You would think that a Transatlantic team would crumble under the constant flying between Canada and the UK???

But in the WP case they played all their away matches more or less at the start of the season and all their home matches at the end of the season.

So in actual fact only the part time UK teams have faced the Transatlantic journies and associated Visa problems that accepting the WP into a Northern England based sport brings with it.

For all my many pet hates about the Catalans their away record has suffered over the years with bi-weekly round trips from Perpignan, but rightly so if they want to be in the League but it appears that Toronto haven’t faced the same challenges. After all a lot of their players are England based then jet off to Canada.

Now after winning the Championship with an in built advantage of the fixtures being crooked in their favour what happens in the middle 8’s. Surely the league won’t allow them to play 4 straight in Canada followed by 3 straight in the UK when two Superleague Teams and two championship teams for the second time face long flights the week after and week before a home match back in the UK?

This would again give them a massive advantage over their opponents. It will be interesting to see what the RFL do about scheduling the fixtures for the middle 8’s.

If they get promoted will they be allowed to carry this fixture pattern into the Superleague? It would amaze me if the Superleague chairman allow this as its tantamount to the Turkey’s voting to keep Xmas.

I would have no problem in Huddersfield getting relegated and replaced by Leigh, Halifax, Featherstone or even Toulouse but not a team without Canadians because how’s that expansion espeicially with the fixture pattern they have been allowed to adapt.

I heard a rumour from someone associated with the club that if Toronto get promoted, a number of Super League teams will turn round and refuse to travel to play them

Good post but I will be surprised if the powers that be don't bend over backwards to accommadate the Wolfpack just as the did the Catalan.I would have no problem if the WP were made up with a majority of Canucks and would have the same quota of overseas players on their playing squad.Having said that they are a handy side.

Don't think we need to be worrying about what the RFL will do or won't do, They are effectively a spent force with regards who's in or out of S league.
Going forward it is Mr Lenehan and Co who will be deciding who is in S league and who isn't.
Rugby league is dying on it's feet financially , The only thing keeping it afloat is SKY through S League and SL needs to up it's game to stave off a reduction in the TV contract and needs every penny it can lay it's hands on, Hence the plan to cut the game below SL level adrift and let it fend for it'self.
The system is safe till 2021 then it's all change , although there may be some changes to the structure at the end of this season.
Myself i don't see Toronto being allowed into superleague after 2021 unless they can deliver some sort of money spinning TV deal with them ( not heard of anything yet ) Their inclusion will just put clubs costs up as well as other complications , so there will be even less money.
It's going to be interesting, and i suspect Mr Lenehan and co have forgotten more about business than the RFL have ever known, and make no mistake It is about business, So It's just my opinion but i think there will have to be some financial benefit to Toronto being in SL for it to happen, but maybe i have missed something.
The ideal would be to have 5/6 teams over there with a TV deal but i think that's some years down the line " if it ever happens " I am sorry to say Union is slowly killing us off, They are already taking steps to counter the Wolfpack i'm told.

toronto in the middle 8's will play home and away like the rest of the clubs not in blocks like they have been doing during the season as far as im aware!

Only matters for this year.

It’s Interesting that at least one team played Toronto away with less than 17 players due to visa issues prior to travel - so how does that not skew results?

Im not sure what you say will work brearley I would imagine, for the same reason, visa issues- Toronto will have to play all their middle 8 games over here- as surely there won’t be time to sort out visas for teams to travel- they can take a few weeks to sort.

What a whiny pathetic thread.

If we are good enough we stay up as we are in a competition with 8 other teams 4 of whom will definitely stay in SL.

Issues to do with the weather the fixtures visas etc is .

I would love Toronto to come up and one of the consistently failing SL heartland teams to go down.

The game needs a boost and expansion to N America is as good a way as getting it as possible

Yep- let’s stick another nail In The coffin of the game over here

A boost with another team where the space behind the goals is empty ??

Where everyone says Huddersfield only got 4,500 on a Thursday night ??

Add Toulouse and that makes at least three of them in a season.

Check my facts Durham and you’ll find they are correct.

Toronto bring absolutely zilch to the game there will never be a league there just another mouth to feed from our paupers pot of Sky money.

Loads of ex NRL no youth no local and the minute the Canadians get fed up zap they will be gone....

If this is the RL’s business plan then god help Rugby League as every penny that goes to Canada is lost to our game over here.

I have loved rugby league because of the cameraderie the ability to travel around and watch my team the game isn’t big enough to go abroad and cetainly can’t afford it sorry Durham but if you agree with this master plan you are ‘bloody thick’

One team across the Atlantic is a complete waste of everyone's time, I would be absolutely amazed if the ESL entertained it after 2021 unless they can deliver a TV deal that brings in enough cash to warrant their inclusion.

The RFL has been trying to expand this game for over a hundred years, there are probably more failed clubs than there are still playing it, 9 out of 10 league fans care nothing for expansion, nothing for Australia or beating them, They are happy , in fact, want the game to stay a M62 sport so they can trundle down the road to a match without much hassle.

The ironic thing is that most of these clubs will be gone soon as it's looking at the moment, because the ESL is going to cut them adrift so in no time at all they will be right back where the whole game was ( on it's last gasp, with only Wigan ever winning anything ) before Sky came along.

The alternative is to keep funding the lower leagues at the expense of the quality of S League, and almost certainly a drop in Sky's funding. The sad truth is that League is a very minor sport with dwindling support and an International game that isn't worth diddly, So why would anyone bother about where games are going to be played, In the grand scheme of things it matters not, We shall either win enough games or we wont.

If relying on Away fans to pay the costs of a club you are deluded. If you are relying on that to build the game if RL you are deluded.

TV sponsorship and advertising makes professional sports clubs successfully.

Ronaldo will be paid £73,000 per day to play Juventus. Is that paid for by getting £1million pounds fortnight from supporters . no it is advertising and sponsorship.

Does RU get it,s £6m salary cap from fans through the turnstiles. No it is advertising and sponsorship.

Does Cricket get its money from paying supporters no it It is TV paying for 20/20 matches.

Rl needs exposure to get advertising and sponsorship. N. America is loaded with money RL needs some of that.

Without bringing more money into the game RL will shrivel and die.

If you don’t buy into the idea that the games needs to develop and expand to survive you must be bloody thick.

I agree with you about the funding of the game, Paying fans are just a nice extra, Without any doubt whatsoever if sky had not come in when it did League would have gone down the pan as regards a pro sport.
The Giants are a good example of how it works, If they relied on crowds they would be nowhere, same applies to League in general.

Personally i would love to see the game played in a meaningful way across the Atlantic as i would in Europe, It's proving to be a slow painful progression in France and having just one club over there has worked because it's a short journey and there is history of the game over there.

I think it will be a bit more difficult in America, and as i have said IMO one team is a bit of a nonsense economically, That said if you could get a few teams going and a bit of a league it could take off big style and maybe bring in a TV contract. I just don't see S League entertaining anything that will cost them money , They have cited the lack of it as the reason they are taking over from The RFL regards their earnings from SKY.

Does anyone know the formula for the fixtures in the middle 8 playoffs, we might not even play them away might we.

We would play them at home if we finish 9th, my point as was made earlier if they had some Canadians not all UK and NRL players fair enough I could see some point but we would be a prime target to be replaced with our low crowds and poor team.

Anyone who wants TWP to succeed is barmy it’s a short term thing as with most expansion teams but which traditional teams have to die to facilitate it.

This Canadian money that you talk about- where will it go? Not to the game in this country. There will be nothing invested in this country at grassroots level from Canada- no growing of the game over here at all- where does that leave things long term do you think?
Expanding and growing the game in Canada is of no help to the game here.
I hope it takes off- then they can start their own Canadian league and that improves the international game- but that’s no good if it’s at our expense.

I know what you are saying and why you are saying it, But to be fair where are you going to get even half a team of league players in Canada, the game has never been player there. We have been playing the game for 150 years and our teams are riddled with foreign players.

I'm not convinced they will be accepted long term myself but we'll have to see, If they are it will be a poor effort to blame them for the failure of local sides, they have been failing on and off for decades, long before Toronto were thought of , Who do Fartown blame for the number of times they were on the brink, and certainly Sheffield were sacrificed for us .

If we get replaced in S league it won't be the fault of Toronto or anyone else except Fartown, The club has been run in the most unprofessional way imaginable and sooner or later you get found out.

We all hope we don't go out but should we finish in the middle 8 if we don't win enough games then we deserve to go down, it will be no ones fault but ours. Regarding all these Traditional club you speak of , they are nearly all on the verge of collapse and will more than likely do so when ESL withdraws it's funding.

What are your thoughts on that, should the Giants and the other SL clubs cough up some of their money to keep them afloat, ( as they do now ) knowing they can never again amount to much in the grand scheme of things. Many people believe that Catalan, Toulouse and Toronto and expansion teams are the only chance league has to survive. Then again most league fans don't care about any of it as long as they can nip over to Wakey or wherever to support there own team, It's the nature of the Rugby league fan ( in general ) .

I think the idea is to get the game going over there jools not prop up a load of failing clubs along the m62. We have had 150 years to grow the game , and failed miserably, after all those years only half a dozen clubs are anything like secure, and all have very wealthy owners.

Where it leaves us long term is exactly where we have put ourselves, Toronto makes no difference to that either way , but i agree with you that one club in Canada is of little use to us, they need a league but that takes time, why you think that would somehow be at our expense i don't know.

Utter tripe. They bring absolutely nothing to the game and are playing to different rules to the rest of us. Shame on the RFL.

f

It’s failjng miserably because the RFL does sweet FA to support the game at grassroots level- without young people playing and watching the game it fails.
Case in point- in order to run a junior team coaches have to have a minimum amount of training-in safeguarding and also coaching.
Currently the one and only single training course the RFL has made available for level 2 coaching is full- and there are no safeguarding courses available-which is a minimum requirement! Bearing in mind all junior coaches are VOLUNTEERS. so any junior clubs wanting to start a team cannot. But the RFL have the money to jet off to Canada.....

your correct on this as for a Canadian team it simply will cost too much for the smaller clubs to fund, I don't want to be right as it will be the end of the game as we know it

Again i understand your point and agree with what you say about the RFL, i just don't see how it is the fault of Toronto, As far as i know they stand the cost of every game they play at home for both teams.

Teams flown half way round the world and put up in substandard accommodation. Not great for professional sport.
Do you not think it costs clubs to sort out a trip, visas, equipment, insurance etc.
Not to mention missed training sessions/jet lag/ that interferes with other games.
And they get nothing out of doing that.
If there were any Canadians in the squad, or a Canadian coach then I’d perhaps be behind it.
Toronto may just as well be Birmingham, or Glasgow, or indeed anywhere in the UK.

Except they have tried everywhere else in the UK jools, They can't even get it going in Rugby mad Wales, It's dying on it's feet even along the M62's much vaunted heartlands, while Union grows ever bigger. Sad to say something needs to change, and as i have already said one team over there is a nonsense, but if after 150 years we can only boast Half a dozen stable teams, who themselves are completely reliant on Sky for survival, there is not much hope long term.

The most sensible way forward would be for mergers ( as far as survival goes ) but we all know the thinking on that " I'll give up watching the game first ". (Maybe sooner than we think). Anyway lets see what S league have in mind when they take over.

The fault with Toronto as a team Jo nothing, the fault lies with the team construction ie too few Canadians too many overseas players.But the root cause is back to money once again.By the way the RFL have shown a loss of£2 million this last season and a sizable chunk of this went in golden handshakes to departing directors.

They wouldn't have been getting golden handshakes had it been up to me. Iv'e been saying for years that S league should break away from the rfl, You'll hear the whinging start when the gravy bowl disapears.

Regarding Toronto, i can only repeat what i have already said, Where are you going to get Canadian players from, it takes years from a standing start.

And just as a matter of interest does anyone know how many foreign player we have playing League here, We all seem perfectly happy with that, In fact at the Giants alone we are getting all exited about the rumour of signing a new one, so it appears to me we are quite happy with these imports as long as they are coming here.

Anyway there are big changes coming and they had better work, or there will be no one to watch, When you are involved in the fortunes of your own team and their up's and down's and struggles, it's easy to miss the sorry state the game as a whole is in, Hence this move by S League.

Until they start putting money in at grassroots level things won’t improve.