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| Would like to show a little imagination to accomodate both if we can. Shaul is too promising to not be involved. He's already shown his potential and with the need to up our attacking options next season, Shaul needs to be part of taht.
What I like about Shaul is that he backs himself and also follows the ball when we are on the attack. His style is not too disimilar to Shaun Brisoce, Schofield and Steve Evans, who all scored lots of tries off the shoulder of a player making a break.
Therefore, if we don't play Shaul at Full Back, we should look at the option of playing him on the wing or centre. He's young enough to develop into these positions and when on the attack we could give him licence to roam and follow the play (for instance, in the 1980's Evans played in various back positions, but always backed up when we were on the attack).
Just a thought, but if we decide to go with McDonnell and let Shaul go on dual-register or loan, we may lose the impeteus of the early promise he has shown. Personally, i think he's a very exciting player and was even gaining plaudits from Stevo last night, which must be a first for a Hull player. (Whiting too in the same match)
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| Shaul for me, he is our future.
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| Quote ="Rugby Raider"Would like to show a little imagination to accomodate both if we can. Shaul is too promising to not be involved. He's already shown his potential and with the need to up our attacking options next season, Shaul needs to be part of taht.
What I like about Shaul is that he backs himself and also follows the ball when we are on the attack. His style is not too disimilar to Shaun Brisoce, Schofield and Steve Evans, who all scored lots of tries off the shoulder of a player making a break.
Therefore, if we don't play Shaul at Full Back, we should look at the option of playing him on the wing or centre. He's young enough to develop into these positions and when on the attack we could give him licence to roam and follow the play (for instance, in the 1980's Evans played in various back positions, but always backed up when we were on the attack).
Just a thought, but if we decide to go with McDonnell and let Shaul go on dual-register or loan, we may lose the impeteus of the early promise he has shown. Personally, i think he's a very exciting player and was even gaining plaudits from Stevo last night, which must be a first for a Hull player. (Whiting too in the same match)'"
My thoughts entirely. Next year when McDonnell is back there will be options and the chance to be creative. Its daft to be deciding now; form, injuries and other signings will need taking into account in any case.
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| Do we have any young wingers ready to step up soon?
Would it be an option to have McDonnell as wing and FB cover (if we get Biggs), have a young winger as a back up to the back up and offload Crookes for a bit more cover in the forwards?
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| Why on earth, when we have a great player do FC fans want to play them in another position?!
Its called competition for places!
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| Quote ="Diablo1967"Why on earth, when we have a great player do FC fans want to play them in another position?!
Its called competition for places!'"
But McDonnell [ihas[/i played wing. It's an option as they are both players who should be on the pitch. I think Shaul should retain the FB position because he's good enough now and will only improve with consistency there - he's the long term future at 1 to boot. Personally, I prefer his more direct style, too. (Although the harsh reality is that it is unlikely that at some point one will not need to provide injury back-up for the other.)
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| Even though i'd love Shaul to play there next season. I do feel he will take a seat for McDonnell and provide cover for him.
It will be McDonnell last season with us and then i think it will be Shaul's spot.
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| Bit silly all this for me.
Shaul is a future talent no doubt.
But currently Macdonal is better under the high ball,
A better passer of the ball
A better link man
Better defender.
Was 2nd stats wise to only Tompkins before being injured.
Shauls main attribute is his broken field running and support play.
For me Shannon still 1st choice come next yr, with shaul providing cover-which would give him some games
Also provide cover for wings which will provide more games n I would also duel reg him. Shannon will know he isn't gonna be getting a new deal with us irrespective of his form which should push him to put himself in the shop window, which should be beneficial for us n shaul come following season will be hopefully the finished article.
As I've said before its a lot like Sydney roosters situation with minicello n shek(next fullback superstar) for those who watch NRL
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| crooks n lineham both broke through last season, and was fantastic. but they both were handed squad numbers for this season. and it wasnt till they proved them selves this year that they were considered first choice by gentle, so working by that model. i reckon Shannon will get the number 1 shirt.
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| Shaul has broken through this season and has, on occasion, been fantastic. The rest of the time he has more than held his own. Man of the match (fans vote) in a high-pressure match on Friday, and he didn't show himself up at Wembley either. His nerves, confidence and decision-making are up to it, his cool head is one of his biggest assets. He'll improve with ball in hand, but he's one of the few who'll consitently look to back up and.... he scores tries. Don't break the momentum, I say.
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| Quote ="airliebird,runninglate!"Bit silly all this for me.
Shaul is a future talent no doubt.
But currently Macdonal is better under the high ball,
A better passer of the ball
A better link man
Better defender.
Was 2nd stats wise to only Tompkins before being injured.
Shauls main attribute is his broken field running and support play.
For me Shannon still 1st choice come next yr, with shaul providing cover-which would give him some games
Also provide cover for wings which will provide more games n I would also duel reg him. Shannon will know he isn't gonna be getting a new deal with us irrespective of his form which should push him to put himself in the shop window, which should be beneficial for us n shaul come following season will be hopefully the finished article.
As I've said before its a lot like Sydney roosters situation with minicello n shek(next fullback superstar) for those who watch NRL'"
With all due respect I disagree. And it's certainly not silly to be debating it. As I've said earlier, I believe McDonnell has been one of our better players this season - but he also has flaws in his game. He doesn't score enough tries (2 all season is a poor return) and IMO he isn't a great third pivot. His passing isn't good enough. Compare his try assists with likes of Tomkins or Hodgson. So whilst he's been good, he's not been good enough (IMO) to justify keeping a player of Shaul's undoubted ability and potential out of the side.
Shaul has gone beyond the point where sending him out on dual reg and playing against inferior opponents is going to help his development. Quite the opposite, it is more likely to stunt his development. We could play him on the wing, but if he's to realise his potential as a full back then he's needs to be playing in that position regularly against SL opposition.
If we agree that Shaul is Hull FC's future at full back, then based on his performances to date and his potential up curve it's a no brainer. Hull FC should be doing everything they can to maximise that potential as soon as possible, like we have with Lineham and, to a degree Crooks. That's tough on McDonnell, but that's professional sport.
Based purely on a playing front, Shaul is an excellent support player, a natural try scorer, and more direct when he returns the ball (backed up by his average metres per carry stat). So in some aspects of his play he actually outperforms McDonnell already.
With continued improvement and experience through SL game time I'd expect him to eclipse, or at least equal, McDonnell in several other aspects of full back play before too long. So looking at the bigger picture, it's Shaul all the way for me.
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| McDonnell has a very bad hamstring tear which may well rule him out of some/all of pre season and some of next season. Add to that a fairly high risk of recurrence and I would think that we will see Shaul at full back for the start of the year. Not much chance of him being dual registered now I don't believe. If only we had an A team competition McDonnell could work his way back to fitness and fight for his place through that route.
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| If some clubs get there way during the closed season the A team/ reserves could be about to make a comeback with rules in place to play so many under 23's with a splattering of over age players to replace the duel registration system. its been stated on some web sites and rugby media sites that the curent system is not working for the majority of clubs involved in club partnerships. This is coming from both super league clubs as well as those in the championship and championship one clubs.
If it does come about the clubs start running a reserve/A team it will mean the likes of Shaul, Kent, Hadley, Bowden and some of the over 19's that may be lost to the game as there late developers etc will be getting meaningful game time.
every week when not playing 1st Team games.
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| [urlhttp://www.therfl.co.uk/news/article/28870/shaul-building-brick-by-brick?[/url
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| Quote ="Mars"With all due respect I disagree. And it's certainly not silly to be debating it. As I've said earlier, I believe McDonnell has been one of our better players this season - but he also has flaws in his game. He doesn't score enough tries (2 all season is a poor return) and IMO he isn't a great third pivot. His passing isn't good enough. Compare his try assists with likes of Tomkins or Hodgson. So whilst he's been good, he's not been good enough (IMO) to justify keeping a player of Shaul's undoubted ability and potential out of the side.
Shaul has gone beyond the point where sending him out on dual reg and playing against inferior opponents is going to help his development. Quite the opposite, it is more likely to stunt his development. We could play him on the wing, but if he's to realise his potential as a full back then he's needs to be playing in that position regularly against SL opposition.
If we agree that Shaul is Hull FC's future at full back, then based on his performances to date and his potential up curve it's a no brainer. Hull FC should be doing everything they can to maximise that potential as soon as possible, like we have with Lineham and, to a degree Crooks. That's tough on McDonnell, but that's professional sport.
Based purely on a playing front, Shaul is an excellent support player, a natural try scorer, and more direct when he returns the ball (backed up by his average metres per carry stat). So in some aspects of his play he actually outperforms McDonnell already.
With continued improvement and experience through SL game time I'd expect him to eclipse, or at least equal, McDonnell in several other aspects of full back play before too long. So looking at the bigger picture, it's Shaul all the way for me.'"
Totally agree.
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| Won't AP have some say in this even tho he isn't the coach. Surely he can see what we can of the kid and won't want him getting snapped up by another team will he. Everyone has favourites but u got to play the best to win games not keep them cos of favouritism surely. I would give Shaul a go from the start
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| Won't AP have some say in this even tho he isn't the coach. Surely he can see what we can of the kid and won't want him getting snapped up by another team will he. Everyone has favourites but u got to play the best to win games not keep them cos of favouritism surely. I would give Shaul a go from the start
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| He will have a go from the start, McDonnell is going to miss the beginning of the season apparently. It'll be Shaul's to lose, but I would have Shannon as first choice still.
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| Quote ="giddyupoldfella"They'll both be injured all season, and Horne will play there
That's the Norm'"
Thank you Al Read.
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| Quote ="barton baird"Thank you Al Read.'"
Your welcome
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| McDonnell a decent pivot/good passing game? That has to be a joke - our attack used to come to a halt when he got the ball.
I really don't rate the guy that highly. In attack he isn't much of a threat, he isn't particularly quick or strong, doesn't score many tries, rarely backs-up & supports or gets on the end of grubbers. He's an elusive runner and very good at evading defenders with ball in hand, but that's pretty much it.
In defense, his one on one tackling is decent, he's alright under the highball, but has certainly had his moments. I don't think his positioning is that good when defending close to the line, not wanting to put his body where it hurts.
Yeah, Shaul for me (if you'd not already guessed).
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| Quote ="Airlie-bird"Won't AP have some say in this even tho he isn't the coach. Surely he can see what we can of the kid and won't want him getting snapped up by another team will he. Everyone has favourites but u got to play the best to win games not keep them cos of favouritism surely. I would give Shaul a go from the start'"
The Chairman may influence team selection at some clubs but I don't want to see it at Hull FC.
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| Quote ="Diogenes"The Chairman may influence team selection at a smaller, underachieving club, but I don't want to see it at Hull FC.'"
Edited for accuracy.
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| Really enjoying Shauls injection of pace and his try scoring at a time when we look a bit toothless in attack.
But then I wonder if the loss of McDonnell is the key factor in our attack looking short of ideas. Shannons combinations with the pivots were starting to pay off and his entry into the line either side was a key factor in our three-quarters looking dangerous.
Is the answer to our attacking problems as simple as us just having that extra man arriving in the line with perfect timing? Maybe this is an attribute Jamie still can learn from Shannon.
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| We need 2 full backs in the squad and it's great to have competition.
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