Fully agree ref Williams if he played for Trinity or Hull KR etc he would get nowhere near the international team
Having said that we are 22 years into SL and at times the SL closed shop.
I cant name one British international world class stand off or scrum half and the blame for this lies with every club and every coaching set up in SL.
While ever clubs take the quick fix and sign overseas players be it they are up and coming or past their best and fail to bring young British talent through by giving them game time nothing will change and we will never match the Aussies.

Yesterday our lack of depth in all areas was ruthlessly exposed. Having said that I will take a series win over NZ.
Makinson had an excellent series that said is he really better than Johnstone for my money no and when he made the break in the first half and got caught nobody on that field would have got Johnstone after that break.

For me the last of the great half back combinations was Rob Burrow/Danny McGuire sadly no club is producing these players anymore.
We have coaches coaching error free RL complete sets make the hard yards and build pressure often boring predictable robotic rubbish this is not the game I once knew.

Or you could take the view that the lack of grunt up front was caused by the appalling kicking game displayed by both halves and especially the hooker and the dreadful last tackle options. Much of this game was reminiscent of watching Trinity over the years when many have complained about our lack of fitness when in reality the problem has been our halves' inability to control a game from halfback.

This would be my concern before Williams but hopefully after yesterday's showing from Myler, his international career is over.
On Richardson, he's a good player but a penalty milking grub.

Indeed. Look at Leeds this year gone with him as their 7, and Catalans before that, and England on Sunday. Living off a couple of good years with Warrington when Lee Briers was still playing.

I've noticed over the last sixty or so years if your name is Myler you're put down for an international slot at birth. The current member of the Myler dynasty is just not good enough for England. Yesterday's half back pairing was the poorest I've seen in a long while.

Watching both half backs yesterday perform ,yes behind a beaten pack, makes Me all the more happy with our selection in the Half’s whichever combination the club runs with.

This. How Brough wasn't a dead cert selection at half back over the last 10 years has been a bit of a small tragedy. 3 time Albert Goldthorpe medal winner and the best kicking game possibly ever seen (up there with the best). We should have had a 7 to build a team around and he didn't even get picked most games. Baffling.

Yesterday's half backs were makeshift at best.
In years gone by wed have lost by 50 with just one injury
In tours of the past our second string has been hammered by amateur provincial sides.

We are a lot better off now.

But as has been said, half back is a weak area.
I think it is more about the coaching than the reliance on overseas players.
If Williams parents had moved to Sydney when he was younger he'd be a world beater (by England standards) now.

Let's remember Cooper Cronk started as a replacement Hooker and they made him a world class scrum half. Didn't happen in the first season the had to develop him...... Clearly he was no mug but good coaching at elite standard is important.

So should Gareth Hock. Both players let their attitude and personality hide their true skill.

Disagree. Gareth Hock was never on Brough's level. And I'm not even convinced about this whole attitude thing with Brough. It's not like he's gouging eyes like Hock and going around headbutting folk and sniffing lines. He can lose his rag can Brough but not even comparable for mine. I think a lot of Wakefield fans don't like Brough 'cos he moans a lot and the way he left the club and it is held against him. But he' hardly in the league of Hock and Hardaker for misdemeanors is he?!

Wasn't it because Brough elected to play for Scotland rather than England?

Hadn't he been overlooked for the England spot more than once? I seem to remember that's why he elected to play for Scotland.

It can seem baffling from the outside looking in but, it wasn't just 1 coach that had problems with him, which tells you that, like it or not, there were issues (just as there have been at Huddersfield).
IF Brough had kept his head and been properly "mentored" then, yes, he could have made the England / GB jersey his own.
It's no secret that he has some "baggage" but, IF Chester and co can keep him on the straight and narrow, then Brough can do a great job for Trinity.
As for playing for England/GB, it's a terrible waste of talent but the blame probably doesnt rest with those who select the side, the player too, has to take a huge share of the responsibility.
Many sporting superstars have "flaws" in their character and the best coaches are the ones that can manage these issues as well as the player concerned.

Disagree re Gaz Hock. He probably should have been up there with the best forwards in the world, he had all the physical ability and everything just come so natural to him, just a shame he did not have the noggin to go with it all! If he could have applied himself I have no doubt that he would have gone on to be talked about in the same vein as Ellis. That said, the brain is all part of the package and unfortunately he is just another sad causality of a player that could not control himself both on or off the field.

fair play to Wigan who have stood by Williams from junior while all other clubs seem to allow players to move from pillar to post in the look for the ultimate play maker so they can win the titles

as much as you all dislike Williams his CV is starting to fill up

I think there's some overly harsh criticism of Wiliams here - he's a really talented SH, but this weekend, he was hampered by a poor team performance; pivots only get to do the fancy stuff when their forwards lay a platform and protect them - and no one did that on Sunday.

He plays in a cauldron at Wigan and has come through from junior and made that position his own - which takes some doing at a club that could, more easily than most, import a replacement from pretty much anywhere.

Myler I do agree with however - he's got some skills and had a couple of good years at Warrington - but he's miles away from many of his peers.

Brough should definitely have played for England more than once.
Best British half back for over 10 years.
If players with suspect temperament had always been ignored the great Alex Murphy would not have had GB caps.

I think the only aspect of Williams game that you could properly criticise on the weekend was his kicking game, on more than a few occasions he seemed to have very little pressure on him from the defence yet delivered very poor kicks, failing to find the green. Myler was equally as bad with the kicks he put in, Myler was just invisible throughout the whole game TBF and to say he has played halfback at the top level for the past 10 years that`s just not good enough, If Bennett picks him in the squad again I would be very surprised.

Williams patchy for England at 7 but he had a very good year for Wigan after having gone off the boil the previous season. He may well well come good at international level but a) unfairly bagged over Sunday b) does he get a look in if Tomkins and Widdop are both fit? Was unsure on Tomkins initial selection at 7 but proved wrong, should have known better



Myler was a waste of time and if the Knights weren't touring one of the youngsters would have been in. Would rather have played Ratchford at 1 or 6 on Sunday than have Myler in the side against NZ.

I have been critical of Williams all series, but he's the best available at the present. He has been poor for last 2 seasons but prior to that showed consistent signs he was international class. Whereas Hampshire is lucky to be considered SL class given his erratic career. There is no comparison ATM.

Williams is an excellent talent, Rocky is better as I believe he is blessed with greater God given talents. Have a look at the England Academy tour highlights from 2012, Rocky was the stand out player on both sides. They both set of on the same path to stardom, Williams got the breaks. For whatever reason Wane, who has proved to be the greatest coach in SL history and a coach who has never been frightened of promoting youth, never gave Rocky a fair crack, he persisted in playing Smith. So Williams and Rocky`s paths went in different directions. My bet is that Rocky ends up a world class RL super star, his path will have been the more difficult but it will I think leave him better prepared to reach world RL superstar status. I also think Chester has a big role to play, Rocky should be a starting 7, Rough should be a back up player to cover 6, 7 and 1 in case of injury.

If Hampshire is better than Brough and/or brings more to the team currently then he plays, if not he does not, quite simple for me. Chester does not owe anything to anyone and should be picking what he believes to be his best team.

Apart from quicker pace I am not sure what better talents Hampshire possess. He's certainly kept them well hidden for the last 5 years.

I don't see how it's possible to say that Hampshire is better than Williams, since he's only really started in that position for us recently - whereas Williams has been Wigan's first choice for quite a while; he may well turn out to be, but since he's been held back for various reasons, he's quite some way behind Williams at this stage.

I'm sorry but Hampshires ability as a junior are now utterly irrelevant - loads of players look great at Academy level but never hack it against the misters.