Switzerland isn't in the EU, and if you're paying £14 for anything branded McDonald's (other than shares) you're a bit daft.

Didn't fancy a long, waiter served mean at 11pm that would cost nearer £100. The fact it's not in the EU is irrelevant to exchange rates.

It's moved consistently between 1.5 - 1.23 over the last 5 years, back in 2003 it was 2-1, hardly a massive impact.

Did you take frosties, pot noddles and baked beans in your suitcase so you wouldn't have to eat foreign muck?

I cant believe that you're shocked but at least they let you in.



Switzerland is the polar opposite of the UK and super strict on immigration and it's a bit too late for the UK to follow that model.

Have you been here recently. Stuffed full of non-Eurpoean immigrants. Noisey bunch. Keep me awake with their shouting til 2.00am, which starts again at 6.00am. In between we have the street cleaning truck to keep me awake. Then the bin lorry. They all seem to make as much noise as they can to keep hotel residents awake. Tonight's snack about £70. At least it tasted rather Breyer than McDs.

It's gone a bit quite for some reason? Are the remainers (sorry - remoaners, so wittty b.t.w.) resigned to the inevitable & given up the fight? Are the Brexiteers finally realising the error of their ways? Either way, Boris finally decides to fess up. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... for-brexit

It's gone a bit quite for some reason? Are the remainers (sorry - remoaners, so wittty b.t.w.) resigned to the inevitable & given up the fight? Are the Brexiteers finally realising the error of their ways? Either way, Boris finally decides to fess up. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... for-brexit

In the end my leave vote was down to sheer bloody mindedness. Error of my ways? Not at all. If there was the same referendum tomorrow I'd still vote leave. If the referendum did one thing it called our own government out and exposed them for the useless bunch of s we all suspected they were. Cameron ran off like a naughty schoolboy, Osborne lost his bottle despite his cocksure swagger during the campaign, May proved she was a robot and Gove, BoJo & (A)IDS would have trouble exiting a revolving door never mind the EU.

Short term pain for long term gain. People with agendas to make leaving the EU seem as bad a decision as possible thus spiting their own face.
The ever widening trade gap between the UK and the EU which was going to get even bigger/faster was one of the reasons I voted to leave.

And if people think that forced migration by the United Nations* of people from the middle East to Western Europe by the tens/hundreds of millions is a good thing then you've no idea as to how this impacts in a massively detrimental way. *This is a UN mandate btw and is accessible online, they just don't say upfront how they are achieving this but it's there to see on TV.

Ah yes, that old chestnut, what is short term, two years, five years, twenty years?

I've posted this before, but worth repeating. At the start of the year I met a representative of several Chinese billionaires keen to invest in the UK - infrastructure, energy, property, he was exploring all sorts of options.

Seems the Chinese are supremely confident of the UK being in a strong and positive position within a 3-7 year timeframe. He even gave me figures: their analysts forecast a dip of up to 10% at most, followed by recovery of up to 20%. In his words, "if they're not guaranteed a return of at least 5-10% on their investment, whatever the timeframe, they won't touch it".

We should never have been in the situation we ended up in. Extricating ourselves won't be painless but it'll be worth it. Meanwhile mainland Europe is in the sh*t in a big way.

Is this the same type of investment that we currently have from French companies like EDF, investing heavily, for a guaranteed return on what should be government investment in our future energy needs.

With the Chinese, it really does depend on what sort of investment they are planning to make.

Beware of Greeks bearing gifts.

Indeed - the Tories don't support state owned industry - unless it's a foreign state, in which case they can fill their boots and enrich themselves with profits that could be reinvested, or go to the exchequer.

And protect the humble millions from inflation busting price rises (despite May's promises of a cap on energy bills

) and re invest in said utilities, instead of lining some Chinese of French billionaire's pockets.
Competition in the utilities markets in pure fallacy and we all fell for it.
25 years on we're all still waiting fro prices to come tumbling down, due to increased "competition".
Instead, we've jumped into bed with EDF, promising them a price for their electricity that will make May blush (although she will be long gone by then), instead of investing in our own energy generation.
I wonder how many government ministers get a sweetener for such deals ?

Brexit moron in chief David Davis certainly did ok out of it.

If he's been put in charge to stonewall the Europeans, he's doing a fine job.

It was also a joy to see May arranging a post brexit deal with the Japanese, surprisingly similar to the arrangement they've already sorted with the E.U.

Careful now, you're naively in danger of believing the BBC & Channel 4, in that the Brits are a shambles and the noble Germanics of the EU don't play negotiating games.

Whereas in fact the typical stalemate of an inflexible 27-country quagmire vs 1 country rears its head again. Unsubstantiated and unreasonable EU 'exit bill' demands certainly don't help.


I believe that was entirely the intention.

I don't give two hoots what any news channel tries to feed me, same as I give no credence to you stating "facts".

Prior to the election the Tories were hell bent on a "hard" brexit, then after they received a bloody nose their stance appeared to soften. But it now appears to me that, in order to achieve their original objective Davis & his acolytes have no intention of negotiating & hey presto their original aim is achieved.



What, to broker a deal similar to what we'd have got anyway?

Of course, you get your information from...where exactly?


Firstly, using the term 'hard Brexit' demonstrates that despite your statement above, you've soaked up plenty from the news channels. There is no 'hard' or 'soft' Brexit - there is only whatever the final agreement turns out to be. Fact is, we're leaving the EU, which means leaving the Customs Union and Single Market, despite the hot air still belching forth from certain idiotic politicians.

Davis 'has no intention of negotiating'? Do you really believe that rubbish?



Barnier was always going to talk the UK position down - he's been given an inflexible mandate and is trying to strengthen his position. He may not like the UK's opening position but that's how negotiations go. You'd rather the UK rolled over and gave in to their every demand? You must be a Corbyn supporter.




[url=https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/aug/31/theresa-may-secures-japanese-pledge-on-post-brexit-trade-dealWell, yes.[/url

And how do you think our negotiations are progressing ?

It still looks like time is advancing far quicker than the negotiations, especially with the EU27 not willing to budge until our "divorce" settlement figure is agreed, which the UK is trying desperately to leave until later.

It's all a long way from the "leave" campaigns rhetoric and it still seems clear that we will have some additional costs on our exports to the EU, which, although this is a 2 way street and there may well be tariffs in the opposite direction, it still seems somewhat different to the "plan" (assuming that there ever was a plan).

Whilst we may be able to achieve some cheaper imports from outside the EU, assuming that we can negotiate trade agreements with the likes of India and China, the major issue is where we plan to sell the products that we produce.

Our largest and closest market is always going to be the EU and even if we could reduce some of our costs on certain products they sure as hell wont allow the UK to "dump" cheap goods in the Eurozone.

The main battles have not started yet, so expect the political temperature to rise in the coming months. What's depressing is some of the bbc and left wing journalists taking the side of barnier and his cohorts. They plainly want to see us fail so they can gleefully point out they were right. Never mind that the damage that may occur to this country. As for the Labour Party it's veiws change on a day to day basis. So not much chance of support from them, the main purpose of corbyn is to bring down the government by any means possible. If that means destroying the country so be it. So far Davis has conducted negotiations in a fit and proper manner. When confronted with the demand of billions he has asked for a cost breakdown something barnier seems reluctant to provide. Also the demands totals seem to change on a day to day basis.
Unfortunately both main political parties are deeply divided on the main issues. I note that some on the Labour Party are indicating that we can stay in the customs union. This if we keep up with our annual payment. Stuff and nonsense the Americans sell millions to the ecc without paying tarrifs or any other fees. Why should we be expected to pay.

Could you please explain to me why tarrifs should be invoked. Clearly it's in everybody's best interest to trade freely especially so from the ecc side, seeing as they sell more to us than we sell to them.

Not from Tory H.Q.



There you go stating facts again, with a caveat that politicians with a differing view to you are idiots.



Inflexible mandate, whereas Davis's is so elastic isn't it?

As with pretty much all other nations, the EU will wish to "protect is member nations".
Just about everything coming into the EU currently attracts a tariff and that isn't going to change anytime soon and just because the UK were former members wont give them an exclusive arrangement.
There is just no way that we will be allowed to trade freely with the EU from outside, that would be "having our cake and eating it" and with all the noises coming out at the moment, we are more likely to leave with a bloody nose than get off scot free.
What message would it send out if any member could leave without penalty ??