If this were RL we'd be bleating on about it being 'more bad press for the game' when in reality, nobody outside of the game really gives a toss.

Or Wuggah buggahs?

Do we know who won the subsequent duel?

Windsor born Chris Cracknell is an old boy of Shiplake College, a boarding school set in 45 acres of private parkland in Henley on Thames.

Collins is an old boy of another boarding school - Swinford Hospital - reputedly designed by Sir Christopher Wren and with a history dating back to the 1600s, it has produced a number of top sportsmen. All of them rugby union players.

Pip, pip.

Is it time for Burrow to take on Baileys dad yet?

Talking of the kick and clap brigade... I see one of them has crated a video blog! www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKFjWR7X5dU

Talking of the kick and clap brigade... I see one of them has crated a video blog! www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKFjWR7X5dU

So it seems the "toffs" stereotype was spot on.

I'd prefer not stereotyping people, but hey that's not gonna happen here is it?

I'm sure Luther Burrell, product of that fine educational establishment Huddersfield New College fits the toff description perfectly - no, really.

I often find stereotypes to be alarmingly accurate.

Careful. You're mighty close to stereotyping other posters on RLFANS with that remark.

Pick that bottom lip up and stop stamping your feet.



Might it be pertinent to point out that Luther Burrell wasn't fighting nor referred to as a toff...only the 2 public schoolboys that were engaging in fisticuffs were labeled such?

It would, if the report the OP linked to had made any reference to the background of the two players involved. For all the OP knew, they could both have been educated at the local comprehensive.

A poor attempt at revisionism.

Pure supposition. How do you know what the OP knew of the players' backgrounds?

He said they were toffs, and toffs they have been shown to be.

Mind you, by my reckoning at least 15 of the 26 English players in the Worcester squad were privately educated.

Of the remaining 11, 2 were definitely state educated, the remainder either have no profile information or have had careers long and prestigious enough that their schools are no longer relevant enough to mention. My guess would be that around 20 would be in total.

Aside from rugby union convert Ewan Dowes, can anyone think of any privately educated RL players? I'm sure there must have been some.

"Private" as in a posh fee-paying school or "Private" as in "home educated due to their schools exclusion policies" ???

Yes, that could make quite a difference as distinctions go.

Lets go with the former.

State schools don't tend to offer rugby as an option. We have trouble finding players because non of our local schools do it and the kids all play football because all you need is ball and some "jumpers for goalposts". All the private schools in the area offer rugby (in fact often insist).

Liam Botham?

Where did you get this information?

I notice that a lot of the Union clubs have a lot of information about player's backgrounds, mostly schools attended. I also notice that virtually none of those schools were comprehensives.

Two things, doesn't this show the "toffs" stereotype to be fairly accurate and why is the private school attended so important to these people?

Retired, but a good call all the same. Another union convert.

Botham and Dowes only serving, of course, as privately educated Unions boys, to further the stereotype.

It seems to work both ways.

The club website is keen to mention which fee paying school player 'x' attended as some sort of brand of quality. The Royal Grammar School in Worcester is a club sponsor and a number of the schools mentioned make specific refernce to 'rugby' being an important part of their curriculum and culture, though it doesn't mention which code of course...

It wouldn't be unreasonable to assume there is a shared social 'character' between rugby union and fee paying education, particularly public schools.

EDIT - the info was from the club website and the wikipedia entries for the players. Quite a few players had no content on the club site or a 2 line entry in Wikipedia but its also worth noting that on a number of Wiki entries the school was given as a heading with equal 'weighting' to 'age', 'nationality' etc seeming to show that a private education is something that supporters also feel is an important indicator of quality.

You're right, it's part of the players history. Certain schools have often been seen as important for progressing to club rugby. It was really important before professionalism, now clubs don't give a t0$$ as long the guy can play. I
Sadly infrastructure of RU at junior levels will always be baised towards private schools because that's where all the administrators come from.

I do also think you have to accept that if state schools don't offer it to pupils then kids probably won't play the game. I also think you have to accept that many top RU players outside the UK will not have gone to private school in their own countries (only the white ones probably).

Just looked up "toff" for a definition. Came up with



PS, nob was genuinely there



As both players were educated at a fee paying school I think the definition fits perfectly and the original poster is owed an apology from Mr Gilder as are those of us accused of stereotyping.