Manu has been a good player in a poor side for years. Ellis has been a top player in SL and the NRL. How anyone can say that losing Manu would take the shine off the Ellis deal is seriosuly in need of a reality check.

Manu not signing could be very good for the rest of the team imo and hes only gonna have two to three years to settle and then start playing good footy again at Saints which is a big ask for him. I reckon he'll end up regretting leaving more than we'll regret losing him

Are you suggesting Manu would be an average player in a good side ?

What would peoples take be on the situation if it was us getting Manu of saints . A 3 year deal at 32 and on big money . Think a lot would be unhappy so maybe gentle / McRae know what there doing . As much as I'd like him to stay its our most covered position with some already top players . Not exactly light in that department and also a couple of young back rowers coming through .I'd Be more happy getting a top english and overseas prop , which is what we"ll proberbly need .

No because Saints arnt a particularly good side. And not many players go to a new side and start ripping it up, they take time to settle especially seen as hes been here for six years.

Whats more baffling is that he's put up with playing with crap for years then suddenly things improve massively and he jumps ship. Strange

Saints are capable of being a very good side and have some quality.

no more so than FC

Manu is a very good player and I'm a big fan. He's a game changer and, IMO, one of the best back rowers in the SL.

Gareth Ellis is a class player. A world class player. He has been West Tigers' Player of the Year for 3 years, has rubbed shoulders with the best in the world and offers more then just a work horse type forward like some think.

I would love to keep both, but if there's a choice, it's a no brainer.

They are, but back row is an area I'm really not concerned about for next year. If he stays, great, but a back row of Ellis, Tickle, Whiting and Westerman is better than most in SL.

All we need to replace is Manu's impact, and the right prop signings could do that.

I am not disputing that, however to say Saints are not a particularly good side is a tad blinkered.

They've lost their sparkle IMO. They don't have players with that extra something that Saints teams have had in the past. They're in transition as much as us.

I don't disagree but I would still consider them a good side.

Ellis just brings so much more. When has Manu ever ripped apart a 'Wire' or a 'Wigan'?

I consider us a good side.

There's nothing to say that Ellis would have done in some of the Hull sides Manu has played in.

Manu's a regular in top tackle-busts though, and has a very good injury record. A very, very good player at this level, even if Ellis is excellent.

Ah the age old - player A might be leaving so even tho we've all raved about him for years he is clearly not very good. Unless of course he doesn't leave and then he will be back to being a brilliant player again. So obvious.

So do I , I was just responding to Seb saying Manu plays in poor FC side..

For the record I am disputing with my hubby, he claims Manu is not half the player Ellis is! he never reads these boards but he actually said he see's Ellis as another Menzies, how strange was that conversation after our discussion today

Unless he decides to leave, in which case he's shlte.

Oh I know, but Manu doesn't perform against these sides as he would against a Rovers, for example. Ellis would give us world class performances no matter who the opponent is, as he did at Leeds.

Has anyone said he's not very good?

I'm certainly not saying that, he has done brilliantly in the black and white and I hope he stays, but if he doesn't it wont mean the team will fall apart.

No, not shlte, don't think that's fair. Money-grabbing low-life Judas, possibly.

What is obvious is this kind of response to anyone who isn't on suicide watch because we're potentially losing a player.

I want Manu to stay, he's been excellent for us on the whole. My argument is he's nowhere near as good as Ellis, because he isn't.

Well summed up.

I think a few people are getting a little carried away here. And we haven't even had it confirmed that he's going yet.

No-one has said that. Merely that Ellis is a better player.

Manu plus Ellis would have been fantastic.

Minus Manu plus Ellis is still a positive.