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| Quote ="Mr. Zucchini Head"We're as bad as Rovers, cant we just play by the rules?'"
But isn't that just the point - [uIF[/u this scenario were to happen we [uwould[/u be playing by the rules. The fact that the rules may be over-complex, practically indecipherable and open to ridicule and manipulation by all concerned doesn't mean that we wouldn't be playing by them. To my mind it is the rules that need to be clearer and simpler, so you can't blame any club for not taking advantage. Much as I'd love to see home grown talent, I guess most fans would also rather see us utilise the rules to the maximum in order to have a successful squad.
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| Quote ="Sheldon"If we got obst we could keep fitz over Mia or sign another 'full' quota player.
IMO we won't get better than Moa.'"
I see, could be another big mistake by Agar if he lets Moa go (unless it's Moa's choice).
This move would not go down well with the fans.
There aren't many props in SL I would swap for Moa and like you said we are unlikely to sign a better NRL prop IMO
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| Dave he could go to a very good NRL side, no club in sl has 4 props better than him.
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| Quote ="Dave K."I see, could be another big mistake by Agar if he lets Moa go (unless it's Moa's choice).
This move would not go down well with the fans.
There aren't many props in SL I would swap for Moa and like you said we are unlikely to sign a better NRL prop IMO'"
If we were re-signing moa we wouldn't need to get obst off the quota
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| Quote ="Old_Faithful_IAKW"Is Moa not resigning now?
Even if we can get Obst exempt from the quota, we'd still have one non-fed spot;
McKinnon, Heremenia, Seymour, O'Meley, Moa?'"
Hopefully yes.
As I understand it Ogre, Moa (if he signs), Heremaia, Seymour, McKinnon and Obst will take the 5 spots (even though there are 6 of them due to the new rules).
If Obst comes off then we could sign another player.
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| Quote ="Jake the Peg"If we were re-signing moa we wouldn't need to get obst off the quota'"
Maybe it's Obst who is trying to get off then, would give him more options for the future.
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| Quote ="Dave K."I see, could be another big mistake by Agar if he lets Moa go (unless it's Moa's choice).
This move would not go down well with the fans.
There aren't many props in SL I would swap for Moa and like you said we are unlikely to sign a better NRL prop IMO'"
The stumbling block may be that he and his agent may want too much money, Hull want to keep him but as props are in demand other clubs may be willing to chuck silly money about.
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| Quote ="PAUL M"Hopefully yes.
As I understand it Ogre, Moa (if he signs), Heremaia, Seymour, McKinnon and Obst will take the 5 spots (even though there are 6 of them due to the new rules).
If Obst comes off then we could sign another player.'"
obst is already non fed isn't he? As it stands, next year we have heremaia, seymour, mckinnon and o'meley already signed and non fed, leaving 1 spot available. We could re-sign lauaki or moa with the players we have or a quota/non fed player if obst comes off the quota. I don't think that obst getting a British passport means we could sign moa and another quota/non fed player
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| is O'meley definitely here next year, isn't his third year optional?
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| i thought obst was exempt just like manu is with him been here before the 2008 season?
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| Quote ="PAUL M"Hopefully yes.
As I understand it Ogre, Moa (if he signs), Heremaia, Seymour, McKinnon and Obst will take the 5 spots (even though there are 6 of them due to the new rules).
If Obst comes off then we could sign another player.'"
I know we're all confused by the quota/non-fed situation however my understanding was that FC current had;
Quota: Obst, Fitz, O'Meley and Phelps
Non-fed: Fitz, O'Meley, Phelps, Moa and Hame
You can have no more than a total of 5 on each list, next year we'd have
Quota: O'Meley, Heremeia, Seymour, McKinnon, Obst (unless exempt)
Non-fed: O'Meley, Heremeia, Seymour, Mckinnon and (hopefully) Moa.
Thus if we got Obst from the quota, we would only be able to sign a federation trained quota player. I'm not sure how many of them they are about and would be unhappy if we signed one tbh - It'd be cheating the quota system IMO. The only other way taking Obst from the quota is useful is if we don't sign Moa, we could then sign a quota non federation trained player as opposed to a non quota non federation trained player.
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| Quote ="Old_Faithful_IAKW"
Quota: O'Meley, Heremeia, Seymour, McKinnon, Obst (unless exempt)
Non-fed: O'Meley, Heremeia, Seymour, Mckinnon and (hopefully) Moa.
Thus if we got Obst from the quota, we would only be able to sign a federation trained quota player. I'm not sure how many of them they are about and would be unhappy if we signed one tbh - It'd be cheating the quota system IMO. The only other way taking Obst from the quota is useful is if we don't sign Moa, we could then sign a quota non federation trained player as opposed to a non quota non federation trained player.'"
That's my understanding of the situation, if Obst came off we might be able to bring in another player, assuming one in the right category is available.
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| Quote ="the cal train"is O'meley definitely here next year, isn't his third year optional?'"
Yes as far as he is concerned he is. I spoke to him in the gym last week and he said that he's got a few games to go and the 3rd year option auto kicks in.
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| Quote ="Jake the Peg"That would be my view. If we can't find a British player for what we need then move obst on to create the space. There would be plenty of takers.
We're trying to circumnavigate the quota rules for a player who probably won't even be in the 17 if everyone is fit.
About time we started developing our own players more effectively'"
Who was the last player we developed from youth to 1st team?
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| Quote ="GM1"Who was the last player we developed from youth to 1st team?'"
Tommy Lee/Craig Hall?
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| Quote ="GM1"Yes as far as he is concerned he is. I spoke to him in the gym last week and he said that he's got a few games to go and the 3rd year option auto kicks in.'"
thanks, it's just a friend of mine's sibling is in the same class as one of his kids, and he'd said there was talk of a move back to aus but guess not now
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| Quote ="GM1"Yes as far as he is concerned he is. I spoke to him in the gym last week and he said that he's got a few games to go and the 3rd year option auto kicks in.'"
17 games I believe it is
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| Quote ="knockersbumpMKII"Tommy Lee/Craig Hall?'"
Cheers - Says it all really!
A club as big as ours should be developing more players than that. Is it time we had a clearout and got a better team in to do the job?
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| Quote ="GM1"Who was the last player we developed from youth to 1st team?'"
briscoe, although he is such a great talent he didn't need much developing.
Before that it was houghton, then you have to go all the way back to yeaman. 2 first team regulars in nearly 10 years is rubbish
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| There shouldn't be any expectation that GB standard players should be rolling off the conveyor belt every year for one thing plus the East Riding is one of the least populated areas in the country, there's only the city of Hull itself and a few outlying villages, most of the other 'big' teams have more concentrated populations.
I'm not saying that the coaching set up is as good as it could be at Hull (far from it in fact) and I think our coaching staff are not up to the job of bringing talented youngsters through and as a consequence they give up on kids too quickly because of their own defiencies. I think Craig Hall is a prime example of a super talented kid who was badly let down by the club.
Briscoe didn't come through our Youth system as such, he was already 17 when we got him from Fev Lions was he not?
In any case I'd say Tom has needed quite a bit of development to meet what his potential could be. Defensively and positionally he is still shy of where I'd like to see a finished article and I don't think the club have given him what he needs in that respect.
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| the massive prolem is we have talented kids in the 18s and 20s all these names to watch out for ect but the step up from 20s to super league is huge and alot of the players cant cope with that. i will say it again alot of these better young players NEED to go out and play championsip rugby and play at a better level so when they do come up to super league the diffrence isnt as much and also people need to stop bigging players up to much
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| Quote ="Jake the Peg"briscoe, although he is such a great talent he didn't need much developing.
Before that it was houghton, then you have to go all the way back to yeaman. 2 first team regulars in nearly 10 years is rubbish'"
He came from Fev didn't he?
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| Quote ="hullbg"If Obst had been with us a while then fair enough but he hasn't been here a full season and we are already looking to make him an "English" player. Plenty of people have ridiculed Rovers for doing the self and same thing.'"
Just people on here, I cannot recall anyone from Hull FC commenting one way or the other. All clubs will seek to gain any advantage they can within the rules, it just goes to show that even with your long SL history and previous youth development, you still depend on a large number of overseas players. If (as expected) Galea, Clinton and Vella go home, you could end up with more overseas players than us
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| Quote ="GM1"He came from Fev didn't he?'"
Was trained up through the ranks here
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| Quote ="knockersbumpMKII"Tommy Lee/Craig Hall?'"
Houghtons younger then them 2 and made his debut later too
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