting “what do barrow bring, would we miss them if they vanished?” What do you want? A league with saints, Leeds, Wigan and hull kr? How long would that last without the sky money.

Stop being an Imbecile

Haven’t they gone bust since though a couple of times

Yeah the point I was sort of making is although we all want promotion and relegation it doesn’t help the clubs as all have had serious problems like I said we recovered because our owners stuck by us and the fans bought into it and we went straight back up luckily but I still remember the 90s when we were a right state and the BBC did a documentary on us we came close on a number of occasions of going under and seemed to be in administration all the time

No, twice whilst in SL and once while in the Championship

Yeah and during the licencing period no club went bust or
got into serious financial difficulties. P&R is a complete red herring.

12,700....that was the 2018 average of Cronulla Sharks......in the imaginary Rugby League heaven that is Sydney.......do one bazza.... 2016 champions and out-drawn my the friggin Melourne Storm...

Widnes benefitted massively from licensing. It gave them the opportunity to build steadily and get their youth systems going without having to worry about the immediate threat of relegation.

The middle 8’s were done away with because they dragged too many clubs into a relegation fight. Leeds being a perfect example last year. Leeds were making short term decisions and signings to try and safeguard against the disaster of being relegated instead of putting that money to better use for medium and long term growth. Leeds is big and healthy enough financially they can withstand that. Most RL clubs would be seriously affected by it.

You’re going to get clubs who are daft and overspend. In my opinion licensing significantly reduced the need for that and so provided much needed stability and surety for clubs to grow. P&R doesn’t provide that, however is better than the middle 8’s as it only drags 1,2 or 3 clubs into a relegation fight rather than 4, 5 or 6.

Don’t get me wrong I want P&R the problem is the sport isn’t cash rich so when a club does get relegated because of the massive gulf between SL and the championship money wise you end up having to do what Leigh have done and gone part time to survive

Not necessarily go part time, that would depend on how deep a particular clubs pockets are.
KR coped very well and came back stronger.

Leigh have had to go part time due to failing to gain promotion and failing to make the top 4, which leaves you with little cash to spend on players.

It looks like Widnes are in for a torrid time but, relegation itself doesnt mean going part time.

If you get the chance go to Perpignan to see the Dragons. No, they don't speak the same language but they are as passionate and as traditonal as League fans get, anywhere. OK I',m fortunate that I speak reasonable French but I've taken non-speaking friends with me and they love the atmosphere, too.

'[iEver[/i' is a very long time. London had several periods ( right at the start, and at the beginning of SL, for instance ) when they were regularly getting 7, 8, 9,000 at home. Salford in the 1970s got even more, and at a time when even Leeds struggled to get 10k per home match. Besides, things change. In that same 1970s period my team, Warrington, probably averaged 5k. Now they average over 10k. [iWould we have missed them if they had vanished back then?[/i

I did point out why we survived and going straight back up was a big part of that Leigh would have probably been ok if they’d gone straight back up they didn’t and had to adjust Toronto not getting promoted was probably the worse thing that could have happened to Widnes meaning they knew more than likely have to spend at least 2 seasons in the championship

You have to remember that for many so called RL fans, the sport didn't exist before 1995 and the history and heritage of the game are irrelevant.







The bottom line for our game is serious lack of money / investment has left it is a perilous state and with far too many clubs already gasping for air, it doesn't take too much to tip them off the edge of the cliff.

Some believe our future lays in N.America and whilst Toronto have done extremely well to generate the level of interest that they have done. Lets just imagine if we put 12 clubs in major cities, all able to generate 12,000 fans every week but, without any foundation to them.
Where on earth will the players come from ?
Would these clubs be little more than parasites, feeding on second rate Australian players and what the hell happens to all of the kid's in the north of England who enjoy the game.
Without something to aspire to, the sport would further diminish at amateur level and the game would become extinct.
We could go for a Kerry Packer style superstars touring the globe and making decent TV money but, without roots, everything eventually dies and if we are not really careful, our precious sport if heading for oblivion.
Yes, we need some "glamour" to attract youngsters into the sport but, if we fail to engage with the youth, we have nothing.

News coming out of Widnes from Gareth Walker on Twitter:

Insolvency company O'Hara's are hosting a press conference with performance director Phil Finney. Peter O'Hara says: "The club has simply run out of money. We have secured the wages for this month but other than that there are no funds whatsoever. We’re not here to asset strip in any shape or form, but there may well be an instance where players have to be sold. We want to keep that to a minimum but that has to be an option."

Insurance remains the reason for Widnes not being able to play at the moment, and unless investors come forward that will not change. The upcoming Super League parachute payment may not be released to the club as well.

Another previously class team hits the black spot of Administration.

To all Widnes fans, batton down the hatches and hold tight, this will be a bumpy ride. But like the others before you lets hope you get through this and manage to rebuild.

Regardless of what some teenagers or drunkards on here might state, losing any club is bad for the sport in general.

During licencing we have the same 4 or five teams at the top and the same three propping the league up and the same couple of teams in the championship banjo'ing everyone every week with no where to go from it. Licencing IMO actually weakened the Leagues. It allowed below par teams to stay in a leage they were not suitable for recieving Sky money that could have been gained from a championship team.

Our owner Derek Beaumont is keeping his 'hands in his pockets' for this season, but don't rule him out, coming back and deciding to 'go for it' once Toronto are out of the championship. With Widnes currently 'in the poop' then next season, the championship will be very exciting, and one of 5 or 6 clubs could gain promotion.

You may be right about Toronto gaining promotion but, I hope not.
Also worth remembering there will be another (relegated) SL side that comes into the mix, so it will still be a tough ask (unless they too, "do a Widnes"icon_wink.gif.
As far as the Championship goes this season, it's a real sham that both Fev and Leigh, after finishing outside the top 4, couldn't compete.
Certainly with a strong Fev and Leigh, plus Toronto, Toulouse and Widnes, it could have been a really competitive league.
Sadly, this wasn't to be and with Widnes implosion, it looks like Toronto all the way, almost like the last stage on the Tour De France, when nobody can challenge the leader.
Once again funding (or lack of it) has killed the competition.

You may also have to throw York and Bradford into the mx for next season. Certainly Bradford will be stronger and you would expect pushing for promotion.

So in your view history (both older and more recent) counts for nothing...sad.

Widnes were one of the founders of RL IIRC and won the league (and World Club Challenge) in the late 80s as well as being multiple winners of the CC in the late 70s- early 80s. My first trip to Wembley was the 1993 CC final to watch Widnes play Wigan.

More than just the wins though, it is also about the some of the players and coaches. Just look at some of the players that came through Widnes - Alan Tait, Martin Offiah, Jonathan Davies, Andy Gregory, Joe Lydon, the various Mylers and Hulmes. Some great names!

RL existed long before Super League!

May as well talk to the wall, a lot on here have no clue about pre SL.

It is a sad day when a club like Widnes has to go into administration. I for one hope James Rule never gets his mits on a rugby league, or any business for that matter, again.

I believe O'Hara was the administrator for Trinity, he sold our best players at the time.

He’s talked a lot about this being an option already, the same will happen.

And as for whoever’s comment about teams like us playing in front of a man and his dog, twice we were bottom of the league and twice we brought 2500-3000 fans all the way up to Newcastle. I’d like to think we brought something to superleague, even if it was a good away support every now and then.

We’ll bounce back, I couldn’t imagine Widnes without a main rugby league team.

He made a speech as well when he left about how he’s left the club in a good position and signed a good squad to compete in the championship