Must be a new record? We really are the new chokers on the block. Three of those games were lost before half time and the other one we really never looked like winning.

Hopefully some good will come from this (i.e. a public announcement this week that Noble won't be coach next year), in the same way Mo's departure was secured and announced days after the Catalan defeat.

I think today again confirmed for a lot of people that we need a new halfback and some new props if we want to be considered as serious contenders for trophies. I really hope the sandwich business in Keighley picks up by the end of 2010 because I don't see any club wanting to touch Fielden with a barge pole, and as I've said before WTF does Mick Forshaw actually do, becuase he certainly doesn't seem to be conditioning Feka.

I like Lenagan and think he is the man to take us forward long term, but he has so far failed on the two major issues that have been on most people's radar for the majority of the season:

1. Sorting out the coaching situation. If what he says is true and I have no reason to doubt him, we're still fecking about with it and even considering a year extension for Noble - hopefully today proved that Noble can't take us to the next level. We desperately need an experienced NRL coach and Lenagan will need to put his hand in his pocket to get one. You only have to look at what has happened to the last two clubs who have taken on coaches who have only coached in the NRL. Brown at Huddersfield has worked wonders and made them a tough, rough team who are hard to beat, and Anderson at Stains took them to an even higher level. Put your hand in your pocket and get a CURRENT NRL coach.

2. Player recruitment - or lack of. Probably linked to 1, which makes it all the more of a balls up. Anybody who watches us without the beer goggles on can see we need a new halfback and props and yet despite all Lenagan's talk to the press, both here and in Aus, we have precisely no one new for next year and look increasingly likely to be going with what we've got for next year. I hope not and he's got some good rabbits in the hat to be pulled out otherwise his credibility with me will soon be on a par with Mo in his final years.

Less talk, more action Pollard!

I completely agree.

We also need a team of coaches involving some people who actually do some work unlike Forshaw and some past players. Get Lam, Radderz and maybe some others involved.

Our recruitment is the worst in the league, Roberts and Riddell were just plain stupid signings regardless of if they end up ok.

Our team this year should of been one new prop and a new half back with Tommy playing at hooker and keeping Colbon for the wing.

I agree too.

But I don't think Lenegan will put his hand in his pocket. I think he is too tight.

I do expect to see IL give Noble an extension on his contract, so more dross for first half of next year/season.

I can see decent players like S.Tomkins and Ainscough going to other clubs for success if they don't get some forward cover. I mean why was he going 'head to head' with that big curly haired Ozzie ? That is a forwards job.

At the OP. Bring back Mo for me !

Hopefully he will realise we as fans arnt happy, if as predicted next years season ticket sales go down.

I think we bottled it truth be told, the big stage was obviously too much for this team!

Good luck to Warrington, with regards to change and all this, up until St Helens we were 4 matches unbeaten and i didn't see many threads calling for change.

infact some threads wanted Nobby to stay on for another season,. however this history Wigan carry and the reputation they had back in the day so to speak, brings expectation to whom eva puts the Wigan shirt on.

Maybe just maybe, we need to lower our expectations a bit!. Sacing Nobby i don't think is the right thing to do, in my opinion, you look at his career stats, he is a good coach, we need stability not more turmoil!

I don't think you bottled it today, what needs changing is your pack. and maybe your coach.

but your pack was in the whole steamrolled by wires, this lead to monas and briers running the show.

replace Feka, Fieldon with bigger meaner props and that wouldn't be a bad pack

IMO the current Wigan team have a lot of players that are being carried by the rest.

In these games the likes of fielden, lulu, gleeson and few others should step up and help the likes if tomkins.

I also think fielden is finished. I know he not played well for few years but I've always expected him to bounce back.

I like fielden as he seems down to earth and very honest about his lack of form but he either needs a change of club or a new coach to come in and maybe give him boost.

Also hanson is rubbish.

Agree totally with the above.

Regardless of the period in the first half when they absolutely steamrollered us, the same problems were there that have cost us for 3 years: poor composure, panic offloads, dreadful ball control. Yesterday we basically surrendered field position and then went into 'rabbits in the headlights' mode for most of the first half. Just like we did in the Catalan game and the play-off game in Leeds last year.

Leaving aside these basic flaws in our game, let's look at our tactics. We have 2 types of attack on each side- the kick to either corner or ball to Tommy/Sam with O'Loughlin/Phelps coming in on an arc and out to either centre, winger, or touch judge. The opposition know where the ball's going as soon as it's played. In defence, we apply a four-steps-up-and-hold pattern which gives the opposition space and time to move the ball. Look at Monaghan yesterday, he was allowed to absolutely run riot.

The composition of our team is not balanced. We only have one genuine half-back and little on-field organisation or leadership. But for all of the stuff above, I blame the coach.

He's failed to instill the correct mental discipline in the team. His tactics are conservative, predictable and years out of date. And the basics of our game like ball control remain as poor as they were 3 years ago.

nooooo, your all wrong ............

rogues gallery says noble is good coach

end of story



for what its worth , i cant argue with anything thats allready been said in the previous posts

nothing will happen though , so yet more of the same next year

i think its called stability ??

Lower our expectations? All i expected yesterday was effort, not that garbage that was served up for most of yesterday.

Also, stats mean nothing. Millward had a decent record, but almost ruined Wigan. Some coaches just don't fit with aome teams and Noble is one of these. Time to get rid.

Without 2 house props and a scrum half we will win nowt next season and not even look competitve. That is without any consideration to the coaching set up.

I'll be honest, what despares me more than losing the semi, is that nothing will change for next year!

This squad will not win things, we are improving year on year, but the bottom line is with no new players I don't think we will be far off the mark (agian) we are well capable of third as a squad. However we won't be able to get too the mark! It's that simple.

Next years team to be competitive needs to look like:

Phelps
Roberts
Gleeson
Carmont***
Richards
Sam
NEW NUMBER 7
NEW NUMBER 8
Riddell
Coley
Mossop
Hansen
O'Loughlin

Prescott/O'Carroll
Feka/Fielden
Flanagan/Joel
Tommy

Pryce, Goulding, Farrell, Davis, Tuson as back up.

***Carmont to stay but if we could get someone like Atkins if he leaves Wakefield then I hope we would show interest.

Ainscough/McIllorum out on 1year loan deals with recall options.

Bailey/Smith/Hock out which would easily buy us the players we need.

Flanagans off to Oz

Mossop. McIlorum and Ainscough to be in the starting 17 next season - don't care who misses out. Farrell to get some game time this season and come through next.

I agree.

Annoyed that Flanagan seems to be off to Australia - he was one of the few Wigan players yesterday who looked to take the defensive line on and try and do something with ball in hand.

Outside of Lulu's kicks and Tomkin's runs we're lacking creativity, Flanagan gives us options outwide with regards to runners and taking opposition defenders out of the game and creating overlaps. Disappointed to hear he's off to Australia - could do with someone like him at 13 or 6 rather than O'Loughlin (who's a SR - no creativity at all) and we're making do with a hooker at 7.

Lost did we?

We lost yesterday because Smith's tactics were far superior to that of Noble's. For the opening ten minutes I thought Wigan started the game well and we took an 8-0 advantage but then when the Wire got possession we started to unravel.

Every ball taken in by the forwards saw them twist in the tackle and offload the ball helping Wire make a few more yards and then play the quick PTB which threw our defence into complete disarray. Ganson for me was pretty lenient with slowing the play the ball down but we didn't utilise it (Perhaps Noble had warned them pre-match about the side's penalty count & discipline so we didn't hold down long enough.) and Warrington just steamrollered us. By the time Wigan got into the game it was too late.

We needed some leadership on the field and some level heads to calm the players down, put together a game plan and nullify the speed of Warrington's attack and block the ball carrying arm more effectively, but we didn't and thus we lost. We need some leaders on and off the pitch to take us to the next level.

I hear that Atkins is a done deal to Warrington, so he isn't a possibility.

If true and they get Myler, somethings being broken.

Both are going to Wire and Johnson to Wakey

That lad is a good prospect,,,,now here comes the question,,,,,,,Why is he going to Oz,,,,Not from the heartland so just asking....

Its now a certainity that Noble won't be here beyond 2010 at the latest so there will be change in the coaching department. That will bring new impetus and new ideas - hopefully the quality of coach will ensure that the new ideas will be good ones.

On the field the three main problems are obvious. Fielden's finished, Feka's too fat and the issue of Leuluai as a scrumhalf.

We at least have the option of addressing the situation regarding those first two players come next season's end. We must make a decision as to whether we believe Tomkins/Leuluai is good enough as a long term partnership. Like it or not, I believe we'll have a full season next year to assess that.

Other than that, I don't think the problems at Wigan are huge. Lenagan's philosophy may end up bearing fruit in a year or two as long as he does make the odd experienced signing or two to go with the kids. A shame that according to Webb's agent his visa doesn't look like arriving for 2010 but there's no point rushing to sign someone else who isn't the same quality. I do agree with Lenagan - overseas signings should be few and of the right standard.

Remember this is the same side who has impressed most supporters by doing very well in our last 6 games prior to the semi. We got outplayed in a number of key areas on the day yesterday and lost the match. Fair play to them. You don't cry about it - you take it on the chin and go again.