Do i know him, he seems to know me well!!

Totally misunderstanding where im coming from i think, as have a fair few on here. It would appear that having a critical opinion of how Hull FC is performing isnt permitted on here?

Perspective is we could be worse, but hey, perspective also is that we could and should be better, poor tactics have let us down. People can bury their heads all that they want but an big 3 or big 4 team would be 7 from 7 now looking at the fixtures we've had. I dont care where we were at this point last season and i dont care that we won a challenge cup in 2005, i care about our performances now and our inability to close out a game and play clinically.

i think most peoples arguments is 'we are only as good as our last game' and that was poor. I am still very optimistic this season but there are a few changes that need to be made, and this is the place people discuss them.

I agree wholeheartedly about the comparisons to last season, it is completely irrelevant.

If we did not allow criticism of the side on here we would have no threads



My only problem is people seem to be going overboard on the coaches rather than the players. You yourself have said you are trying not to citicism the players yet the coaches seem to copping the flak for the last two defeats.

Its funny how people say our tactics have been bad for a number of games because all I read on here after we had won 5 in a row was positive comments. I posted in a few threads highlighting that whilst we were winning our levels of performance were not that great and we need more ball movement etc.

Our tactics have been limited and it needs to improve but that has to be down to the players aswell as the coaches.

interesting I thought there was more poeple having ago about the players too much... yeaman, g horne, thorman etc

Depends doesnt it about coaches v players. If the coaches have set out the correct tactics and the players just havent executed then yes its the players. I very much doubt that though which is why im doubting the tactics. I think most realists on here would say that after 5 games all was rosey but most would admit that we hadnt really played well and put teams to bed though. We just played error free basic rugby and grinded out results. The Cas game the errors came back and cost us, The quins game the tactics seem to go ultra defensive to avoid making errors, and it cost us.

I think another point is, if people had posted that they weren't happy with the tactics after we had won 5 games, there'd have been the usual flood of posts criticising them for having that opinion after 5 wins. If people wait until we lose to express that opinion, they're seen as fickle!

You can't win, unless of course you just sit blindly by and think it's all tickety boo.

I think you are being a tad harsh on our early season results Dave TBH. We had to get off to a positive start on the back of last year (and that is relevant). We did grind out the wins but in a professional manner. We might not have hammered anyone but we also didnt just scrape these wins.

Only the Quins game would I put down to tactics as I think you could point to up to 6 individual player errors which cost us the 2 points that night.

Now is the time to kick on!

Agree its the time to kick on, but with the players we have im annoyed at continually seeing our 2 starting props over utilised, our bench under utilised, our centres and wingers only see the ball to clear the line defensively etc etc.

Its not new either, this is an error in our gameplan that weve had for the last few seasons. Weve reached some finals so it could be classed as a success, but i always believe you shouldnt just be happy with what youve been doing, you should always look at what you could do better and theres a hell of a lot imo we dont do well.

I agree totally that we should be looking to play a more expansive game and our 2 props are starting to look a bit jaded.

I personally dont like to see our centres scooting with little effect, it seems a waste to me (I know it gives the forwards a breather). Players like Motu and Raynor can get away with it because of their style.

I would like to see Hall used more as a pivot coming into the line but also appreciate he is still new to full back. Agar did state a more attack minded gameplan in time and I hope he delivers but having said that I would also always say get your defence sorted first!!!

Our defense was hindered v Cas by giving the ball up too much making us shatterd. V quins then had to make 150 first half tackles to our 110 so we should have had more in the tank, but their kicking game and our poor attack meant that they coasted it in the end. Poor showing.

We had a fairly strong wind behind our backs first half as well that we never used.

Anyway bad day at the office with tactics, etc. Roll on Sunday!

Just watching Boots n all again, Cullen made an interesting point that due to our 1 up play they only needed to put 2 men into each tackle. Watching Quins with the ball we were putting 3 or 4 into the tackle. Doesnt help. Also picked on G Hornes defence and Yeamo's defence, poor plays and poor reads.

Cullen keeps highlighting G Hornes defence close to the line doesnt he?

He picked on both Richard and Graeme as scoring some good tries but also being at fault. Yeamo's read for Clubbs try was poor from a GB centre too.

Still think G Horne has to keep hold of that centre shirt though, dont see Whiting taking it off him just yet. (think briscoe will when Raynor is back though, and if not Hall may when motu is back)

I have to say, I'm one of those who is negative, and has been for the majority of the season despite wins. I think those who slag people like me off are under the mentality that winning= ok, losing= nay ok. Although I like it when we win games, thats not the be all and end all for me.
Generally, I'm happy when I leave a game if I feel the players have played consistantly to their potential over 80 minutes and have tried their hearts out, allowing for the fact that you will generally get the odd game where this doesnt exactly happen. The Catalans game this season is the only time when I feel this has happened, so 6 games in 7 it hasn't which to me is not the 'odd game.'
I'm the type of person that looks at the bigger picture. I think about what types of teams win trophies. These teams are the teams that are consistant for 80 minutes a game, for the majority of a league campaign permitting they have players of sufficient quality. We aren't the best team in the league but I expect us to have a chance and at the moment I look at our performances and feel that no matter where we finish, the way we play, the effort etc, we will win nothing again.
We aren't consistant, in terms of the 80 minutes and over the course of a season, spell of games etc. We haven't had the latter since 2004. We came close in 2006 when Sharp took over but the next season proved it was a false dawn. We should have killed Wigan (the worse team I have seen us play since Leigh 2005), Bradford, Huddersfield and arguably Castleford off. We were very poor in patches against Celtic too and looked very unconvincing. We were terrible over 80 minutes full stop against Quins, and then the game I am pleased with against Catalans.
I wouldn't care if we had a crap team (in the short term anyway), I wouldn't care if we played very boring rugby (which we do half the time) etc etc. I'm fed up of all the false dawns.
If we had come 3rd last season, our start to this season wouldn't be looked at in amazement by the majority of our fans. We don't look like a team that would go well in the play-offs, or go well in the cup if we had a tough draw and thats all that matters. This isn't a league campaign like football where it doesn't matter how well you do as long as you get victories. In our league you have to get some victories but also show that you have the edge for knock out games. That we do not have, by a long shot

=blueI fail to see it as a choice that must be made. We have a few players not capable of the entertaining rugby we want, but we certainly have more than enough who are, we've seen them do it. We may not have the personnel capable of the kind of flowing stuff the top 2 play, but we play the dullest brand of rugby in SL. Something doesn't add up there if the Celtics and Salfords at the bottom of the table are still more varied and imaginative sides than us.