This is a good point, well made in a fair and balanced way. I agree with everything in it... I feel a bit dizzy.... particularly the part that FC may need to look elsewhere (I believe there is no room for sentiment) - and also the fact that they ought to take his current issues into account (before acting too hastily).

Rich is contracted to 2011, he'll still only be 29, we just need to find his natural position and play him in it.

yes, and although I think that his condition may well be having an effect, I also think the whole set-up is affecting things: Agar's inexperience, injuries, playing in several positions, low confidence because of poor personal perfoemances (from one of our erstwhile most consistent performers) etc.

Agar's ineptitude
Playing behind a beaten pack
Playing with fellow "professionals" that don't give a to55, or have the right attitude.
Diabetes
Loss of weight
Playing outside Thorman

Maybe i am being unfair, and if our tactics stay the same next year and Long looks inconsistent i will have the same opinions. Tactics or not, beaten pack or not, world class players like Long and Berro should look like doing something every time they touch the ball. One or two glimpses a game from Berro just isnt enough and thats where im coming from. No excuses, he has been far worse than he should have and could have been for us. I cant wait to see him play next year behind a better pack and better tactics hopefully and im sure i will, it still doesnt stop me being disappointed with his last 2 years though.

I'm sorry, I just can't agree with that at all. It's not a one-man game, nobody can look like doing something every time they touch the ball. They can try and do something every time they have the chance, but they can't produce out of nothing without input from those around them. IMO Berrigan does look capable of making something happen most times he touches the ball, but when he looks around there simply aren't the right options available to him.

It's often said that real quality players produce when it counts and make the most of opportunities, and personally I think that's much closer to the truth (and what Berrigan has largely done in his time here) than to say they have to look great every match from start to finish.

It's also particularly difficult when a player is the only danger in the team, as the opposition base a lot of their game around stopping that individual. Who else do we have that teams need to watch? Berrigan and Manu are pretty much marked men in our side these last 2 years, that's another reason why they're not always effective.

I think all of us fans have been disappointed with the last 2 years, but I think it's unfair that you seem to be reserving more for Berrigan on the basis that he is a better player. The issue is more about those around him than what he is doing.

And the suggestion that Lee is playing better than him is way off IMO, perhaps just an OTT way to support your stance. Lee is playing better this year than he has in previous years, but he is still not amongst our best players in ability or form, whereas Berrigan is in at least one of those categories.

Motu
G.Horne
Thorman
Thackray
King
Lee
Maloney

Those wanting to bin Berrigan are even odder and clearly have serious deficiences when evaluating a players abilities.

agree with both observations, of the three, goodby Mr Lee.

Quite possibly, he is the only one of the three ooc at the end of this season.

It is clear that Long and Horne will be the halves so can Hull carry 3 hookers all season and keep them all happy???

The answer imo is no.

Tommy Lee is going to Salford.

We will have injuries in the halves at some point in the season I've no doubt of that and Berrigan will also pick up the odd injury here and there. Lee could well come in very handy in those situations. All of which is irrelevant as he is leaving anyway.

Hopefully.

Do you think McRae sees him as a 7?

We arent going to agree. Berro should be doing more.

Not OTT regards to 2nd paragraph imo, Lee has given far better distribution from the PTB consistently this season than Berro who has looked slow and laboured imo.

You're right, we're not. Berrigan should be doing more, just like everyone else. No more so, no less. But he does have the addition of being hampered by a monumentally poor PTB and next to no options to enable him to do much more than he already is.

And IMO the distribution from the PTB has been pretty even whoever's done it, they've all had good games and bad games, but largely average. Again, down to our PTB being poor, preventing our hookers from being in a good position to distribute particularly effectively. But in contrast to Lee, Berrigan also poses a threat when he takes on the line and has shown a decent kicking game more often.

Yeah your right, maybe he should drive the bus, and and do the coaching , whilst playing on 1 leg as well

Playing on 1 leg and still creates more than Thorman,Horne, wait till next season with a pack around him , can't wait to see a large slice of humble pie eaten

Nope!

Or Wakefield

Is it close

Given that we know Motu is leaving, I'd be pretty disappointed if more than 1 of the other 6 are here next year.

Well its just hear say like everyone else but close! Who said it would be only 7?

Spill