Get on the phone to S15, they could do with your genius lol.

Some mitigating factors also for sl's drop
Top spot is wasted on hudds. Normally sitting top of the league would see a significant crowd boost for most clubs
Hull have been poor for couple of years and crowds have responded, hopefully the wembley trip will boost interest in them for next season
Hull KR have had a decreased capacity with the building of the north stand
Salford and Bradford nearly ceased trading and the bad stench from financial failure will have put plenty off
All comps can come up with reasons for drops in the last couple of years.

SL does need to find some new ways to reinvigorate the comp and I guess thy ate trying with the revamped future format.

They haven't come close to selling out the available seats this season have they? I thought the capacity while work was carried out was 9,000....Leeds is their biggest gate so far this year at 8,122 and they are averaging about 7,300 this year, so the building of a stand behind one set of posts isn't the reason for a slight drop in attendances at Hull KR, it's more about performances on the park for them.
Still, after missing finals footie last year, I reckon they will be playing at least one extra game at the end of the season this year...they were robbed against the Pies, but should get 2 more wins to cement finals footie.

As for Marketing Super Rugby? They are beyond help and I prefer to help so called smaller sports who pay as well, but don't come with the inflated ego and blinkered opinions that Rugby Unions seem to have. 10,850 was the Hurricanes average this year...down from 14,318 last year and down from 23,200 in 2006! Try telling them that they've got a problem and they just won't listen!

Yes but that capacity includes the sth stand of around 1200 which is a major turn off factor in going for most fans. It's been mentioned by many on the rovers forum that they haven't taken the wife and kids this year due to the north stand not being available. RM stand is pretty much season ticket sold out and the lack of a seating option for pay at the gate puts many off going.

When you take off the sth stand you can see we are pretty much selling out the remaining decent viewing areas. The north stand will make a 500+ avg difference at least, encourage more away fans to visit and hopefully encourage more families.

Agreed though our improved performances and next years decent signings should also help.

The state of the economy is the main factor affecting attendances. People keep banging on about Huddersfield's crowds and how poor marketing is but at the end of the day they have tried to increase support by offering heavily discounted tickets for a number of seasons. This year season ticket prices have doubled and on the day prices have also increased and yet attendance has only fallen by 20%. Regardless of position in the league do you seriously expect more people to buy a product that has doubled in price?

I wont bore you with my background but rest assured I don't have any hatred of numbers.
Wildmoose asked what was the point of this thread (a question that was first asked on Page 3 by the way). If its just to record and monitor attendances that's fine but I don't get that impression - do you? I don't know William or where he's coming from but my problem with the thread is the subtext: the apparent gloating enjoyment of the fact that crowds are down with the justification that he is merely countering the positive spin from RFL and the "sheep" on this board.
I don't have any problem with "bad news" and I don't think anyone's ignoring it but the fact that attendances are down is only significant if the trend continues in subsequent years. Until then, the tone of William's posts force me to conclude that there is a hidden agenda involving to talk the game down for some reason. I find that sad.

If he's 'pure troll' ( e.g. a genuine hater of RL ) then he's disguised it very well. Seems much more like someone who has a very strong view that the sport is in a complete mess. Now, that may well be something you find ridiculous, but if trying to support his argument is the 'hidden agenda' of this thread then I don't see a problem with that, whether or not you or I agree with the original thesis. Since I've never met the guy, nor have any idea who he is, I don't 'find it 'sad' ( nor make any other judgement of the poster as a person ). The only thing of relevance is the worrying fall in attendances. You are happy to 'wait and see' obviously. I am inclined to be more concerned - the accelerated drop this season is particularly worrying. If attendances had shot up by 10%, it would be a very impressive achievement, and I'd be shouting out that we need to find out why and capitalize on it quickly and further. A similar drop should be of massive concern to anyone who cares about the game, and if people choose to make a connection between those numbers and [itheir[/i personal belief about why its happening, then that's their right. Just as it is the right of others to express an opinion that its all down to economic factors or whatever. Why is it any less 'sad' to have an 'agenda' that says: "everything is fine, it's just the recession"?

That being the case, one can only ask why you didn’t last year?

Why I didn't what?

Shout from the rooftops about our increase in attendances.

We have had increases in attendances for nigh on 15 years now. We havent yet had a 140 page thread on how brilliant the RFL and clubs are. You certainly havent contributed to one.

One can only ask why?

If you just look at RL it can look like a worrying downtrend. But other sports are in a bigger mess; they just wont admit it (well, the media are scared to mention it publicly).

If you watch Sky sports or BBC/ITV, the whole world can't wait for the new tartball season to start ..... yet, outside of a small handfull of top clubs, whose gates are ensured sellouts due not to local fans but corporate travelling support from around the world, the game is falling apart. 90% of games are heavily discounted (50% off admission or BOGOF's) yet you can still purchase tickets right up to kickoff .... and that includes some supposedly 'big' clubs ........ Go back only a few years and that wasn't the case. Sport in general relies on the public having spare cash to spend, and right now, there isn't enough to go around.

It isn't the end of the sport, it is just tough times in my opinion. It needs to be resolved, or at least plans put in place by each club to avoid a smaller attendance causing them financial issues.
Each are doing that in a different way.

Wakefield have worked hard on attendances this year. We are ahead on equivilant fixtures last year and look like coming in around the same number, whichw as already a big increase from the year before.
Average so far is 8,113 whereas last years same fixtures ran at 8,052.
Last year's average was 8,172 so within reach.

It isn't solving all our financial issues. Cash flow is still a problem when 3 of our biggest home game fixtures are in the last few games of the season. That's just how it goes.

Wildmoose (and others) have asked what is the point of this thread. Perhaps you could tell us what you think the point of the thread is. If William thinks he is demonstrating that, "the sport is a complete mess" and is merely exercising his right, "to make a connection between those numbers and [itheir[/i personal belief about why its happening..." can you tell us why he thinks it's happening. I confess I haven't read every word of the 139 pages but, apart from, SL attendances are down, I don't know what he's saying at all. He chooses to ignore all the mitigating circumstances that people put forward for the drop in attendances whilst mitigating the good news eg. Wakefield's small increase in attendance, with a snide comment about cheap season tickets. I know the use of the word "snide" is value laden but that's how his posts comes across to me - value laden, negative, talking the game down.

I apparently joined this forum in April 2012. Since when, I haven't unfortunately had the opportunity to shout from the rooftops about a 10% increase in attendances. As and when it happens, let me know and I'll start the thread for you.

we all believe you

First up, the OP isn't responsible for the length of the thread. That the thread 'has a point' is a tautology - it wouldn't stretch to 130 pages if nobody was interested in the content. What the 'point' is to you personally I'm sure varies from individual to individual, but it certainly collects strong views on changes in attendance, the significance or otherwise of those changes, and people's opinions as to the reason for those changes. If such discussion is 'pointless', then I'm not sure what that says about all the other threads. I find it interesting that some people regard a 10% fall as nothing to worry about and entirely down to 'mitigating circumstances'. I think those people are very foolish, but I find their views interesting nonetheless - in particular I wonder (and worry) if their views are shared by the RFL, etc.

An emoticon is always a good way to deflect attention from having your idiocy pointed out. Nobody will notice, its fine.

it would be idiotic to think that you couldnt have commented on the 15 years of growing attendances we had because you only joined in April 2012. 2012 set attendance records. You could have started one yourself as you offered. You have plenty of opportunity to shout the good news from the rooftops. You chose not to. You refuse to explain why.

There is not any way, shape or form, or possible interpretation of anything at all, that could lead any intelligent person, who understands what the word means, to describe the fact this thread has a point as a tautology. I can only assume you have attempted to shoe-horn a word you dont understand into the sentence to try and sound intelligent.

I have to say, I don't always like William Eve's style but I'm interested in this thread.
It will clearly go on until the end of the season and I want to keep seeing the attendances. The conclusions we are all drawing from the numbers are the point ofthe thread in my opinion.
I don't agree with all his and/or others opinions on it, but I wouldn't have my opportunity to read and comment if he didn't post it.

Sometimes an antagonist is a good thing.

Agree, good to monitor attendances as they do matter in so many different ways. I like to take the good with the bad. Attendances are down this year for whatever reason. Hopefully next yer they will be back to the norm and start climbing again.

I agree with you. Perhaps asking, "Whats the point?" is the wrong question but I am just interested in William's motivation for starting the thread in the first place because his comments don't seem to be constructive or positive. Anyway, he must be sitting in his cellar p155ing himself laughing at the moment so I think I'll bow out.

this...but with the kicker that "hopefully" has no place in modern sports marketing...the RFL employed a marketing Guru from Man City...time he started to earn his crust IMHO!



Averages have grown from 6,500 in year 1, with 12 teams playing 132 games to an average of 8,457 over 154 games so far with 28 regular season games to come.
30% increase is good work over 18 years.....until you look at some of the prices in the 1997 column here
[urlhttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1551091/Blair-in-numbers.html[/url

Average price of a pint of draught lager £1.83........add 30% .....can you get a pint of lager for £2.38 anywhere today

you probably can, since you like your pint glasses half empty.

For me, the crux of the matter is that long standing die-hard rugby league fans are becoming frustrated with the lack of meaningful games, and are becoming less avid.
In a discussion on the Leeds board, I explained that I personally have gone from never missing a match (missing work, using holidays, missing other events to make sure I didnt miss a match) to more recently picking and choosing the games I attend. For instance, even if I were offered a free ticket to Salford v Leeds, with free travel, I'd still choose to stay at home and watch the game on the box, because the intensity isnt there for a Leeds v Salford match.
Rugby league fans simply want a good full bloodied contest, between 2 teams that will give their all and play as though their lives depend on it. The current league structure means that the top teams can afford to take it easy for large parts of the season - leading to low intensity games and a general apathy.
The worry is, that if someone like me, who's life has always revolved around the game is becoming dis-illusioned, how on earth are we going to attract and keep new supporters. (By the way, my love for the game has not detracted - its just the entertainment served up is often not worth giving up my hard earned and spare time).

Empty!