we have eastmond, cayless(still saints player), maurie, wheeler, bryn out.

Lomax, longy and robes just back

You're talking about players who have had very little first grade action. Not Eastmond, but the others are all ex-academy players so they are going to take time to build up.

Clough is a real hard worker but we have had to use him more as a prop of late since Faz got injured. That isn't his role, though, so he's bound not to be at his best when not being used to his potential. That he still commits himself 100% even when being asked to play out of position in a spot he isn't really built for is a great thing.

Lomax will be out.

But our full first team doesn't include Eastmond in that he has yet to earn his spot. I could count Wheeler but that would be Wheeler/Dean, depending on who plays the centre spot. So, ok, I give you three players out: Wheeler, Faz and Hargreaves. We managed perfectly fine without Cayless for most of last season so his absence should have absolutely no effect on us this season.

While we may be weaker going forward because of the lack of Faz (no insult intended to Emmitt or Ashurst/Dixon), there is no excuse from here on in at all for not playing well since we have easily a strong enough side of experienced players left on the pitch to do the business.

yes i agree with that i not suggesting he isnt committed to the cause , just to me hes nothing more than average, but i can only really comment on the games i have seen, you will have seen him more than me so i take your point.

It's amazing how form can be turned around so quickly. Remember last year when we trounced Leeds 38-10 in the Play Offs? Two weeks later they beat us when it really mattered. Some fans have already waved the white flag, yet I doubt the Saints squad have.

I reckon they will click back in gear for the playoffs, no distraction now with the challege cup and big impact players coming back into the side.

I hope they haven't but I do have my white flag on standby.

I suspect that the Sts team and coaching staff, having seen what's happened the last two years, are focused on the play-offs and - assuming you get there - winning the GF. Form at this stage is close to meaningless given that we're a long way from old Trafford. All that matters is getting to the GF in the first place. I doubt either Leeds or Sts will give much attention to the result next Friday.

Lets be frank - for all their relative improvement, its hard to see any of Wire, Hudss or KR actually winning the comp. One getting to the final maybe.

Especially since its looking less likely that Wire will be in the playoffs now

Disagree to a large extent.

Saints are playing too much one out Rugby without the weapons to do this against top tier opponents.

When the ball is spread to the backs it is the same move time in time oput, the dummy runner and Pryce receiving the ball at an angle.

Is it any coincidence we have scored 10 points against Hudds and Hull KR, 12 against their reserves and 10 points against Salford recently? Not exactly a sign of a sparkling attack.

Our tactics are pretty predictable. When the game was faster, it was much harder to defend against, even when teams knew what was coming. When you have backpedalling defence, it is one thing knowing what the opposition will do, but its another actually stopping it.

Now teams know how we play, they know our deficiencies and they can slow the game down sufficiently to have a well set defence then smother our attack.

Our plan B is difficult, because of a lack of pace out wide, and a lack of power with our second rowers ill suited to a slower game.

Yes I agree, I think you have picked up on another good point that the slowing down of the game this season has blunted us a bit.

To me I think we need another Darren Albert style of player - fast and not often making any mistakes.

I would say it's been one of the major reasons for our apparent staleness in attack.

That and the lack of guile at times due to injuries at 7 and 9 at various points in the season.

Some people are going to be pretty embarrassed after reading this particular pearler of a thread.

I wonder what General Zod is thinking now?

I just had to hark back to this gem.....

I doubt anyone is kneeling before him.