Unacceptable start that has cost us. Leeds were so poor that I'm annoyed that we weren't able to take advantage.

We have been criticising the attack, but our defence was hopelessly exposed tonight.

With the ball I thought we played with a better shape and really shifted the ball at times. I just think we need a better final ball and that is the negative of Jordan Turner. I thought we looked panicked and frantic; Luke Walsh had a good game, but our game management was poor.

Overall, I'm really disappointed to lose that match. Both sides are way off the pace defensively and but for our start we win that game.

On to Wigan...lets hope for a better start!

I thought that was our best performance in many a game. We made quite a few breaks and looked very capable of scoring tries. We didn't manage to convert tonight, the execution was awful, but the breaks were there at least. Effort, commitment and team spirit were also evident so no real complaints tonight.

We just need to face up to reality. Those players cannot win a trophy. They simply aren't good enough. For me, top 4 should be the ultimate goal but I don't think we're capable of even that, but that should be what the club focuses on. As ever with Easter, things could look completely different by Monday. Two defeats over Easter and we'll be well outside the top 4 and it will look an impossible task to get back, win both of them and we'll be looking rosy. If I were a betting man, my money wouldn't be on Saints.

Said this on another thread, we don't have enough speed in the team to go all the way from a clean break or get up in support for an offload. We are so same paced throughout the team.

Also, KC said "We don't seem to get off the bus for the first 10 to 15 minutes when we come to Leeds"....I believe KC can be a success for us but I have to admit I've been perturbed by comments like this, and the one about 'sniffing complacency' at Salford. He should be sending those lads out there with a rocket up their backsides and fully aware of their responsibilities to be alert and start a game strongly.

I normally think you as very negative; but on this occasion I'm going to be more negative than you.

There was very little positive to take from this game. Leeds are a poor team at the moment. The errors were unforgivable by both teams but I think without seeing the stats worse by us.
Never in the second half did I believe we would win; we just didn't seem capable and turned into a farce.

Turner is a joke who shouldn't even be in the 19; he just can't catch a ball. His confidence seems shot or is he just useless?
The only time I saw Owens was when he was making an error.

LMS for a change seemed very determined; everyone else was average.

God knows what will happen against the goons and Widnes if we can't beat the shower that Leeds currently are.

With all the poor misses and misreads by Leeds players tonight, Im amazed to say it was a Saints player who defended the worst, Luke walsh is maybe the worst defender I have ever seen, you'd be better off putting him on the sideline and defending with 12 utiol you got the ball back



Having said that, I wouldnt be too worried if I were you guys, for the first 10 mins it was 2015 all over again and we were moving the ball fluently but not aimlessly for the first time since last year, as well as taking the opportunities presented to us, so dont be too disheartened
After that though we fell apart a bit, our internationals dont seemed to have come back yet, and there were still bits of lazy defending and misreads
If some of your passes stuck we could have been in trouble

Also, what did you guys do to Ash Handly! every time he plays you he is like a man possessed! By far our best back

I'd quite happily release him. He's so inconsistent, sometimes in the same game. He's a shadow of the player we signed and still a liability in defence.

Fear for the next two games now on that performance, it is all one dimensional, all that Walsh has in the bag is to kick high into the corner, I remember when we used to call union for being kick, kick, kick! wonder if at times our referees can be too matey, then players feel they can argue back?

I've watched the game back this morning and both teams were nowhere near the standard required. So many errors and defensive weaknesses all over the place.

I don't think Leeds were any better/worse than us

Difference with us and Leeds is they have a number of strike players and I honestly don't think we have one strike player in the team.

Shambolic performance , I'm really getting annoyed at KC's excuses too, Easter will not be a happy time!

I don't think we can fault the effort last night. Yes was started slow which effectively killed us but we got back into it and then conceded a try just 5 secs on clock which is a killer.

The team imo just isn't good enough. The players we've brought in are not up to the standard we expect.

We lack pace, we don't have strike players and we lack ideas which = no trophies which shows we didn't build on our grand final win

I think the game against Widnes will be our benchmark, we can always muster up some effort and enthusiasm in the derby against the Wigoons. Its Warrington and Widnes who are holding consistent form and not surprising being the most creative with some decent half backs.
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Its time KC forgets about the failing experiment (project) of Turner being at No 6, KC needs to stop messing about with Fages and give him a spell at No 6, he can't be so blinkered and dumb that we need creativity into the side instead of Walsh can kick, Wilkin can kick, Turner can kick.
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We are so predictable I,m surprised we are scoring so many trys, maybe its because super league is so bad at the moment and nothing to do with exciting play with the exception of Warrington and Widnes.

The other difference is they have a coach with a brain in his head who can articulate himself properly. That matters.

Friday should be "interesting".
Two teams without a creative bone in their bodies.
Who's going to barge their way to victory ?

Also sorted the defence out for the second half, Saints failed to get a point.

Thought the players showed tremendous effort - especially in the forwards. But aside from Walsh's odd forays with the ball and Roby we were utterly toothless in possession - not to mention as dumb as a rock.

I don't think the situation is anywhere near as dire as people are suggesting. We definitely lack depth of quality in the backs. But add a recovered Lomax, Percival, Swift and possibly Fages to the side which played last night and there's plenty of cutting edge to go with the effort.

Probably Wigan or Wire for top spot with Saints 3rd , anyones guess for who will get the 4th position

I think Warrington will have big year this season. Bought very well and have good depth in the squad. Wigan haven't played well this year but I think will come good as per usual. I can't see past those two.

I think we will struggle for top 4 this year tbh

It's a long, long, long season. Last season Leeds were fitter and more up for it than I've ever seen. By the last month of the season we were on our knees. Crawling to the finish line. Yes bully for warrington, they had a longer pre-season and have hit the ground at speed. Fast forward, say sandow picks up a knock, they're off their game and lose one, it's the end of the season and results have levelled out, they are feeling the aches far more and suddenly have an away trip to saints who have won 4 on the bounce and are hungry for blood, how do they go then?

Putting 50 on Cas when they've bent over and got the lube out in preperation for a cup final next week is neither here nor there. As always the true test will come for them when things are hard, not easy.

So Wigan are but they'll come good!
We're and we've no chance.

Go and watch netball you muppet!!!!!!!!!

More idiotic name calling on a forum. If you want to call me names, I'll see you good Friday and do it to my face mate. That's if you bother to go the games as you admit you don't go.

Wigan have better players than us. They are better coached than us and that's my reason I think they will come good mate.

Just pm me Mate about good Friday and I'll hopefully see you at Langtree. I'm not holding my breath as your a keyboard Warrior wirh no guts.

You a man or a muppet?

James Roby !

We run him into the ground so it's hard for him to be our strike player but he's a really important player for us. Take Robes and big Alex out the team and we in big trouble.

Agree robes is flogged too much too be a strike player anymore

Here we go again. THREATS. If you don't agree with me I'll see you behind the bike sheds. How old are you?

Wigan don't have better players than us.
They are definitely not better coached than us (Shaun Wane is still using McGuire's tactics from 4 years ago)

I'm sorry I called you a muppet as it seemed to offend you. Trouble is you make it hard for me not to think it.

I would be interested to see on a comparative list just who you think is better in the Wigan 17 than ours. Subjective I know, but interesting!