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| 10th July 2013
Super League will feature 12 teams from the 2015 season after Rugby League's
elite clubs today agreed to a key change to the structure of their competition.
At their Annual General Meeting in Bradford, the Super League clubs ruled out
the option of reducing from 14 teams to 10 in 2015 and asked the RFL Executive
to investigate two options around a 12-team competition.
One option involves a 12-team Super League running in tandem with a 12-team
Championship which after 23 rounds split into three qualifying play-off groups,
each comprising eight clubs.
The other option is for two divisions of 12 with a more traditional style of
promotion and relegation between the two competitions.
The debate forms part of the consultation process around the RFL's ongoing
Policy Review, one aim of which is to determine a league structure that is
viable, commercially appealing and attractive to the public, broadcasters and
sponsors alike.
Super League Chief Executive Nigel Wood said: "The clubs engaged in a robust and
frank debate about the future of their competition and gave their full support
to the RFL Executive in our search for the most compelling league structure.
"It's apparent that there is a strong and widespread desire to deliver a really
exciting league season that provides well-run clubs at all levels of the game
with opportunities to flourish, succeed and make progress.
"Our task now is to drill down into the details of a range of issues such as
minimum standards, financial distributions and the various mechanics around
promotion and relegation."
The Super League clubs rejected the option of remaining as a 14-team competition
at a meeting last month and will convene in the coming weeks once the RFL
Executive has delivered its report into the 12-team Super League options.
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| Come on Doc - You know it makes sense. Cheque Book out hopefully.
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| Quote ="Early Bath"Come on Doc - You know it makes sense. Cheque Book out hopefully.'"
I can see it being a real dog fight next year with any 2 of 7 clubs losing their status. Could become very messy if clubs sign players now on 2-3 year contracts and end up going down. I wouldn't have thought there is enough money in the game for parachute payments for the two relegated teams.
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| It makes you wonder if some clubs will field weakened teams against the top clubs and just target the 4 pointer matches with a relatively fresh team.
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| The same clowns who said licensing was the future are now changing their tune without any sense of embarrassment.
Whatever you think of licensing, creating a massively short-term focus is a recipe for disaster. The RFL needs to open up a licensing process for 2015 for both 12 team divisions to avoid catastrophe.
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| We might just have to increase Rangi's price tag now
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| Quote ="theredshed"It makes you wonder if some clubs will field weakened teams against the top clubs and just target the 4 pointer matches with a relatively fresh team.'"
Karl Harrison tictacs.
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| Quote ="Wirecutter"I can see it being a real dog fight next year with any 2 of 7 clubs losing their status. Could become very messy if clubs sign players now on 2-3 year contracts and end up going down. I wouldn't have thought there is enough money in the game for parachute payments for the two relegated teams.'"
Steve O’Connor gave an impassioned speech at last week’s RFL Council AGM on this very issue. Of course, as is the case with Council members since year dot, he clearly has Widnes in mind. We have to assume that two clubs will be relegated next year, possibly three if Toulouse win their plea for a Super League licence in 2015. However, I suppose mergers cannot be ruled out either, especially if O’Connor’s assertion is a genuine threat.
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| Fiddling while Rome is burning!
I've made the point on another thread, but to constantly tamper with the game's format is counter productive. Have a league and competition structure that is simple and straight forward and where the most consistent team during the season are crowned as champions. By all means add other cup competitions to it, but then leave it!!
Don't rush into it until you are sure you have got it right.
I wonder if the "elite club" representatives were the same clowns who sabotaged youth development last year? In that instance, I believe it was the Chief Executives, half of whom have little , or no, understanding of the game and only look at today's income and expenditure, rather than the future.
The game needs to consider what it needs to do to provide regular competitive matches at each level. Over the past few years, there have been too many absurdly one sided matches, many on Sky, which have been a poor advertisement for the sport.
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| Well watching Super League back chat and three off them reckon London & surprisingly Bradford will go down next season
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| I really fail to see why it isn't easy for the powers that be.
Two x twelve team leagues.
At the end of the season bottom two from the premier competition go down and the top two teams from the league below get promoted.
None of this rubbish where then you have play offs to see who gets the league title, rather award it the team at the top on the final day and if you really must then have a different play off competition culminating in the same grand final type affair.
Reinstate GB tours in the old style, with a three game mid season series or Lancashire v Yorskshire.
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| That's great on paper MR but in reality it's not all good.
Two Championship sides coming up would be unable to go fulltime, would struggle to compete even at the lower level, and would become yo-yo sides. How is the intensity of the competition maintained when someone like Warrington play Fev? Would more 80 point drubbings help out SL? How does the relegated Clubs fit existing contracts/players under a reduced cap? How is it fair for a fully professional side to exist in the same league as part time clubs?
Financial stability is more precarious for teams at the bottom end of the league and may result in teams living beyond their means again to stave-off relegation. Without a play-off system there would be no incentive for any side if the league is sewn-up months in advance. There would also be no incentive for a lower league side to attain anything but not finishing in the bottom two.
Lancs v Yorks is a relic of the past. Has no relevance to the modern game. Generates no interest and has no bearing on International selection. It also makes RL look more parochial than it already is.
I agree with GB. We're not a strong enough sport Internationally to dilute what little talent we have, or isolate fans who are basically, not English.
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| Quote ="TheButcher"
How does the relegated Clubs fit existing contracts/players under a reduced cap?
'"
Many will know that I've argued for a long time for one-up, one-down automatic promotion and relegation between the leagues and now it is coming about.
I expect my proposals (see other thread) for a structure relating to scrapping the salary cap also to be adopted before too long.
To answer your question, however, all responsible directors should include a clause in player contracts giving the club the option to terminate the contract if the club ceases to be in the current division (ie if it is relegated).
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| Quote ="Wooden Stand"Many will know that I've argued for a long time for one-up, one-down automatic promotion and relegation between the leagues and now it is coming about.
I expect my proposals (see other thread) for a structure relating to scrapping the salary cap also to be adopted before too long.
To answer your question, however, all responsible directors should include a clause in player contracts giving the club the option to terminate the contract if the club ceases to be in the current division (ie if it is relegated).'"
I understand that but, that helps the relegated Club how?
Having their better players contracts become void so that they can get snapped-up as squad players for those SL teams in danger of the same thing. Leaving the relegated Club in a far worse position, player-wise, as they would struggle to retain any players that they may want to keep.
P&R is the ultimate solution, but is it the right solution at this time? There is too much of a gulf between the best Championship sides and the bottom few teams in the SL. How is making the Competition less competitive better for the game? It's fine if you're a top five Club who is largely unaffected by any changes except it's extra 'free-money' with two less teams. You're reducing the professional player pool again when it is already pretty short atm. What effect would that have? Would SL teams be forced to bolster numbers from Championship sides? That sounds fine in practice but then how do Championship sides retain players to gain promotion? The licensing system has been a farce with regards to entry into the elite Club and what warrants staying in it, but not having P&R has helped Catalans, Hudds, and Widnes become possible contenders. Even Salford have benefited in that if we would have been relegated we wouldn't have attracted Koukash to the table. Us simply being in SL has helped us, hopefully, to be contenders in the next year or two.
I'm not against P&R but things need to be thought through before changing them.
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| Quote ="TheButcher"That's great on paper MR but in reality it's not all good.
Two Championship sides coming up would be unable to go fulltime, would struggle to compete even at the lower level, and would become yo-yo sides. How is the intensity of the competition maintained when someone like Warrington play Fev? Would more 80 point drubbings help out SL? How does the relegated Clubs fit existing contracts/players under a reduced cap? How is it fair for a fully professional side to exist in the same league as part time clubs?
Financial stability is more precarious for teams at the bottom end of the league and may result in teams living beyond their means again to stave-off relegation. Without a play-off system there would be no incentive for any side if the league is sewn-up months in advance. There would also be no incentive for a lower league side to attain anything but not finishing in the bottom two.
Lancs v Yorks is a relic of the past. Has no relevance to the modern game. Generates no interest and has no bearing on International selection. It also makes RL look more parochial than it already is.
I agree with GB. We're not a strong enough sport Internationally to dilute what little talent we have, or isolate fans who are basically, not English.'"
Well I suggested elsewhere that the promoted side are given one year without the threat of relegation, we previously had the situation where the promoted team couldn't start recruitment straight away so were lagging behind. To prevent the notion of yoyo teams (us in previous incarnations of the league) that buffer year would allow for recruitment and the gradual blooding of younger talent.
There has to be something mid season international (or if you like rep rugby like in the NRL), we can't expect a GB team too play say 3 meaningful games per season and compete with players from NZ & Australia when they play at a higher intensity week in week out, play mid season tests on ANZAC day and the cream of the Aussies play SOO.
The GB thing for me is a no brainer, still have the home nations event but make that for fringe players to show their wares on a slightly higher level and give them the goal of a GB test jumper to aim for.
I don't get the incentive thing, professional sportsmen get paid to play a game so for me every game should demand the same level of effort from them. The simple answer is there is an increase in prize money the higher up the table you finish that should then be channeled to the players thus making it more lucrative for them to finish higher up the league.
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| Quote ="Wooden Stand" To answer your question, however, all responsible directors should include a clause in player contracts giving the club the option to terminate the contract if the club ceases to be in the current division (ie if it is relegated).'"
That’s all well and good but surely that would create a huge disadvantage of attracting better players to lower standing clubs. Players may be reluctant to commit to a club they consider a risk in preference to a higher standing club. This could create further disparity in the game with players accepting less money from a higher standing club simply because it’s a safer long-term option.
This would be an unfair obstacle in the player recruitment process.
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| To answer your question, however, all responsible directors should include a clause in player contracts giving the club the option to terminate the contract if the club ceases to be in the current division (ie if it is relegated).
They Do ! Current SL contracts no matter how long state that if the club you are contracted to lose SL status then the contract is terminated and you are a free agent. It is one of the conditions a player abides to when he signs.
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| Quote ="RED MOUNTAIN"To answer your question, however, all responsible directors should include a clause in player contracts giving the club the option to terminate the contract if the club ceases to be in the current division (ie if it is relegated).
They Do ! Current SL contracts no matter how long state that if the club you are contracted to lose SL status then the contract is terminated and you are a free agent. It is one of the conditions a player abides to when he signs.'"
Yes but there is a big difference between signing a 2 year contract with a club that has a 3 year franchise license compared to one that could out of Superleague 12 months down the line.
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| Why not have all players employed by the RFL, funded by the licence fee for their basic salaries. Then clubs could bid extra funds for particular players to be contracted to them for a set period and pay win bonuses etc directly to the players
That way, the lower division clubs get something of a guarantee that players will be available, whilst the better off clubs still keep the ability to realise their ambitions by targetting the best players for their squads
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| Quote ="Wirecutter"Yes but there is a big difference between signing a 2 year contract with a club that has a 3 year franchise license compared to one that could out of Superleague 12 months down the line.'"
Not sure where you are coming from there.......a better example would be a player signing a 3 year contract with a SL club with 2 years left on the clubs SL Franchise.
If the club was to lose its SL status the third year of the contract would be nullified.
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| Does anyone have the stats of how many promoted teams were relegated the year after during the promotion-relegation era of Super League?
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| Quote ="Chico"markillsport.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/relegation-and-player-movement-in-super.html'"
That's an interesting read, and doesn't squash the fears I have of bringing P&R back too soon.
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| Quote ="TheButcher"That's great on paper MR but in reality it's not all good.
Two Championship sides coming up would be unable to go fulltime, would struggle to compete even at the lower level, and would become yo-yo sides. How is the intensity of the competition maintained when someone like Warrington play Fev? Would more 80 point drubbings help out SL? How does the relegated Clubs fit existing contracts/players under a reduced cap? How is it fair for a fully professional side to exist in the same league as part time clubs?
Financial stability is more precarious for teams at the bottom end of the league and may result in teams living beyond their means again to stave-off relegation. Without a play-off system there would be no incentive for any side if the league is sewn-up months in advance. There would also be no incentive for a lower league side to attain anything but not finishing in the bottom two.
Lancs v Yorks is a relic of the past. Has no relevance to the modern game. Generates no interest and has no bearing on International selection. It also makes RL look more parochial than it already is.
I agree with GB. We're not a strong enough sport Internationally to dilute what little talent we have, or isolate fans who are basically, not English.'"
Butcher..i know my mate MR has me on his assassin list but I have to agree with him here.
The club finishing top of the pile are rightly Champions of that particular sport, those who finish below the cut off for staying in the division should give up their place and allow teams who have competed below them a chance.
Your argument about them being unable to compete in such a short period is valid but they shouldn't be denied that chance.
The way the structure is at the minute the top division is fundamentally a closed shop and doesn't encourage the teams below it to invest or develop themselves. You find that once the gap has opened up showing the potential playoff teams then the teams below eight place have nothing to play for both Salford ( and it isn't a dig) and London testimony to that this season.
Restructuring is a tough nut to crack as you will please some and not others but in this country we must be the only sport who turn it's back on Promotion and Relegation...I do stand to be corrected however.
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| Quote ="RED MOUNTAIN"Not sure where you are coming from there.......a better example would be a player signing a 3 year contract with a SL club with 2 years left on the clubs SL Franchise.
If the club was to lose its SL status the third year of the contract would be nullified.'"
Contracts should be binding whatever league a team ends up in , this way they can command a transfer fee and money is fed down to the lower leagues, giving more clubs the chance to survive financially
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