I'd agree with that. There's plenty of cheating or attempts at cheating on the rugby pitch as well as the football pitch. Tomkins constant wriggling and flailing around at the ptb for instance is an attempt to gain a penalty, or players diving at the ptb.
If rugby league were scrutinised as closely as football then I think people would say rugby league players were diving cheats.
I do think though that there is a more respectful attitude on the rugby league pitch. Whilst not perfect, there is certainly a lot more respect toward the referee, and there certainly is toward opposing players and the fans. It is very very rare to see a player make gestures toward or antagonise opposition fans, whereas in football you regularly see players deliberately celebrate at opposition fans.

I just think that in general there is a less selfish attitude in rugby league than football. I think that goes for the fans too. Obviously there are incidents. Whenever you get thousands of people in one place there's going to be an idiot somewhere, but in general these incidents are far more commonplace at football grounds than at rugby league. Partly due to the nature of the game, every single score is vital and could easily be the winner, whereas it's unlikely to be in rugby league, but also I think that selfishness on the the pitch in football seeps its way into the crowd and creates or at least encourages an "us & them" attitude. You only need to see how when 2 clubs in Man Utd & Liverpool put their minds to it they can decrease tensions between 2 sets of fans. A few complimentary words for the opposition, a few pleas for sense to prevail from both sides and you get a far less intimidating atmosphere at the game.
I don't have figures for it but from my observations of crowds on tv and at games there appear to be proportionately far fewer families at football games than at rugby league games, and far more small groups of lads/men. This is probably part of the problem. If you're with your family you're far less likely to get worked up and shout/do stupid things and less likely to be tanked up before the game.
To put the 2 sports into some sort of, albeit anecdotal, context, on the way out of Wembley this year, despite the odd drunken group here and there, we were told "good luck for the rest of the year" by at least 3 different groups of Wire fans, got chatting about the game with some Wigan fans on the tube, and some Bradford fans in the train station.
Whilst I don't think it's some kind of carnal slaughterhouse, I can't imagine that happening to the same extent at the FA Cup Final between 2 rival teams.

At local level the respect isn't bad. You get the odd player and odd team but i found the same when i played RL. All in all its not bad. Football is so heavily scrutinised in the media every minor thing is blown up. When in sydney RL was the same. On all the front pages.

Yeah I've no idea what football is like at lower level, and I've found RL to often be terrible with regard respect toward the ref and opposition at lower level. A few years ago I was tempted to take the refereeing course, a few games watching Yorkshire & Pennine League games of varying age groups made me think I don't need the hassle.
You're spot on with regard the media scrutiny. We also have a habit of seeing players on the pitch and take their actions on the pitch and assume that's the kind of person they are, whereas I'm sure most of them are perfectly decent people. An example from RL would be Carl Ablett, on the pitch he can come across as a bit of a pillock at times (to opposition fans anyway), off the pitch he's the complete opposite.
I think the biggest difference is in the fans rather than the players. If the FA wanted to stop players disrespecting the ref and from diving they could do quite easily. But I think the nature of the game where every point is so important, often irresponsible players and managers, and the different proportions of families v groups of lads are responsible for a large part of the "problem fans" issue.
Having said that it doesn't help players image when vastly rich and privileged players like Cristiano Ronaldo come out in the press and compare themselves to slaves. Then you see the likes of Sir Kev getting knocked out on the pitch and carrying on or Paul Wood literally working his b@llocks off for half of a weeks wage given to that mincing Portuguese tart.

what a dunce - should have got some of this - search Keeper tackles fan from behind. Red card ref! on that well known video site



and one for all the leeds utd fans - Peter Schmeichel Gives a lesson to a Galatasray fan.flv

seriousley though the keeper made a real meal of that... but discraceful behaviour.

and can i add...search on that same well known site for----JAMES HARRISON TACKLES CLEVELAND FAN......a thing of beauty to watch hehee...........

It was a very bad night for football and in particular for Leeds United. I am afraid to say that over the years United supporters appear to be some of the worst in the country, to name a few examples Paris 1975, Birmingham 1985, Bournmouth 1989 and Bradford 1986. The club seems to attract some of the worst elements of society. It is not that long ago United's ground like several others were fully of NF and British Movement supporters. I hope the thug is sent to prison and also the so called supporters who were chucking the seats.

But in regards to the comments by Mr Jones about vile charts, I am afraid all club supporters tend to chart things like that. It is wrong, but alias RL club supporters are no angels, think of the chants at Sean Long, James Graham to name but a few.

Whilst there are a couple of chants in RL that aren't very nice (I especially don't like the "get your fathers gun" chant, not because of the getting the gun bit but because I hate the use of the word scum) I don't think taking the mickey out of someone's hairstyle or calling them fat is in the same league as revelling in the deaths of opposition players or fans.

I've no idea what was being chanted at Jones although I can probably guess. If correct, it's far more unpleasant than anything I've ever heard directed towards either Long or Graham. Given Jones' trial and sunsequent acquittal, his reaction comes as no surprise whatsoever and I don't blame him for it one bit. If well-behaved Leeds fans don't appreciate being tarred with the same brush then they should take more obvious steps to put their own house in order, as opposed to justifying the actions of their comrades by finger pointing at the opposition fans.

I thionk it's silly and incorrect to claim that all football fans are "vile" or that it's the whole sport. I played at various levels of amateur football from the age of 7 to the age of 29 when my ankles decided it was time for me to hang the boots up. I can honestly say that the standards of behaviour and respect throughout the amateur game in that game was vastly better than what you see at the top. You get idiots, but mostly they're dealt with (often by their own team) and you even get the occasional team that are not doing things in the right spirit, but they're a minority. I can think of 3 across 6 or 7 leagues I've played in.

I have long since lost interest in top level football. I used to watch Guiseley before I moved away from the area, and watch Leamington occasionally now. Again, the attitudes of fans and players are very different to what you see on TV in my experience. I daresay you could find trouble on the terraces, but trouble has never come looking for me, home or away with Guiseley. And since we used to use Guiseley away trips to places like Whitby and Kendal as an annual p*ss up, I'm sure we attracted enough attention. Our presence (not to mention bar takings) was always welcomed and we always behaved in a fashion best described as silly and had a good laugh with the locals.

My last several visits to top-level football were sometimes fine, but sometimes unpleasant. I was put off Elland Road by being there on the day of the Hillsborough disaster. At half time it was announced that the semi final had been abandoned and there had been fatalities in the crowd. Those who cheered were a minority I suppose, but it was not a small number. I'm sure my experiences would have been similar at many grounds around the country that day. To be fair, that was a low point, but I've often found the atmosphere at grounds I've been to (Leeds, Sheff Utd, Man City, Everton, Villa mostly) unpleasant. Not always, or I would have stopped going sooner, but often enough.

However, "football" or "society" can go on the register of things, along with the police and stewards that anybody involved in hideous chanting, vandalism and violence don't get to blame for their actions. They're (mostly) supposed to be adults, they can be responsible for what they do and say.

I'm stgill sticking to RL. The product and the behaviour both on and off the field is not perfect (noted Tad) but it is, in my opinion, far, far better if you're comparing the elite levels of the two sports.

From what I've heard both sets of fans were singing provocative and insulting things. Thats football for you. There is banter and stuff at Rugby, but not at that level. Whatever the atmosphere though there is no excuse for going onto the pitch and assaulting a player. The guy should be locked up for a bit, and I think both clubs need to look at some of their policies in this area

Leeds fans the only ones singing during the George Best minute silence, even the scousers respected it, always thought the LUFC fans have been a bit classless, surprising though that a team only a few miles up the road (yourselves) have always imo been very good.

I don't know that anyone is taking any moral high ground, just pointing out that to cheat the referee is almost part of the rules of the game of professional football and if we picked any video of any match played in the last ten years then we'd be able to point to examples, together with the faking injury examples.

Its a corrupt game played by cheats, and called "The Beautiful Game" by a press that rely on it to fill at least six back pages every day.

I think that whilst there is undoubtedly cheating in games (ball ripping, deliberate high shots, facials etc), I don't think these events have a game defining impact. You don't get players acting to get other players sent off. You don't really get people cheating to get tries or penalties. Obviously there are exceptions but the problem is much worse in football than anything else

Leeds United fan Aaron Cawley has been jailed for four months after pleading guilty to assaulting Sheffield Wednesday goalkeeper Chris Kirkland.
Prosecutor Paul Macaulay said Cawley told police he had drunk several cans of Stella Artois on Friday morning, three-quarters of a litre of vodka and a further seven to 10 pints of cider after arriving in Sheffield.
Cawley, 21, from Cheltenham, appeared at Sheffield Magistrates' Court and pleaded guilty to assault and invading the pitch during a highly-charged game at Hillsborough, which ended 1-1. The court heard he had been the subject of two football banning orders in the past, which he had breached four times.

I am surprised he was able to walk after that amount of alchol consumption.

Not only that but he can afford to do it all whilst being on the dole

I suspect a combination of the circumstances in which trhe push was administered (being on the field of play is an offence in the first place) and the fact that he had previously breached his banning orders on multiple occasions might have forced the judge's hand a bit.

I agree that the Mail/Express reading masses are too quick to call for jail, but in this case it seems most other options have been exhausted doesn't it?

The breach of his banning order will have been the final straw as far as the judge was concerned . Obviously the courts take a dim view of anybody ignoring the courts orders.

And going on facebook or whatever and boasting about the incident won't have helped. Courts like remorse.

It's all about which side of the river you're from. Them southerners are a different breed.

Not a bad result for the lad , with time off for a guilty plea should be out for the Boxing day game

how does someone with a banning order get an away ticket from Elland Road, I thought they were restricted to members only. Has papa smurf changed the rules ?

Got a friend to buy it for him?

You do, but very few clubs actually check the membership card and the match ticket to see if the names match. It'd only be at clubs that are forced to (ie, Millwall) where he'd be likely to be noticed.

He was apparently arrested last time he breached his order with a match ticket for Coventry and his mate's membership card.

He claimed he was off to a shopping centre in Birmingham.... with a rail ticket for travel to Coventry. Which is either 2 or 5 stops before Birmingham depending on which train you're on.

He should have been imprisoned then for the worst cover story of all time.