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| Quote ="MOT"That's correct it won't happen but it does make a change when both sets of fans can pretty much talk about it without it getting too silly.
One question I honestly don't know the answer to is would the rental agreement at the KC be void if the clubs merged? As it would probably be a different company?'"
Which would lead to another one - would you want it to be? Hull FC's current deal is in many ways theoretically extremely generous, but in practice maybe not that well suited to them now - especially if they want to increase crowds. And with bigger crowds being the main pro for a merger that would be an issue. If it were happening, which it isn't.
The (currently) above inflation increases in their ground rent would be a concern too.
I guess a genuine merger would be liable for both parties' contracts, hypothetically.
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| Quote ="MOT"That's correct it won't happen but it does make a change when both sets of fans can pretty much talk about it without it getting too silly.
One question I honestly don't know the answer to is would the rental agreement at the KC be void if the clubs merged? As it would probably be a different company?'"
IF there was a merger i could see the rugby being played at craven park and allam getting his wish of buying the KC.
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| Wigan will merge with saints ,,bradford with leeds hull with rovers,warrington with widness,all never gonna happen , still i suppose it gives us something to chat about,
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| I'm a fan of mergers where they're necessary, in the case of Hull it's not.
There's too many think mergers are something that should be pushed at all clubs regardless. They're not. They're a tool to be used in cases where there's no way certain clubs can be viable in the current form. If you take the baseline for being a long-term sustainable club as a 10k average attendance, then Wigan, Leeds, Warrington, st Helens & Hull FC are all over it with Bradford, Catalans & Hull KR being reasonably close to it. So no need for a cross-Hull merger.
Atm the only clubs looking like needing it in SL are Wakefield & Cas. Oldham & Rochdale if they ever wanted to compete in SL would need to. Quite possibly all 3 cumbrian teams if they wanted to be an SL side as well.
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| Quote ="Little Drummer Boy"I'm a fan of mergers where they're necessary, in the case of Hull it's not.
There's too many think mergers are something that should be pushed at all clubs regardless. They're not. They're a tool to be used in cases where there's no way certain clubs can be viable in the current form. If you take the baseline for being a long-term sustainable club as a 10k average attendance, then Wigan, Leeds, Warrington, st Helens & Hull FC are all over it with Bradford, Catalans & Hull KR being reasonably close to it. So no need for a cross-Hull merger.
Atm the only clubs looking like needing it in SL are Wakefield & Cas. Oldham & Rochdale if they ever wanted to compete in SL would need to. Quite possibly all 3 cumbrian teams if they wanted to be an SL side as well.'"
I thought Hull FC needed above 14K average attendance for long term sustainability?
Rovers stated they need that amount but I would not think the same rule applies to all clubs.
[urlhttp://www.thisishullandeastriding.co.uk/HULL-FC-Shocked-Pearson-blames-300k-loss/story-14379069-detail/story.html#axzz2RTYzcsDb[/url
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| sorry, I should clarify. On sub-10k any club will either struggle to mount any serious challenge or need a good deal of subsidy from a sugar daddy. Hull FC are over that level, Hul KR approaching it. I'm guessing FC would need 14-15k week in week out to mount a challenge for the SL title.
ATEOTD the RFL need to be picking the clubs with the capacity for 20k+ crowds as the mainstays of the league, and those with 10k+ as also-rans. If there are structural problems within a club (e.g. 10k is 1/4 of Cas's entire population) that will prevent them from reaching that level, a merger needs to be on the cards.
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| Quote ="The_Mighty_F90"I thought Hull FC needed above 14K average attendance for long term sustainability?
Rovers stated they need that amount but I would not think the same rule applies to all clubs.
[urlhttp://www.thisishullandeastriding.co.uk/HULL-FC-Shocked-Pearson-blames-300k-loss/story-14379069-detail/story.html#axzz2RTYzcsDb[/url'"
That's only about the hundreth time you've posted that and you still can't comprehend it.
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| Quote ="ComeOnYouUll"That's only about the hundreth time you've posted that and you still can't comprehend it.'"
What bit?
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| Quote ="The_Mighty_F90"What bit?'"
The word "towards". You seem to have a bit of a mental block with it, also with Pearson's quote "We will no doubt lose money again, but I knew that'd happen. It is not a problem."
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| If the merger was a success and City didnt go up, wouldnt it be great to tell Allam to replace the pitch if you want but it'll have to be November when we've finished with it.
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| Quote ="ComeOnYouUll"The word "towards". You seem to have a bit of a mental block with it, also with Pearson's quote "We will no doubt lose money again, but I knew that'd happen. It is not a problem."'"
Maybe you are the one that is reading it wrong.
It's quite simple really. You need to get back to 14,500 to balance the books.
What bit are you not getting? Maybe I can help.
Better still, Get Mrs B to explain it for you. Try and get her to limit her answer to 1000 words
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| Quote ="The_Mighty_F90"Maybe you are the one that is reading it wrong.
It's quite simple really. You need to get back to 14,500 to balance the books.
What bit are you not getting? Maybe I can help.
Better still, Get Mrs B to explain it for you. Try and get her to limit her answer to 1000 words'"
If you post the [idirect quote[/i from Pearson where he states a break-even figure of 14,500 then maybe people (including Rovers fans) will stop pointing and laughing at you. Until then all you're doing is embarrassing yourself. Repeatedly.
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| Quote ="Kosh"If you post the [idirect quote[/i from Pearson where he states a break-even figure of 14,500 then maybe people (including Rovers fans) will stop pointing and laughing at you. Until then all you're doing is embarrassing yourself. Repeatedly.'"
why not ban the halfwhit?
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| Quote ="Irregular Hoops"We would all complain and kick against it. Give it 10 years though and the next generation would not care. They would just want to support a powerful club. Which is what it would be.'"
Why would it be a powerful club? There is absolutely no grounding in that at all.
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| Quote ="Kosh"If you post the [idirect quote[/i from Pearson where he states a break-even figure of 14,500 then maybe people (including Rovers fans) will stop pointing and laughing at you. Until then all you're doing is embarrassing yourself. Repeatedly.'"
However, with much more investment still needed, Pearson says the club must get back towards the peak of 2007 – when the club averaged more than 14,500 fans – to balance the books.
[urlhttp://www.thisishullandeastriding.co.uk/HULL-FC-Shocked-Pearson-blames-300k-loss/story-14379069-detail/story.html#axzz2PYDWvqOm[/url
2010 crowd averages of 13,753 Hull FC post a £32,000 profit
2011 crowd averages of 12,418 Hull FC post a £250,000 loss
2012 crowd averages of 11,884 Hull FC post a £500,000 loss
Adam Pearson stated that he has had to invest a lot more money since taking over the club
so the slight profit of £32,000 in 2010 on the back of 13,753 averages would probably
need to increase due to the extra investment.
I don't think Minstergate is a step up from P&O and the club shop has a permanent sales on
so the other factors will not have improved profits.
What's your take on it?
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| Quote ="The_Mighty_F90"However, with much more investment still needed, Pearson says the club must get back towards the peak of 2007 – when the club averaged more than 14,500 fans – to balance the books.
[urlhttp://www.thisishullandeastriding.co.uk/HULL-FC-Shocked-Pearson-blames-300k-loss/story-14379069-detail/story.html#axzz2PYDWvqOm[/url
2010 crowd averages of 13,753 Hull FC post a £32,000 profit
2011 crowd averages of 12,418 Hull FC post a £250,000 loss
2012 crowd averages of 11,884 Hull FC post a £500,000 loss
Adam Pearson stated that he has had to invest a lot more money since taking over the club
so the slight profit of £32,000 in 2010 on the back of 13,753 averages would probably
need to increase due to the extra investment.
I don't think Minstergate is a step up from P&O and the club shop has a permanent sales on
so the other factors will not have improved profits.
What's your take on it?'"
I'll tell you my take on it. With FC fans on your board and KR fans on here all rambling on and on about the other teams finances, it tells me both sides aren't doing what we wish they'd both be doing - competing for and winning trophies. Bleak times.
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| Quote ="Smiggs"I'll tell you my take on it. With FC fans on your board and KR fans on here all rambling on and on about the other teams finances, it tells me both sides aren't doing what we wish they'd both be doing - competing for and winning trophies. Bleak times.'"
Bleak, boring, a chore to attend games. NOt sure about anyone else, but I have reached the point where I don't actually care if the clubs merged. If it meant that we could have some success, some PASSION more than anything, then it would be better.
I imagine in a pipe dream, everyone cheering on kids from Hull, with a few choice overseas players, and I reckon it would be great. Something needs to happen, or the game is going to die. IMO.
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| I once went towards Hawaii but stopped short and stayed in LA
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| Well I wouldn't be a fan of Hull Kingston FC (or whatever) if a merger happened, not through some small minded bitterness or pent up resentment, but simply because I am a fan of my club and if it didn't exist I wouldn't be passionate about going to another.
I follow what Hull City do because I'm interested but I support Hull FC because it's my team, for no other reason than it "just is" and always has been from about age 0. It would be much the same if it didn't exist any more (cue the mindless Gateshead comments from a knuckle dragger or two....I'm talking about the team you care about as an entity here not back room politics/business). So I'd be passively "interested" in what HKFC did, hell I might even go to the occasional game, but I wouldn't be a fan, and as such it wouldn't get my support, I.e. passion, regular financial support and commitment.
Arguments about the good of the game etc are all valid, and to most points I completely agree, but for me they are all moot because passion isn't something borne from the head it comes from the heart, and in that situation my heart wouldn't be in it any more.
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| Quote ="RugbyVillasBoy"Well I wouldn't be a fan of Hull Kingston FC (or whatever) if a merger happened, not through some small minded bitterness or pent up resentment, but simply because I am a fan of my club and if it didn't exist I wouldn't be passionate about going to another.
I follow what Hull City do because I'm interested but I support Hull FC because it's my team, for no other reason than it "just is" and always has been from about age 0. It would be much the same if it didn't exist any more (cue the mindless Gateshead comments from a knuckle dragger or two....I'm talking about the team you care about as an entity here not back room politics/business). So I'd be passively "interested" in what HKFC did, hell I might even go to the occasional game, but I wouldn't be a fan, and as such it wouldn't get my support, I.e. passion, regular financial support and commitment.
Arguments about the good of the game etc are all valid, and to most points I completely agree, but for me they are all moot because passion isn't something borne from the head it comes from the heart, and in that situation my heart wouldn't be in it any more.'"
Great post, which I'm sure resonates with the majority. There is another thing to consider though. At some point none of us were Hull FC fans, but for many different reasons we fell in love with the club. I was 20 when I went to my first RL game and loved it instantly. I don't think people can really dismiss [uever[/u supporting a merged club. There are lots of things in life I love now that I was never bothered about before, embracing new ideas/concepts/relationships is as much a part of life as respecting tradition and as I said earlier the world's moving at pace. I can't see it working because of initial resistance, but I also believe that Hull as a city should be the front runner to challenge Leeds and Wigan, and with the emphasis on youth development, 1 call on that pool of young players rather than 2 could secure the best talent in one premium club. If there were the financial backing, of course, which is other show stopper.
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| Not read the thread, but it will never happen.
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| I hear what you're saying Mrs B, and for some I'm sure it would be something they could get passionate about in time. But for me I grew up loving the team and I'm not sure i could get over that and re-love another now I'm a bit/lot older!
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| Quote ="The_Mighty_F90"However, with much more investment still needed, Pearson says the club must get back towards the peak of 2007 – when the club averaged more than 14,500 fans – to balance the books.
[urlhttp://www.thisishullandeastriding.co.uk/HULL-FC-Shocked-Pearson-blames-300k-loss/story-14379069-detail/story.html#axzz2PYDWvqOm[/url
2010 crowd averages of 13,753 Hull FC post a £32,000 profit
2011 crowd averages of 12,418 Hull FC post a £250,000 loss
[size=22012 crowd averages of 11,884 Hull FC post a £500,000 loss[/size
Adam Pearson stated that he has had to invest a lot more money since taking over the club
so the slight profit of £32,000 in 2010 on the back of 13,753 averages would probably
need to increase due to the extra investment.
I don't think Minstergate is a step up from P&O and the club shop has a permanent sales on
so the other factors will not have improved profits.
What's your take on it?'"
Didn't Pearson come out in press and state he had budgeted for a £500,000 loss as of the investment in the training facilities??
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| Quote ="heard1989"Didn't Pearson come out in press and state he had budgeted for a £500,000 loss as of the investment in the training facilities??'"
NO
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| Quote ="heard1989"Didn't Pearson come out in press and state he had budgeted for a £500,000 loss as of the investment in the training facilities??'"
Yes. He also said there would be no merger while he owned FC as well.
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