That may well be true (for the moment) but I dont think he (Buderus) could do 80 mins week in week out.

I don't think you get much inaccurate with your post Rob, and I think you put it really well, but I do dissagree with your view and still think there is a touch of sentimality behind it. I am pretty convinced, but perfectly open to be shot down on it, that If it was another player in Diskins boots with the exact same playing ability but without the GF winners rings, that you would not hold the same view you do now.

I think you are quite right to question those calling for a 2 year contract for Buderus. But equally I think it would be insane to give Diskin a 2 year contract. If we went with both again for next year, then neither should be given more than 1 year. Both are aged performers and reaching the end of their careers, however one of them is still better than the other ever was.

And whilst I fully understand those defending Diskin to the hilt, and admire the loyalty that the players past deserves, I still can't see how non of you see how in recent matches the team looks far superior with Buderus on the pitch than it does with Diskin on it. It's not as if it is just one or two matches now, it is happening every week now Buderus is playing regularly.

For me it's simply a case of the team comes before individuals. All players will hit an end sometime, no matter how good they are. Sign of good club management is planning for that, and making sure it does not effect the team as it happens. Fans views in that respect should be taken with a pinch of salt.

One thing i think people are over-looking re- Buderus/Disko is at what point in the games they are both on the pitch and who they have to play off and their respective game times.
For instance there are times when Buderus has come off the bench at the 1st set of interchanges when the opposition are naturally slower around the ruck and the major impact of their forwards or the "sting" has been somewhat reduced.
There are also times when Buderus has started and we have taken a good 10/15 minutes to get going whilst the relative packs are battling it out and vice versa for Disko.
At certain times in games the opposition are gonna be on top and have momentum and i think too many people jump in and say thats diskos fault.
A 9 can only play off the platform his pack set and when you look at the wakey game in particular when Buderus returned he was playing off Peacock and Kylie who were imo battering the Wakey pack.
Whereas when he started we were way too slow and behind.
THere's no doubt that Buderus is quality and his vision and distribution is better than Diskos but there are diffrent points in each game when they are playing and the bigger picture i.e momentum,who they are playing off and how well we are playing as a unit need to be considered.
That doesn't mean that Diskin is finished at Leeds nor that Buderus could go the full 80 week in week out and we should ditch Disko.
I personally think it would be a mistake to ditch Disko for an extra yr with Buderus and if he is to stay then we should look to get Mcshane a yr on loan to a SL club ala BjB and retain Diskin also.
You can call it sentiment if you want but i honestly think the bigger picture needs to be considered and Disko should be part of that bigger picture.

And you base that thought on what? His age.....fitness level....desire to compete? Sure, his best days are behind him, but even today he brings more to the table and I suspect that is the reason Bluey continues with the two hooker set up.

Bluey's task is simply to make the best use of the resources available to him, and like all good managers he will have assessed his department and planned accordingly. As a successful coach, I reckon he will have reached the conclusion that to spell Buderus in a match with Disco is the better option, both to extend his career and hit his target of winning another GF. Success, not sentimentallity keeps you in a job.

We have young McShane eager for game time and experience, and if we're to continue with the 2 hooker plan, then for my money next season has to be a Buderus/McShane combo. Disco is too slow and error prone nowadays. His distribution at the PTB is usually a simple lob of the ball from a standing position, and his one trick is the occasional trundle forward in an attempt to get a penalty. His defence is generally good, but sadly for both the guy and ourselves, its a long way from his out standing performances in 2004.

See how stupid it sounds when you translate what you're saying? I'm sure coaches all around SL will be queueing up to take your advice.

Obviously I agree with the likes of "Serge", "LS14 Rhino", "Gotcha" and "BillyRhino" (sorry don't know your real names guys ...and wouldn't presume to use them without asking first anyways).....but all I would ask of the dissenters is that we have an intelligent debate (thank you "Puig-Albert" and "Rhinoms"icon_wink.gif.

However, I still see blinkered sentiment prevailing in those who champion the inferior talent. You're only human I guess.



Normally I am happy to simply read these exchanges and not get embroiled (my wife's continued chagrin in me getting involved in such "unimportant drivel" not least deters me. Lol

)
....however this particular topic has stirred me enough to do so.

Week after week I see our club/coach/supporters persist in a train of thought which is contrary to all of the mounting evidence that stacks up against the persistent folly.
As I persist in exclaiming, I sadly do see it one day soon biting us in the proverbial ass and it losing us a critical crucial match (maybe even at Wembley or OT). Can we continue to take that risk ?

Two years might be too much of a gamble for Buderus;it [icertainly[/i is for Diskin. I agree an extra one year for Buderus (if he will agree to it of course) and McShane given more game time. Let Diskin go.

Two totally different hookers and both have positives. I just think that a lot of people on here often underestimate the work that Diskin does. He is far more effective IMO than a lot give him credit for.

Quote ="darwoo11"Two totally different hookers and both have positives. I just think that a lot of people on here often underestimate the work that Diskin does. He is far more effective IMO than a lot give him credit for.'"

Sorry Darwoo, but that appears to me to be just a 'soundbite' without any foundation. How do you define [i"the work that Diskin does"[/i. How do you exactly quantify that ??

If I went to my MD and said the same of one of our employees ...he would quite rightfully ask give me evidence and specifics.

Childish insults seem to be all that the pro disco advocates have to offer.




I think we really need to have some form of financial penalty when any one comes out with the "4 times Grand Final winning rings" nonsense, with perhaps a donation via the site to a local charity.


And perhaps DHM could offer up a convincing explanation of how past performances trump current form?

And still the clowns debate Diskin in the same ballpark as Buderus (an Australian International and SOO first name on the teamsheet player!!), funniest thing I have ever seen in all my time reading views on RL.

Open your eyes for a bloody change and make a reasonably informed decision, Diskin was bloody shocking if Friday and this has reached reasonable consistency, his pace and distribution have almost reached fossil status.

He shouldn't be anywhere near the 17 and those saying Buderus cant do 80 mins clearly need to take a look over his career, he has always been a 80mins Number 9.

3/10 titch.

The three being for effort.

Ok, when Bailey, Ali, Burrow, Burgess are fit does Diskin get near the 17?

A slow 9 who can do a bit in the 2nd row? Seriously, come on Rob, really?

Buderus speeds us up when he's on, Diskin slows us down, massively at times and we lose the momentum when he enters the field. Against Wakey we went 12-0 down but then got on the front foot and got it back to 12-12. Enter Diskin, threw a couple of passes and then had a scoot from DH where he knocked on, Wakey got the ball back and Disko's first tackle he gave a penalty away, harsh call as King had a hold of Disko's arm but still a penalty was conceded and Wakey went 14-12 up.
The point is momentum changes when he comes on and it affects us week in week out.
Buderus speeds us up which makes us more threatening in attack, he's a better defender and i'd say he's one of if not the best defender we've got. When we need momentum he puts Buderus back on, not Diskin.
Maybe the reason Bluey plays Diskin every week is because he doesn't want to upset team spirit etc, because he hasn't been earning his place recently. If that is the case then just limit his minutes or play him at LF so Buderus can play 65-70 minutes and dont renew his contract.

Lets just get it sorted one way or another. The least disruption it causes the better.

Sorry. I can't even give you any marks for effort there Titch.

Thick know nowt fekkwitts like the Magic Wand like shiny things. Big shiny expensive Aussie imports.

Lots of our fekkwitt fans are the same.

Matters nowt that they've won fekk all with us. They still like them more than winners.

Its around this time that they start listing big shiny aussie imports that should definitely, absolutely, take-my-word-for-it-I'm-right, be in the CEO shopping list for next season isn't it ?

By the time August comes around they're almost hysterical with rage that no-one took their advice though.

Come November they'll be burning season tickets again.

Nice avoidance of question, I take it you know the answer but cant face typing it.

Just so we get a balanced debate like we have seen for the last few days, rather than the childish outbursts of certain posters.

As anybody at all on this thread said anything about making a new signing?

Wrong, I like to see players who have mastered their art, I like to see players who make the admission money seem that little bit more value for money.

I think what you are failing to see is the actual point that people are trying to make, with Diskin (who has been a great servant to Leeds), it is becoming increasingly noticeable that his game is too slow for the modern game, at times it is almost painful to watch - professional sport isn't about sentimentality, with Diskin this seems to be the foundation for your blindness to the blatantly obvious.

Oh dear.

So Buderus is too good for the team and Diskin is not good enough for the team, why don't we sack both.

???

Who said anything about turning any one down? I don't even know what question you are trying to fumble your way through here.

I would welcome Billy Slater with open arms I just wouldn't say silly things like he's too good for the team.

You think that's an insult? You're weak.