Let's get the controversy bandwagon rolling..

Assume 14 teams... Who's in who's out?

At the moment I think it will be the current 14 teams minus Wakefield or Castleford.
Salford seem to be moving along quite nicely now with their stadium and they've got the Manchester thing. Despite the projection of confidence that the two Wakefield District teams are both moving along with their stadiums there seems to be little real development.

I think out of the hopefuls we are still the best positioned to take the step up with some smart acquisitions.

Very difficult situation, in terms of balance it would be better to remove one of the Yorkshire teams. Wakefield and Cas stick out as the obvious choices but just who for the chop? Salford seem to be finally getting it together with the stadium but they have shocking support, will it increase with the new ground in a better location? you would think so.

My own thoughts are 2 will be dropped and Widnes and Toulouse will enter, they wont have the bottle to just drop one and will make the decision to drop both Cas and Wakey IMO. both on ground terms, this will give a boost to the championship clubs and whilst there will be moaning from each set of fans it wont be as bad as getting rid of 1. Toulouse will enter to boost the french national team giving Le Bobbie more choice.

Reading your posts I have to ask whether you think the decision for inclusion or exclusion is actually based upon any franchise criteria or is merely a "political", economic or completely arbitrary decision by the RFL as to who gets a SL berth?

To be honest I purely think the franchising system is nothing more than an elaborate scam for the RFL to cherry pick the members of SL.

I don't believe it is fair and it is about the furthest thing away from being transparent. Men in suits with agendas.

Anyone with any sort of intelligence and neutrality would come to this conclusion.

Personally going for Widnes in one of Cas / Wakey out! From what I hear Cas are financially better placed for the stadium but Wakey keep relying on having a better season to get through! If one can get a brick down by start of next season they'll be the one's staying IMO!

What reason can they give for letting Toulouse in after the 'leak' that caused outrage that they wouldn't need to get into GF?

As some have stated it will be between Cas and Wakefield. In my view Cas have the much stronger Case.

Wakefield have been in superleague since 1998 and have done very little to develop ground, or supporter base in fact I believe attendances are dropping. They have also sold their ground and spent half the money with none of the proceeds put towards a new ground. Despite the added financial boost from the sale of the ground and the money they get from SL they have still managed to get tangled up publicly owing money to the vat man and have to offload their better players on a regular basis to balance the books.

Spot on there!

After Cru's deabacle and Quins lacking investment SL needs sides who want to invest their SKY money on the team and facilities not one's that just want to take it to cover payments and debt!

Widnes up
Salford out
Cas and Wakey saved after promising to share a stadium.

2013 Crisis hit Harlequins finally call it a day. Toulouse take their place in 2014 after having won the GF two years running.

2015 SL to "expand" to two divisions of 10 with easier opportunities for P&R between the two via a series of exciting playoffs.

2017 Halifax re-sign Stanley Gene.

You know what? Im not so sure they will get the increase they hope for.

The old ground was in the middle of a very large area of housing in the middle of the main heart of Salford. Lots of roll-up customers i would expect, on foot etc. The new one will require the vast majority of fans to get in their cars (if they have them) and drive 5 miles out of town into the area of the trafford centre. It certainly wont be like Wire, where their new ground was effectively in the same general area albeit about quarter of a mile's walk from the old one and still slap bang in the middle of residential/town centre Warrington. They will need the people of Urmston and Flixton to make up that shortfall of walk-up traffic. Also just as an aside, Widnes used to have this problem once upon a time when the chemical companies were booming, but I cant believe how bad the smell is from the sewage works right by Barton Bridge there. Nasty.

I believe it is being capped as part of the proposal of works. But you are quite right.
As for the development. It will see quite a few new fans I reckon. How many people do you hear complaining about vandalism being done to their cars at the moment around the Willers.
Plus public transport to the area aint too shabby either.

My money is on the RFL keeping the current 14 teams. They didnt have the bottle last time and i cant see it bein different this time.

If i was a fan of a current SL team id be very disappointed if we were replaced..

Nes

So then there's no need nor incentive for clubs to progress and improve,they can just rest on their laurels safe in the knowledge that banishment to the lower leagues is unlikely.Sort of makes the whole thing pointless.

And our youth set up be a waste of time seen as we are in the top group.Best 5 including superleague teams.Think only saints,wigan and leeds above us?

They need to kick someone out or the game will simply stagnate! If the likes of Wakey can get away with not improving the ground dispite promising to do so where is the incentive elsewhere? If a Championship side (ex Toulouse) also doesn't get in especially Widnes with yoof & facilities then where is the incentive for any other side to build a new ground / set up yoof?

If they keep the same 14 it could be the death of the game below SL IMO and also the end of any dreams of a modern game played in top class stadiums and brining through lots of young quality players.

They have already stated one will be dropping down from Super League.

Ah but they state a lot of things - you don't actually believe that do u VM ???

Nes

I am no fan of the RL but I suspect they mean business this time.Nigel Wood said in an interview a few months back that we are in competition with other sports and entertainments for peoples time and money and in this day and age people expect modern,comfortable facilities.I just got the impression they are sick to the back teeth of promises from certain clubs and the antequated image of the game when televised from some grounds.What would be the point of this charade every 3 years if they are going to award a club with an inferior rating a SL licence above a club with a superior rating?It would just breed complacency with the established also rans doing nothing to make progress with stadia,facilities, etc because they will know that it doesn't really matter.

Stadia aren't the be all and end all for franchise though. It's set up so super league clubs can cover most criteria and get a B/C grade - enough to stay in. Championship clubs don't have a chance on any criteria except for the shiny stadia one - that wont get a B/C grade. Rules will only change for clubs the RFL want in there - were Crusaders really a C grade based on the facilities they had then, and why weren't they reassessed when they became a new club at the other end of Wales? Is there a criteria for them stating "has potential to get better if franchise moved around until they find somewhere that likes them?"

Closed shop. Lets not kid ourselves eh?

Widnes were on a C last time surely! We had two 'problems' the fact a new company effectively and also our youth production both those now dealt with!

Only Saints and Wigan. Widnes finished above Leeds.

You are totally off with that my friend; weaste (where the ground currently is) is one of the most lightly populated areas of the city due to crime thousands of people have now moved. The area where the new stadium will be situated will be slap bang in the middle of nearly four different area's there's irlam/cadishead. flixton/urmston. eccles/worsley trafford/sale these area's have 10 times the population of tiny weaste which I m not afraid to say has more immigrants and crime sponging families than anything else living there. Home fans don't like going to the willows never mind away fans the ground is in the total wrong area for a top league sporting team, the sooner were out the better. You can kind of match us to hull fc with there old boulevard ground being situated in a very similar type of area to weaste, its just not appealing to families to come and watch there team.

But what happens if you build it, and it doesn't attract the fans you want it to? And that's an if. Clearing the topsoil and not laying one brick doesn't convince me.

what makes you think it still wont be built? Salford city council have injected 10 million into the project and peel holdings 16 million the work has started the tender has been finalised lang orouke i believe have the contract, the guys are on site Digging the foundations as we speak, steel structural work will start in october, the wheel's been in motion for along time now, put it this way theres more chance of gordon brown being re-elected than the stadium not being built . Have a look on the scarlet turkey some detailed arcitecural drawings on there.

Heard all this one million times. And you've cleared the site before now. And you've all shown us pretty drawings. Doesn't matter a jot if there is no brickwork.

It's not that I don't believe it will be built, it's that, this is no different to what has been said before and it wasn't built then.