I reckon McManus will want a few answers on his return, he already mentioned in the programme he has a tolerance point on personnel attitude and effort, how much of this is to pacify the supporters we will soon know.

For me I would forget about a top 8 finish this year and start giving our younger players stable fixed positions ready for the next season. If that means losing every game from now on then so be it.

I would drop La Franc, Lance, TP, Howarth, O,Brien, our conditioner and coach cannot be taken into 2014. We should be looking at our playing structure, tactics, game plans, conditioning schedules from 2000 to 2006 and try to emulate them. Obviously we don,t have the players of quality to give the same effect, but at least it would be better than this fragmented, confusing load of rubbish we are having to endure week in week out.

We don't need to emulate the great saints team as its totally different team even with the total difference in ability of the players. We need this team to play the way that suits the players we have, it needs to find its own identity, work on things that work for this team and not what teams of years gone by did.

The balance needs sorting for a start and we need to keep players in their positions and stop moving them about.

I was strangely enthusiastic before last night, safe to say that was soon burst like a balloon. I knew it wasn't our night from that first KR try (looked a bit baffling) and our attack was shocking, we put the ball down far too often and Eden's try was too easy. The lads looked way too scared of Paterson.

Don,t think this will work though we need a good team structure and game plan. Playing the way that suits the players hasn,t worked we have ended up with lots of individual players doing there own thing with lots of one man rugby and unintelligent play. I don,t think the team needs to find its own identity, its already in the Saints DNA, but we seem to be hell bent on changing it. We tried a similar thing in 1982 and that didn,t work either.
Look at Warrington, Smith was a great admirer of the Saints Way of play and to a certain extent has emulated it with great attacking plays very similar to how we use to be, add the right attitude and that is a recipe for a successful side.
We have lost all stability and approach to how the game should be played, 5 years of experimentation trying to fit square pegs in round holes is enough.

I get what your saying and agree but this team can not play expansive rugby, its not good enough.

Tony smith is blessed to have a chairmen that has ambition and will back him with transfers.

Wasn't that the one where he awarded Hull KR a penalty for offside and not a drop out. He awarded the penalty and then Dobson politely reminded the referee that we'd crossed the line for a try??

Does Stirlingshire Saints ever frequent these boards anymore? Think I asked the same question last time after the cup game, he famously said everytime HKR would beat Saints he would bare his Iestyn 'Arris' on the town hall steps.

Can't beat characters like that.

16-8 penalty count too, unbelievable.

Something like that, I don't know what he was doing but certainly changed his decision.

But I think to a certain extent we could improve it quite easily. Our attack is flat as a pancake most of the time which means a defence with good line speed is in our faces after 2 passes. Our ruck speed is probably the slowest in the league due to our attitude of surrendering at the tackle giving the defence lots of time to get set.

Our support play is atrocious, don,t know if this is the problem of lazy attitude or inability to read the game but we have plenty of players who create half breaks in Roby, Wilkin, Walmsley, Manu, Soliola with no backs to follow up an offload, this happens quite a lot in most games.

We,ve had a couple of games were we have solved the above problems but can,t mentally sustain it for more than 40 mins in a game.

Until we get the right structures and game plans of some sort we will not be able to control a game, I remember Daniel Anderson critical of the team when we went away from his game plan for a 5 minutes out of the 80 mins Times have changed we only have a game plan for 5 mins out of the 80 mins.

I've already made that call and it saddens me as I've been a season ticket holder for a long time, we've been pretty terrible to watch since Potter took over (we were a bit easier on the eye for some of Simmons time) and I just dont enjoy the games enough to justify the outlay. I'll just be picking and choosing my games next year based on how the money is, how the weather is and if we have a team that look like they can be d.

I was only 3 year old in 82 so I dont remember it but I see were your coming from. I used to turn up watching saints in the 80's and early 90's not expecting a win but always hopeful of one and one way or another we normally put on a show .

I used to be in a minority at school in Ashton , it was dominated by goon fans but even though they were successful I was never jealous or regretted my decision to be a Saints fan rather than choosing the dark side because I always saw Wigan (I saw them lots as I used to get free tickets) as more of a machine , very methodical , very precise , steamrollering sides full of part timers .. all that and somehow dull where as Saints were like the Brazil of Rugby (brilliant or terrible) to Wigan's Germany ...

It may be my memory but I always seem to remember us having a flair about us that coaches like say Potter just could never grasp. I wonder if Brown can?

Jeez, giving up season tickets after a poor year. I seem to remember the threat of relegation, and them being really bad, bringing Wigan fans together to support the team and us mocking them for it...

I'm thinking of not renewing because I'm not enjoying it anymore and not because we are losing. I'm bored stiff every week.

Its not the losing but the lack of attitude and pride in the shirt which I don't like. I just don't know how long I can keep watching the bore fest with a bunch of over paid half hearted team.

Its got to the point that I enjoy watching the kids rugby at halftime more than the actual game.

Yeah he will probably offer them all new deals.

The problem is this as I see it. I will watch Saints home and away I went to the Salford home game a week after coming out of Hospital following pretty major surgery, just because I am daft and I love the club and the game. I am one of the many perhaps six thousand who will always go. I bought my wife and daughter season tickets for the family stand when Langtree opened, my daughter has had the fantastic mascot package with Robes and it is a fantastic deal. However they are now just getting a touch cheesed off with the season as they see it "always seems cold Saints are awful only Lomax and Robes any good" I want to renew for them but your floaters need more than they are getting that is a fact. I believe the club are forming a fans group, but you know some of those will be internet warriors who don't even go they just support Hattons Solicitors!

Ditto. As I said before if I was interested in only winning when I started watching Rugby as a kid I've have supported the goons.

And thank God you didn't. One DaveO is enough on our board.

I don't think people saying they are going to ditch the season ticket is the same as ditching Saints.

People will still go.

I posted about Saints 6 games in that I won,t be re newing my season ticket because of the difficulty of associating with this Imposteral Saints Team.
Its now 20 games in and the situation is much worse, there is a state of apprehension walking up to the ticket turnstiles in what team is going to be selected, what effort they are going to put in, how boring is it going to be.
There is very little atmosphere now from Langtree Park any noise is coming from the confident away fans.
If this team carries on the way it is and they brought in relegation for 2014. This team would be under enormous pressure to avoid it based on what we have been offered so far.

I don't think throughout the game I even heard the saints fans chant, which I don't think helps the team at all. We were very vocal Friday night which always gives the team that extra boost. I would say there were about 500 of us compared to your 10,000 and maybe if you got behind your young team they would give a bit more effort. Not that, that is an excuse. As a HKR fan I know what your going through. Best of luck for the rest of the season.

Well, us in the West Stand were singing and chanting to start with. However, that pretty much stopped the moment Manu (I think it was) knocked on near the posts on about the second play of the match. Somehow we probably all knew what was about to happen ...

Away fans tend to be more vocal. It's the nature of the beast.

it's difficult to muster up atmosphere when your team is going through the motions (badly) and giving you nothing to get behind. The lack of cladding and unfilled corners also doesnt help the atmosphere. It might be shiny and new but LP is still a bit soul less for me.

I was noisy I was booing like bloody hell at the end. But I also wished a few of our East Hull friends a safe journey home. It really is strange how so many of them have six fingers on each hand decent eggs though only a tiny minority spoil them.

Get back watching Leigh Loz, 5k contracts and winning pay

Maurice. I have a great affinity with the Leigh club a great second team to have to follow. I wish them all the best in their quest to get into the closed shop that is SL and feel annoyed I will be at a ground this Sunday that looks like a scene from Kes when you have the real deal at LSV. Well done on reaching the NR final