I can predict within 20%....worst case scenario, 25% based on the turn overs of clubs.

Example: London in 2008 received their Sky 1.3 mill, 1.5 from investors and turned over 4.2 million...so 1.2 million from other sources which would have been sponsorship (linked to the investment of Ian L at the time and part of his INVESTMENT) and match day revenues.
50,821 people attended 13 home games that year....1.2 million divided between 50,821 is 23.61 each. With no inflation, no increase in ticket prices, no increase in anything, I am 22% out on my estimate of 30 a pop.

Ticket prices have gone up 25% by the way...beer 16%, food 20% and an entry to the players lounge on match day has gone up by 40%.

Now, I accept that London are not the best example......so lets say I am 50% out and each missing fan is only worth 15 quid in lost revenue

....then the entire seasons loss in revenue would be a paltry 3.7 Million.....a nothing amount of money to a comp that can't give away its naming rights



You say Potayto, I'll say Potatto ....either way, it's not good news for the sport that attendances are down when other sports are riding the Olympic wave and increasing theirs.

On course for a record low semi final crowd for Wigan vs London this weekend?

Could be. What is the record lowest I wonder ?

Hope so.

To be fair it's a bit of a trek for the Wigan fans...

Given that Wigan have over 10k season ticket holders, it's a joke if they don't fill up Leigh.

By public transport it's quicker to get from Wigan to Crewe than it is Wigan to Leigh. The RFL have missed an opportunity for expansion there.

Of course it's not good crowds are down, but we are not alone in that. Which sports crowds are up? RU certainly aren't.

Arriva premiership avg crowd
12/13 12,478
11/12 12,925

French top 14
09/10 13,795
12/13 11,387

Heineken cup
11/12 15,323
12/13 13,566

If only it worked that way.

We had the same thing at Doncaster the other year when we played Cas. I guess a lot of people decide to save their money for Wembley.

And people say I'm obsessed with union?

Over 10,000 at Wakey tonight! Must be first time in a while.

10031 there tonight. Great atmosphere, close game in the balance right uo until the last minute.

only 2nd ever time in SL i think - well done to them !

Yep 2nd highest SL crowd. No cheap ticket offers either.

Sorry did I show you up?

Dream on.....


You reckon showing the Aviva Premiership being down 3.9% somehow negates the current 11.5% drop in the Superleague?
You then introduce the French Top 14 and the Heineken Cup, 2 EUROPEAN Comps...to try and counter a debate about other sports riding high on the Olympic wave



Now you've opened the door on European competition, shall we compare the 13,458 average for the H cup (down 10%) with the Challenge Cup 3,811 (down 15.5%)?

The Amlin Challenge cup averages 5,307 per game up 3%.....it is the 2nd tier European cup comp.
The Rabo Pro12 averages 8,199 up 6%...it is the 2nd tier European league.

The Challenge cup has seen an average of 3,811 fans per game over the 30 matches played since the pro's joined in.....I can go back to earlier rounds if you'd like?
We could also discuss the competitions sponsors we've mentioned....Amlin, Aviva, Heineken, Rabo Direct......oh, and Tetley's, but sadly no sponsor for the premiere comp in the NH for RL?

11.5% drop in attendances in SL and 15.5% drop in 30 Challenge cup matches this year as against last......post all the Union stats you want JB.....Other sports are seeing an increase in attendances....I believe the anniversary games were well attended and they had a naming rights sponsor too. You chose Rugby Union because the 3.9 drop in the Aviva was supposed to score some imaginary points against me.....you failed dismally. Of the 76,387 "missing" Union fans in 2012-13.....42,653 were down to the lack of interest in the Saracens Wembley jamboree compared to the previous "world record" 83,716. ....24,734 less fans is a drop of 1.4%......



By the way, the Heineken Cup final in Dublin this year was between 2 French teams and it got 50,148. The previous year, the final was played in London between 2 Irish teams and got something like 82,000...let's laugh at the bigger and better run code some more shall we?



The mere fact that you had to drag union into the debate to try and score points indicates you accept Billy has a point...the RFL do not seem keen to address the problems this year as they were to back slap each other last year.

feel free to tell us all how wonderful things are in the SH, but it won't paper over the fact that the RFL are systematically screwing the game up in the NH with ineffective management and a total lack of know how to run a sports/business in the modern world. They are responsible for Ireland, England, Scotland and Wales in RL, yet they turn over less revenue than the scots RFU, have no naming rights sponsor for their flagship comp, have flogged TV rights for the RLWC to an access TV station, have seen massive year on year reductions in fans attending Challenge cup games and they are now circling the wagons to reduce the comp to 12 in the hope that any more administrations are avoided. The Exiles concept is flawed, but they press on with it anyway, the autumn international series was a waste of time last year so in reality, by the time England run out at Cardiff in October, it will be 24 days short of 2 years since they played a meaningful international fixture.....but hey ho, let's laugh some more at the bigger and better run code some more shall we?

SHOW ME UP?

Erm, you said RL was failing because 'all other sports were riding the Olympic wave and increasing their crowds'.. fundamentally wrong, as all the RU domestic competition mentioned also saw falling crowds. Produce all the stats you want about how much bigger RU is, but it doesn't make you right in this context.

I didn't say all sports......I said other sports and I didn't mention union before the honourable gentleman in Western Australia.
The important stats are 11.5% down in SL and 15.5% down in the Challenge Cup

Oh come on, you were comparing to other sports and RU as a team sport in the same vein is the closest comparison. If the only important stats are those of rugby league then stop bloody comparing us to the other code yourself.

I repeat...... I didn't say all sports and I didn't bring union to the thread. You can imply I brought union up, but the evidence is there for all to see in black and white!

I said.....

WA Red said....


Followed by the irrelevant comments regarding Europe in the context of the London games...


...but ignoring the Amlin and Rabo Pro 12 comps because they didn't suit his irrelevant point.

I responded to this irrelevance with a tongue in cheek....


to which WA Red retorted....



feel free to point out how me saying that other sports are kicking on and doing well on the back of the Olympics has somehow been shown up by irrelevant English and European Union crowds?

The you jumped in with


when in fact the only thing that was fundamentally flawed was your ability to read what I posted....



Not content with that...you compounded the error by insinuating what I was saying.....



I didn't mention Union and I didn't compare RL to Union this time.

I am amused as to why this thread has gone down this route, given the 2 main FACTS at present that are valid are that SL is 11.5% down on attendances against last year and the Challenge Cup 15.5% down.

These FACTS should be of major concern to the RFL as if the clubs see a drop in revenues then there will be less cash available for players....we will lose some more to Union, the NRL or some will simply not see RL as a viable career path. Less fans will be of even less interest to sponsors, or as the RFL now calls them, Partners.

All of these things are far more concerning than the attendances at Club Union matches......that can be swallowed with ease by the massive attendances achieved at International level.

So which sports exactly do you think are riding the Olympic wave ? I'd love to hear this.

seriously?
you're not very good at this, are you?

Not content with me underlining the flaws in your failed attempts to make me look foolish, you'd now like me to slap on an extra coat of varnish to your shame?

Fair enough.

find me an athletics meeting in the UK prior to the Olympics and not counting a commonwealth games...but a diamond league meeting that saw crowds like this?


...bear in mind that there are a number of different sports on show here. Because they don't include Union doesn't make them any less pertinent to the point under discussion....that sports are riding the wave of interest created by the Olympics.

The 2011 Diamond league meeting was held at Crystal Palace....capacity 16,000. Tell me.....does the picture above show more than 16,000 in the Olympic stadium????

I think it does.

RONSEAL!

There is only one sport there. Many different events, but one sport.

No sports away from athletics are riding the olympic wave. Even the athletics 'wave' is debatable, despite the attendance at a one off event marketed as the London anniversary games. Bet the majority of the crowd were oblivious that it was actually a diamond league meeting.