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| Bearing in mind the P&R this year, any points deduction might be deferred to 2015.
Relegation will mean the doors finally closing, I reckon and starting again at the very bottom.
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| If they are struggling year on year why dont the RFL step in & send them down & let a club like fev or halifax have a shot at SL, how many times can a club go through the mill like the bulls?
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| make or break season for the bulls under the new owners. need to claw back the lost supporters (over 3000 down last season) and be more competitive. sadly i feel they have left it too late for any quality recruitment and are going to struggle with or without a deduction. perhaps they need to go down a division and regroup, as they are in a financial mess trying to stay at this level. there is a danger they may become RLs equivalent of portsmouth
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| Quote ="the artist" and be more competitive. sadly i feel they have left it too late for any quality recruitment and are going to struggle with or without a deduction. '"
I know friendlies don't count for much but despite their problems they did put 30 on us pretty easily and without reply until a few minutes from the end. Now to me that suggests that , financial issues aside , if they're worried then we really ought not to be complacent or smug!
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| Quote ="Anakin Skywalker"Yep. As I just said on the VT I can see the bottom of SL being a bloodbath come the end of 2014.
London, Wakey and Bradford are in the mire as it is relegation will probably put them far deeper in it for years.'"
Call me a cynic but, do you think The RFL would let Wakey go to the wall whilst there's a Hetherington involved with the club???
The RFL should be renamed The Hetheringtons!
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| Quote ="easthull fc fan"If they are struggling year on year why dont the RFL step in & send them down & let a club like fev or halifax have a shot at SL, how many times can a club go through the mill like the bulls?'"
That seems a very sensible comment.
Surely time to tell them "time out" to sort themselves out and give someone else a go
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| Quote ="easthull fc fan"If they are struggling year on year why dont the RFL step in & send them down & let a club like fev or halifax have a shot at SL, how many times can a club go through the mill like the bulls?'"
At their peak what are the clubs highest average attendances?
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| It seems like a RFL facilitated administration, to draw a line under the Khan era. And other debts have not been written off. By itself, I'd be tempted to turn a blind eye to that.
They did still enter administration though and the RFL seemed to be sending out a much sterner message to Wakefield.
It's just the legacy of the half-assed licensing system, RFL 'discretion' and the 'wrong' club exploding. They're trying to make the best of a very bad job, but whatever they do now will look ridiculous because it is built on such ridiculous foundations.
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| Quote ="Mild Rover"whatever they do now will look ridiculous because it is built on such ridiculous foundations.'"
Covers most things administered by the RFL.
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| Quote ="Sheldon"At their peak what are the clubs highest average attendances?'"
Does it matter? The main factor should be, can they sustain themselves in the Super League without going broke every year.
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| Can I have my £1 back?
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| Quote ="hullbg"Does it matter? The main factor should be, can they sustain themselves in the Super League without going broke every year.'"
With small crowds they'd struggle. Bradford have the ability to be a big club, they can attract big crowds and good sponsorship.
Can Fev or Halifax?
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| Quote ="Sheldon"With small crowds they'd struggle. Bradford have the ability to be a big club, they can attract big crowds and good sponsorship.
Can Fev or Halifax?'"
The thing is though that two successive boards have made a tremendous hash of things at the Bulls. Enabled by the RFL. It's had, arguably negative, impacts on the wider sport. We had to abandon licensing before we'd had a chance to really see whether it would work, to save their brand. And it's become more toxic than iconic now. there's also that suspicion that the 'rules' would not have been bent to the same degree for other clubs. Ones that perhaps get smaller crowds and less lucrative sponsorship, but you have to at least aspire to something resembling fairness. That, or at least be honest about the system.
In fairness Wakefield also did a newco and weren't chucked out. Only because Crusaders went bust, but still. Wakefield also didn't give up any central funding, but then equally they weren't given any guarantees.
The rules, as I understand it, are that Bradford should have 6 points deducted, with the RFL free to reduce the penalty to 4 points at their discretion. This is, in one sense, harsh because the RFL seem to have wanted this outcome and helped achieve it. On the other hand Wakefield fans say their club was told they'd be out on their ear if they took the admin route again. I'm all for a bit of common sense and pragmatism, but the RFL have really tied themselves in a knot on this. The question really, is at what point do they cut their losses?
Hopefully the new TV deal will oil the economic mechanisms across the leagues and this'll happen less often.
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| Quote ="Sheldon"With small crowds they'd struggle. Bradford have the ability to be a big club, they can attract big crowds and good sponsorship.
Can Fev or Halifax?'"
i think you should change the word 'have' to 'had' out of your main sentence
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| Quote ="Mild Rover"The thing is though that two successive boards have made a tremendous hash of things at the Bulls. Enabled by the RFL. It's had, arguably negative, impacts on the wider sport. We had to abandon licensing before we'd had a chance to really see whether it would work, to save their brand. And it's become more toxic than iconic now. there's also that suspicion that the 'rules' would not have been bent to the same degree for other clubs. Ones that perhaps get smaller crowds and less lucrative sponsorship, but you have to at least aspire to something resembling fairness. That, or at least be honest about the system.
In fairness Wakefield also did a newco and weren't chucked out. Only because Crusaders went bust, but still. Wakefield also didn't give up any central funding, but then equally they weren't given any guarantees.
The rules, as I understand it, are that Bradford should have 6 points deducted, with the RFL free to reduce the penalty to 4 points at their discretion. This is, in one sense, harsh because the RFL seem to have wanted this outcome and helped achieve it. On the other hand Wakefield fans say their club was told they'd be out on their ear if they took the admin route again. I'm all for a bit of common sense and pragmatism, but the RFL have really tied themselves in a knot on this. The question really, is at what point do they cut their losses?
Hopefully the new TV deal will oil the economic mechanisms across the leagues and this'll happen less often.'"
I'm not saying I agree with it, but I can see why it's happening.
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| So can I but it goes against the rest of their policies which seem to be to plough more money from improved sponsorship , WC revenue and the new TV deal into the second tier whilst leaving SL clubs with the same amount despite most of them proving that they can't survive on that money without a sugar daddy.
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| -6
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| Ouch!
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| Bulls fans have my sympathy.
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| ..it gets much worse......
Quote BRADFORD BULLS chairman Mark Moore has announced that Bradford Bulls 2014 Ltd, the holding company which had a bid to purchase the club accepted last week, has today withdrawn its offer.'"
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| Full statement (basically they say it's the RFL's fault).....
Quote BRADFORD BULLS chairman Mark Moore has announced that Bradford Bulls 2014 Ltd, the holding company which had a bid to purchase the club accepted last week, has today withdrawn its offer.
On Thursday, Leeds-based administrator David Wilson accepted an offer from Bradford Bulls 2014 Ltd, which took initial control of the club after its former holding company, OK Bulls Ltd, entered administration last month, as the strongest.
However, commenting on behalf of the board of directors, Mr Moore has spoken of how he and his colleagues were left with little choice but to withdraw their proposal due to impending sanctions from the sport's governing body.
In a statement, the Bulls chairman said: “It is with great sadness and frustration that we have been led to this point.
"I believe that we have been forced into making this decision, due to the Rugby Football League's proposed sanction of a six-point deduction, making relegation almost a certainty.
"In addition, the governing body wished to place the club's licence into special measures, which, as successful businessmen, will likely taint our personal dealings while embarrassing us all professionally.
"I am also extremely surprised by the current position of the RFL, given the fact that they have guided us and advised us on the majority of decisions made over the past five to six months. We were more than grateful of their assistance, as they have been integral in getting us to this stage.
"More frustratingly, this process has been amplified by the fact that administration could have been avoided.
"Should the meeting held at the Provident Stadium, on January 9, which was designed to draw a line under the club's ownership and was chaired by the RFL, had followed its course properly and professionally then none of this would have occurred.
"The meeting included a quartet of important stakeholders, including Omar Khan and his associates, the club's debenture holder, representatives of the current board and, of the RFL, Ralph Rimmer and Blake Solly.
"Without following proper protocol, the RFL closed the meeting while discussions were still taking place and stakeholders were allowed to leave.
"No documents were signed and, as such, this led to a disagreement in the weeks which followed between one stakeholder and the other three.
"This poor leadership by the RFL was, I believe, detrimental to the ownership of the club being agreed amicably, which then ultimately led to it then being forced into administration.
"Due to the error made by the governing body, the players, staff and supporters have now been asked to suffer a six-point deduction along with heavy financial restrictions.
"It feels like a real slap in the face to our team, our partners, the sport and, most importantly, our supporters, of whom we have been working tirelessly for.
"On February 12, a meeting was held at Red Hall. We had not been given an agenda and the tough sanctions, imposed upon the club, were sprung upon us.
"The decision to place the club, by the RFL, into special measures was taken without key members of the RFL board having sight of the club's up-to-date cash-flow projections or our business plan, which we deem presumptuous as well as uninformed and unprofessional.
"Feedback from them leads us to believe that they had also made the decision based on inaccurate information, obtained without authorisation of the board.
"The business plan that we brought along to support our bid was not even asked for as the decision had already been made, leaving us with the impression that another objective is currently being played out.
"It needs to be pointed out also that this is the first relegation season for a number of years and the club has been functioning on only half of the central distribution funding for two years.
"It is equally important to point out that every other club in Super League is currently sharing the other half of the distribution money.
"Our desire was just to compete on a level playing field with the rest of the Super League.
"But with the sanctions imposed and the points above, I hope our supporters can agree that this is definitely not a level playing field and could be argued as anticompetitive.
"As a team we have worked tirelessly to turn the Bulls around.
"Each member of the board has taken responsibility for a different sector of the business, where we have reorganised the structure to help it become more sustainable while working towards profitability.
"Over the the last three months we have made cost savings of nearly £1,000,000 and, two games in, we believe we have proven our ability to stage Super League matches professionally.
"We have, time and time again been complemented for the measures we have put in place by RFL representatives, so have taken this complete lack of support with surprise and shock.
"We have also been very public and stated time and time again that we would be working with all genuine creditors as many of them are Bulls supporters, so this shows it was never the intention of the board to capitalise via administration.
"The dramas being played out over the past few months with the Bradford Bulls have been extremely tough on ourselves and our families.
"We have tried our very best to do what is right for both the club and the sport.
"We have been open and honest with the players and kept every promise made to them.
"The points deduction will hurt them most and we are very worried about their welfare, as they will view this mountain placed in front of them as something too tough to climb. As warriors we believe they will try their very best.
"The restrictions and penalties, placed on the club, leaves it all but impossible to grow the business in this relegation season.
"As such we were left with no other option than to withdraw the offer to the administrator, based on what we believe is an immoral position from the sport's governing body due to their involvement in this whole affair.
"I would like to thank all of the supporters, staff and players for the hard work they put in alongside us and please understand after all of the trials and tribulations experienced how gut wrenching it is to fall at this final hurdle.
"I would also like to thank sponsors and partners for whom we have made strong friendships with and also the administrator, David Wilson, for his professionalism during this entire process.
"We wish everyone all of the very best of luck for the future."
The club will be making no further comment at this time.'"
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| Quote ="ccs"Full statement (basically they say it's the RFL's fault).....'"
Bloody hell. This is a right mess.
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| Does that mean players contracts are null & void again ?
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| Quote ="B0NES"Does that mean players contracts are null & void again ?'"
And the vultures start to circle again.
Who would we want?
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| On a positive point for Carvell, does that mean now they have withdrawn the offer to buy they won't be taking Carvell to court over the transfer to Hull.
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