Thats up to the CAS mods, it ain't happening on here.

All I can say is that I am disgusted at this tax bill unpaid

I work hard for a living pay my tax, I have investments here and abroad as a result of which I have a tax consultant. I pay my taxes on time and in full. I thought we had sorted the tax out but the press release seems to imply differently. I have no sympathy for the BOD if they have not been paying taxes and NI since we had the payment plan agreed. I agree with another poster on here that its unlikely that HMRC would rip up a repayment plan. But if we have failed to pay whats due after then plan (not the repayments but current tax liabilities) then I can see why HMRC have had enough.

AS someone else has implied a business run as hobby. Sorry not good enough my money is staying in the bank for time being even though my worthless shares will be even more worthless!

your not wrong, i have stated many times on our own FC site that wakefield are one of the backbone clubs of super league and the whole of rugby league should rally to help never mind asking fans to donate, other clubs should be digging deep to help being paid back later on is my view but I am speaking because i truly feel in my heart for the locality , the businesses that will be effected, the future of rugby in the area and i know first hand how the players are feeling at wakefield right now because i have heard it from one or two mouths directly and it isnt good!!

It is time the rugby league stopped monkeying around with new developments and concentrate for a number of years on the heartlands and making sure that the current teams in all pro divisions have strong backbones to protect them in the years to come, instead of a management situation the RFL should become more benevolent and understanding towards the smaller revenue earning clubs and support them.
If they wish to make the super league a level playing field it makes more sense to concentrate of the heartlands and supporting the lower earning teams till they progress upwards with management advice, marketing advice so on and so forth along the lines of pooling information and resourses for instance why not send our marketing team to wakey for a week to advise and help with shop point of sale etc etc, send wigans cheerleeders in to wakey centre to hand out flyers etc, you know what i am saying all these small things can only help cant they??? i for one would be more than happy to help if i knew a way to help them....

whilst some are cold hearted and say "there is no conscience when it comes to business" take a moment to think of all the people who would loose their jobs if Wakey fold, were supposed to be a family sport so what about those families??? i know i am maybe a small minority but i feel so strongly about the way the RFL have thrown good money after bad in wales , london and other lost causes of cash . Rugby league is a northern M6/ M62 sport and thats what they should concentrate on in my opinion and that includes looking after our own if they are in trouble....

how super is super league if we let this club fold ... NOT

Addy,

I was also disgusted when it first came out about them not paying taxes and voiced it on here. The response then from the club sympathisers was along the lines of "all businesses do it, it's called managing cash-flow" well the club sympathisers have gone quiet recently, let's see how this cash-flow problem is managed!

Sorry expro , you cannot come on here and suggest that clubs work together for a common good , I suggested similar things for the Championships and was told in no uncertain terms that I was ' barking mad ' to suggest such a thing

Like many others in the recent past, I have been made redundant, and through no fault of my own. Twice in fact! No-one organised collections for me, and the others who lost work, many who still are on the dole, so while sad people may lose work, if they are good enough, the new owners would take them back on, surely?

We need to get our own house in order. The fact is, this ain't 1964 anymore. Clubs won't rally round for what is now a fully 'professional' sport (whether that is the case off the field at certain clubs is questionable.) If Wakefield are failing, we need to get back up under our own steam. We made the mess, we'll clean it up. Show some responsibility for our actions.

many companies have gone bust,
through no fault of there own due to their size they end up swimming amongst the sharks in the business pool and end either swallowed up or struggling to stay alive.
our problem is we haven't the money to invest with poor facilities we are just swimming in a circle, once we can break either of the two problems then we can start to restructure the club,

sad as it is for the staff like you say if their any good in their job they will find a position either with another club or the new Trin, life goes on

Nicely put, and I agree.

The latest release on the tax by the club mentions VAT and NI from recent months.

What does this mean then, that all of the fans who have bought season tickets and merchandise have paid 17.5% in good faith and the club has failed to to pass this to the tax man? Or can someone who knows about tax clarify to me what else VAT is payable on. The NI I believe relates to staff and payments in relation to employment

Some clarity would be useful

The WTWC's collect Vat and N.I. from customers and employees on behalf of the government and then pay it to the HMRC at set intervals.

It would appear they have collected but not passed it on and used the money for other puposes.

if true that would of been a desperate act for survival of the club

again snowie!

I agree this is my point.

I have purchased a season ticket and other merchandise and paid 17.5% before Christmas in good faith for this to be paid to the authorities. It is feasible that such monies have ben diverted from HMRC.

I know that the vat on my season ticket may only amount to £30 but multiply that up and its not long before you are into thousands of pounds and no wonder the bills mount up so quick.

i earn money honestly and spend it honestly and thats what I expect people to do with money I part with in good faith.

It's something that happens all the time in the big bad real world - the business 'shuffles' money around, delays payments, wheels and deals, especially when cash is tight in order to remain solvent.

Is it bollox.

It is theft, IMO. =#400000Using money that never was your own to fund your business.

And yes, I have been there, done that. You try being FD of a plc that has run out of money because other directors have lied to you, when your own personal assets are on the line. But, even then, we paid the PAYE and VAT when due. Other than the Employers' NIC, it never was our money, see?

Good man. Well said. IMO.

You're right, it does happen, and probably more often than people imagine. It shouldn't, of course, but it does.

It would also appear that you have defaulted on your tax repayment plan. Hence why HMRC have torn up the contract and have you running round Belle Vue bare ass with them close behind with a towel whipping you

RE the non-payment of VAT & NI/PAYE. This is quite a rare occurance for me as an accountant. But dont forget, WTWCs will have defaulted on the Employer's NI too, something that comes out of their own pocket.

I think the point being made was, not that it wasn't unusual to not pay VAT, NI etc but that it wasn't unusual that these were diverted for other things until the last minute and then taken from somewhere else.
As an accountant i am surprised you haven't heard of cashflow.
As for defaulting on the repayment plan, nobody really knows on here wether or not we did it as an act of being skint or wether with impending administration we decided not to waste our money.

"...a person commits an offence if he or she knowingly applies or permits the application of the amount of a deduction or withholding of tax made or deemed made under a tax law for any purpose other than in payment to HMRC"

You can go to jail for this offence.

Adey - it happens all the time, very often with the express agreement of HMRC.

It's a fact of life (especially in the sort of economy we find ourselves in now) and is far from "theft".

I have little doubt that EVERY SL will have deferred crown debt to some extent at some point in recent years.

Any business that fails will owe PAYE/NIC/VAT to some extent simply due to the way in which the taxes are collected and paid, to call it theft is a bit much.

presumably though the jails aren't full of businessmen (or women, don't want to fall in that little trap!!!) who's business have gone bust and then been unable to pay tax as a result of it?
Not that i am suggesting for a minute he shouldn't, i'd have him cracking rocks by lunchtime!!!!!!

Of course it isn't theft, particularly not if you have agreed a payment plan with the person you have "robbed" on how to pay them their dues.

HMRC have been surprisingly accommodating with many smaller businesses in the current recession - provided of course they approach HMRC and agree a plan and stick to it! Just not paying and waiting for HMRC to act is rarely a wise move, and is usually a sign of an insolvent business, is it not? And you know as well as me what the law says about trading whilst insolvent? I'm not talking about being just a month or so behind either.

Its a subject I feel strongly about, to be honest, as you can tell. If using money that was never yours to pay other liabilities, with no certainty as to whether you can ever make that shortfall good, is not tantamount to theft, I really don't know what is. But I also said, on an earlier thread, that I have never been in the position where the only choices were to use monies due to HMRC for other purposes, or to initiate the insolvency process. The nearest I came was many years ago, when we were able to avoid asking the bank to appoint a receiver only because of an ongoing (and ultimately successful) rescue takeover, and the forbearance of our suppliers as a result. I pray I will never find myself in the position of having to make the choice, since by then the business would have been allowed to become insolvent anyway and the only choice I could make would be formal insolvency.

The term you're looking for is misappropriation. Theft implies the intent to permanently disposess, which does not apply in this case.