My concern for the SL franchise award process is that the RFL are failing to make it fair and transparent once again and in doing so are likely to leave the decision open to legal challenge and ridicule from inside and outside the sport.

The reason for my concerns are nothing to do with the clubs likely to be “promoted” and “relegated”. I personally think Widnes should be awarded a franchise despite not having the best couple of league campaigns. As for who comes down, I neither know nor care.

My concern is that the award process may be considered illegal and that the RFL may be accused of double standards (no, never I hear you cry!). The reasoning being that the RFL has set criteria against which all clubs are to be assessed, then go on to say that a Championship club (Widnes?) will be awarded a franchise and the league will remain at 14 teams. This is in effect a statement that Widnes are not in direct competition with existing SL clubs for a franchise, i.e. Widnes ability to meet SL criteria is not required to be superior to that of the least capable SL club.

Previously clubs applying for a franchise signed a waiver on taking legal action over the decision (happy to be corrected if wrong), with the guarantee that someone is getting the boot, I cannot see SL clubs agreeing to it this time. This may leave the door open to a legal challenge on the grounds that all clubs are tendering an application to the RFL/SLE for the provision of a service (entertainment) and that all tenders have not been treated equally in the selection process.

The decision to stagger the announcement of selection and de-selection will further add to the inevitable fiasco as rumour and “leaks” cause a media circus with the potential for the de-selected club claiming it was unethical of the RFL to allow expenditure on team building/contracts/development when they knew they would be excluded from next years competition etc. That’s the best case scenario, I am concerned they are actually going to stagger the decision making process.

I don't see it being any different to the last time around. All clubs bar one will need to submit applications for 13 spots.. if you don't you're not in.. if you do then you will have to waive your right to legal dispute.

As for the leaks.. they will happen.. but quite often they are not leaks at all. Simply people guessing and spouting their opinions. In terms of staggering the decision making process. I think it is an excellent decision. The newly promoted club needs to play catch up and this time is priceless. I often thought that when promotion and relegation were about that the Champ season should end well before the SL season so that the promoted team had an opportunity to prepare and ready themselves.

Not really in 2009 we got a average of 3800 plus and some where freebies.This year no freebies and average over 3061 and a Northern Rail final. Merchandise and runners up prize money from this day out and we have 3 extra sponsors.Last year missed out by £100,000 and if can make the playoffs it be extra revenue.If all fails i am sure £250,000 wont kill Stobarts.As vikingman says the Lottery is generating money and viqi.

Thing is Chris you cannot enforce a waiver on a point of law, for example companies cannot refuse to employ you unless you sign a waiver stating you agree not to sue them for any transgression on their behalf.

Business law in the UK is extremely clear an the requirement for fairness in all tender/selection processes. If a lawyer can find precedent or believes it can be set in this case the RFL could be in trouble.

I would have thought that your club as the most likely i.e. dead certs

to receive a franchise would be the most keen to see a transparent decision making process. How tiring do you think it will get if this board is flooded with disgruntled fans of the relegated club stating how you never had to compete with their criteria performance.

The staggered decision/announcement is a disaster waiting to happen. I cannot understand why the "promoted" club needs longer under the franchise system than under regular P&R, the "relegated" club and its players are not given that grace to put their affairs in order. All I can see it doing is encouraging cost cutting next season when you get the nod. If it is a staggered decision it demonstrates the unfair nature of the process and makes a mockery of the RFL and the sport.

Having a million pound turnover in a season is relatively easy for any club , any decent accountant could ' filter ' money through an account to achieve it

That is providing you were aware of this requirement in sufficient time to do it

I would guess that some [ a clubs knew about this , and some [ the rest clubs didn't

Similarily , the 2,500 average crowd ' criteria ' only seems to have reared it's ugly head a couple of months ago

It would seem to me that your poor on field performance might have unnerved certain people in power resulting in a little fine tuning , not that this bothers me as it just means that only you will not be wasting money actually submitting an application

This is not a ' pop ' at your good selves or your proud club

As usual we [ the rest have been treated as idiots

Good isn't it

All the best

There were certainly plenty of things they could have tried before calling an end to P & R and introducing this farce of a system. One was, like you've said, ending the season earlier to give people time. Another is very simple, something that works in football, a transfer window which begins after the grand final and continues on until the start of the season. Or giving the newly promoted a one season grace period. There are plenty of things they could have tried and didn't. Probably because licensing benefits the chosen a lot more than P & R and that fixing the old system would have made licensing more difficult to introduce.

We had some builders working on our house yesterday who were from Widnes, i was passing conversation with them and we got onto rugby league. One of the lads said that he knew someone high up at Widnes and this is what he said.

This isn`t official of course, apparently you are either starting work or have finished work on a Sky TV hospitality area/function room at a cost of around £50k - £80k. I`m not sure if that includes a new commentary position, anyway thats the first part what he told me.

Secondly he said that you have already had the go ahead with your SL franchise and that the council are going to spend quite a bit of money on some areas that raised concerns, again thats not official as its just what he told me in conversation.

I hope the above turns out to be correct and that you get a SL franchise, i'm sure you will anyway as you have the backers, the stadium, a good potential SL fan base and in time you can get stronger on the pitch.

I work for a furnishings trimmings company and i can confirm that we have taken measurements of Eddie and Stevo's butt for the manufacture of soft black and white cushions for the said Sky Room. The name on the order is Mr S.O.C Stobbnes. Hmmm



Widnes are certainly pulling out all the stops. All you need now is a jacuzzi for Woody - just to hammer home the application. I hear Cuerdley Marsh is being sought after for that very purpose.

That would make sense tbh! As Sky whinged about our gantry hence why when on TV they smack a custom travelling one in our main stand

so you would of thought to please the pay masters and attract more stuff like semi finals and maybe internationals that a nice place for camera men's butties and big wigs seating would make sense for all!

That's be a typhoon then!

Wether figures are fiddled or not Widnes do not have the turnover required never mind how close to the required figure that might be. Are you suggesting the RFL are incompetant ? Maybe for example Barrow could tell them their average crowd is 2902 not 1902 and fiddle their turnover figures too.

Am I in the minority in thinking honesty is the best policy ?

True and that's what Widnes seem to be doing this season with crowds especially! Also we have had no free ticket offers this season so I guess that is to say... look here's are avaerage crowds and with not a single discount ticket on show either!

In terms of 1mill we were very close last time and have added 4/5 sponsors since then anyway! Hard to fiddle books as need to go through tax man as well!

I think you deserve a franchise. The way your club seems to be run is similar to Wigan since IL took over. You have the stadia and youth set up in place. But i think SL should have a presence in Cumbria, if it is 1 in 1 out i hope Barrow get it. FWIW i'd like to see Yourselves and Barrow replace Castleford and Wakefield.

We are honest and we have alot more in place than Fax,Barrow or Leigh.We are in pole postion,and we deserve to be after all our badluck.We have suffered enough this year.But a Northern Rail final for a poor season and what have Leigh done?



All i here from leigh and fax is moaning.

Not from me - i've supported your push for SL on many threads. What i find lamentable is the parody that you'll finish in seventh spot this year and get the license. That's not the fault of Widnes. I lay the blame entirely at the door of the RFL. It's their system that allows you to do this. Had you not won the NRC i'm damn sure you'd have had a squad this year that would have swept all before them aside. SOC has played the cards dealt to him correctly but it does nothing for the credibility of any "sport".

Oh, and Leigh and Fax should start with capital letters. Where's your respect !!

Widnes have more fans than anyone in the Championship of that there is no doubt.

It is not that I do not like Widnes because that is not true. What I cannot stomach is the idea that we have to meet criteria (which have been changed) and' when I say we' I mean all Championship clubs' to enable us to apply for a franchise.

And although Crusaders played at Neath tonight even Hunslet got a better gate than that last night.

I am totally against franchising because it rewards failure and even worse stifles ambitions of clubs who can't get one because of different rules which will be changed as and when to keep a team below where they should rightfully be if some overpaid underachieving clown at the RFL decides so.

Do you know how much Richard Lewis earned last year ? Since his appointment and the introduction of his daft experiment Non Relegation and all Championship crowds have declined.

He will say that is because of the recession but his salary has still gone up.

"Furnishings trimmings"? Upholsterers! They're called upholsterers. No wonder people don't take you seriously at times!

It's not even that. Hell, i don't know what we do! I'm just an accountant. And certainly yes, no-one should EVER take me seriously. I type out of my 'arris 100% of the time. There by the grace of Mods am i allowed to post on here

IMO Widnes should never have been relegated simple as. As a young kid starting off in rugby (late 70's) I followed Widnes for your success, as all kids do at 8 years old. I know I have given you lot a bit of stick over time but you should be first in line and I don't think many would disagree.
It's just a shame you haven't performed on the pitch but that will come once the squad is built. Good luck and I hope you beat Toulouse tomorrow and to SL.

Well i agree the system is unfair, and i have been disappointed with our season.I admit like to watch a winning team just like FAX.Happy now Littlerick?





=#FF0000Offthecuff, cut the swearing mate. You know the rules. Chris.

P.S. you could have said Littlethick or Littlehick, you just got lazy.

Why would you expect RL clubs to apply that policyu when messrs Lewis and Wood don't apply it.

Comment from RL forum on BBC last evening from John Ledger (RFL media bloke) "most Championship clubs run U18s and U20s sides"



=#FF0000(Removed) no such thing as U20s at Championship level this season for starters

=#FF0000Demon - you are welcome to post here but do not get around the swear filter again.

Chris

One thing which the licence system, under the current RFL dictatorship, was never meant to be.


If this were not the case, then no Championship club would ever be in a position to get a licence. Certain metrics can never be achieved in the lower league in the same way they can be in Super League. That doesn’t mean that a Championship club could not achieve better results on these metrics than the Current SL clubs under threat. In other words, Just by being in SL can improve certain metrics that the same club would not be able to achieve in the Championship, so your point is moot. Just by Widnes moving up to SL would up certain metrics to an extent that it betters several current SL clubs in areas where it now doesn’t while in the Championship. The same could probably be said for a couple more Championship clubs imo.

So, to try and judge CC/SL clubs on a purely like for like basis would be grossly unfair and not signify the likely potential of how any CC club would actually perform in SL. This would be just as likely, if not more so, to see legal action taken against the RFL imo.


Staggering the announcement makes perfect sense. Any Championship club given a licence will need plenty of time to build a competitive side. This will both help that club and strengthen the competitiveness of Super League. Having a new club left with a few scraps to pick up, in order to build a team, and will just be whipping boys sat at the bottom of the table, with little hope for that season. So, giving the advanced notice makes perfect sense.

Giving notice to the club to drop down would be a disaster for the remainder of that season for said club. It would make the remaining fixtures a complete joke and those results could well affect the standings of the SL table and thus its credibility!

Their gates, sponsors and other revenue streams would be affected far more if it is announced half way through the season than at the end. Either way, it will be disastrous for the demoted club.

Rumours and leaks will always be part of any team sport regardless. That’s the way it is. It will happen before the decision is made no matter when it is made, so it will make no difference at all.




It will be a disaster for whoever gets the boot, no matter what. These clubs will already be carrying SL sized debts anyway. Player contracts will become void should a club be demoted from SL. Some of these clubs – at least the ones likely to be booted out – have been making false promises about new stadiums for years. They all made promises of getting them built during the current licence period, and would have only themselves to blame should this then backfire financially.


Oh, and the whole process is unethical, and this has little to do with when clubs find out their fate.

This has been planned pretty much since Steve O’Connor took over. I think it was Andy Wilson who mentioned it after we were turned down for a licence (although it could’ve been Dave Hatfield}. He went on about a media hospitality area that will be built for the press and broadcasters, while reporting from a freezing cold dump – somewhere in Sooperdooperleagueland.

Yes, we know!

Don’t you think that you may be preaching to the wise here?

Well yes now it does