So you expect us to do 2 things that even Wigan didn't achieve last year?

I'd be happy with 5th if I thought we were a side capable of making an impression in the playoffs. League position is not necessarily the bottom line.

FWIW I think we'll finish 6th/7th, Rovers the other spot.

If we win the GF I'll let him off on those 2

I tend to agree. 5th would be OK if we don't go out of both the cup and play offs with a whimper again

Don't forget he coached us to Wembley in 2008 with a worse squad than he has now.

I'd be happy if we finished 8th...IF come playoff time we are in top form and look like we are capable of beating anyone.

grinding out wins all year and finishing mid-table is no good if we just flop in the playoffs like we did last season.

We should be expecting our 1st wembley win this year then

At last!....a positive post..........yeeehaaaaaaaaaa!!!!

All fairly reasonable with the exception of the 30 points. Every team will concede 30 a couple of times at least.

Also winning half the games against the sides mentioned would mean just one more win against them than last year. And if it wasn't for Radders I have no doubt we would have achieved that.

But we did have a very favourable draw that year TBH. We put in 1 decent defensive performance to see us home against Bradford, but other than that the only half-decent side we played was Saints. If it wasn't for the combination of Adam Dykes and Matt Peterson's ineptitude under the high ball we may well have lost to Wakey.

You can only play who you have in front of you and we did that to get to the final. That cannot be taken away from RA.

And we cheated

I appreciate that, but my initial point was that you can't win a trophy without a knockout stage and Agar's weakness seems to be devising suitable gameplans against other contenders or being able to change things up when the game's going against you. 2008 was still a similar story, as we lost to the only real contenders we played.

Anyone hear Longy on Humberside? I thought I was feeling negative about the season but he's just as down! Thin squad , problems in the halves if he gets injured , some way behind the top 5 , need a couple more signings , needs the pressure of captaincy off so that he doesn't have to do the off field stuff and can try to keep fit and concentrate on his game. Guess it's pretty realistic stuff really just unusual to hear the unsanitised , unspun , version from an official FC source. Maybe RH recorded it last week before Phelps was announced? If not , he didn't sound very confident.

With respect Tom, I have never really understood that quote.

Going round and beating up little wimps, does not make you a hard man does it?

Good job he never posted his concerns on here he would get slated for being negative

OK, I'll swap the not conceding 30 points in any game with winning at least 1 play off game

He's probably in the agar out crew

What about these comments from Sam Moa in Rugby League World magazine?

Yeah but we're gonna be great in 2012

Im 100% with you Jake. Just cant believe other people are happy with things as they are and think we can actually challenge for anything.

It just mirrors life though mate. Some people are happy because things could be worse, the rest of us see the potential and feel frustrated that we're not achieving it.

At the very least, a club the size of Hull, with all of it's resources, should go into every season with a realistic expectation of being able to get to the grand final and win it and go into every game confident they have the playing personnel and the gameplan to beat any side in the league. We're some way off that IMO

Blimey. Although we barely got a mention on the SL preview last night, and I wasn't giving it my full attention, the thing that struck me most was how Wigan's coach Maguire came across. Full of energy, determined, already parked last season and ready to go, and got the impression that with his sense of authority and gravitas, was someone you could absolutely believe had a nailed down plan and was ready to execute it. If I were a Wigan fan I'd be buzzing. The majority of the other coaches were miles off this standard. I know the competition's not won in the pre season press days, but feck me, if it were, Wigan have both trophies in the cabinet.

I just dont understand how people can be happy with things at FC at present. I went to a few games last season and was shocked at how bad we was yet people seem to think that we can realistically challenge. All i can say is these people must be happy accepting mediocrity and lack any passion if they think that we are a good team.