It is Castlefords plan, I don't think anyone yet knows our plans, we have new management in case you didn't know

I bow to your greater knowledge AI (Obviously) about all this planning stuff, but surely the spending of any capital on a new stadium should not be a guarantee of franchise, save if others are clearly lacking in franchise points.
What if all teams were spending? I would also assume that they are in the same boat as the rest of SL clubs that they are unable to take legal action against SL/RFL?

Hard for some people on here to understand the concept behind it, but don't you think it is even slightly possible that Mr Glover and Mr Wright had spoken about the options / developments / need to get something done?

Many businesses talk to their competitors, they discuss particular hurdles in their industry, they discuss things where they have joint interests in, they do what they can to individually succeed, and to keep going. Therefore, Mr Glover is doing the right thing by exploring all the options rather than just having NM as the only option for us.

As for Barnsley, I would guess that that wasn't mentioned in the statement as he was focussing on wanting a WAKEFIELD area solution as primary aim, knowing that there is the option should all other possibilities fade away later on.

Before we all spout off about whether AG is right or wrong to drag ground sharing at NM back up and before Cas fans get all indignant and tell him to shove it we should take a look at the background to which these comments have been made.

Richard Wright has confirmed that Castleford DO NOT have the money to build a stadium and won't have the money for the foreseeable future.

Ben Bailey Homes had paid an options fee, somewhere in the region of £200K, to reserve the Wheldon Rd ground but now seem happy to allow that option to expire and will not be paying Castleford RLFC any more money. That means the overinflated price of £6Million (?) that Cas thought they were getting is never going to happen!

Richard Wright alluded to the idea of waiting until the economy picks up before selling Castleford RLFCs family silver as they will only get to sell it once and they won't be backed into selling it cheap just to move forward on the GH project. The economy and therefore the building industry and in particular the house building sector of that industry will not see a significant upturn for the next 2 to 3 years at best with economists now voicing real fears over Britain’s likelihood of suffering a double dip recession which would put that recovery even further away.

So where does that leave Castleford’s GH project in terms of financing?

Even if the wildly optimistic approximations of cost were correct and the stadium price is just £11Million, where are Castleford going to find that money now Wheldon Rds. sale is iced and where were they going to find the other £5Million?

Looking at similar stadium builds and their construction costs Castleford GH stadium price is more likely to check out at around £15 to £17 Million.

There seems to be some forlorn hope that Feisal Nahaboo will rescue and fund their build but he’s a sponsor and the jury is out, Michael Knighton style, on how credible he is in the long term. He’s also had his head turned by his WCC experience and is now forging links with Wigan and despite his “I’m a Cas fan” statement he’ll soon realise that the DW and Wigan have more to offer Probiz than Castleford and Wheldon Rd.

I think the RFL recent actions and public messages about the importance of new stadium for the next franchising period leave them very vulnerable to a successful legal challenge by Salford if they got kicked out. If you had just thrown £20m at something and then they seriously dented your potential income stream by putting you in the Championship how happy would you be and would you not want to spend a fraction of that challenging the RFL in court? The RFL have made that bed and have to 'lie' in it!

No, it could be by the end of this year, but that looks to be the best current time frame. The current situation with Newmarket is unprecedented (as far as I am aware) and having two public inquiry processes running almost side by side over the same piece of land is complicating matters to say the least. The upshot is nobody seems to have the first clue as how things will progress and what impact one will have on the other!

Purely statistically, 75% of planning PI's find in favour of the original applicant (often with some recommend amendments to the scheme) and I am reluctant to make any predictions as to how things might go in respect of the Newmarket PI because I have no idea how much bearing the ongoing LDF process will have on the planning PI.... and nor does anyone else... that what happens when you have unprecedented situations, you have to set a precedent. As it stands, the main arguments upon which Newmarket revolve is the lands current green belt status, wildlife habitat issues and what the planner call the sustainability of the location (this means that some people think the site is too far away for local workers to get their by walking, by bike or by public transport... and yes, I do think the irony of this situation is lost on some people!). The wildlife issue is probably a red-herring because I think WY Ecology/English Nature will have to effectively resolve their issues with the development prior to the PI. I think they will still object, but there objection will carry no weight if Yorkcourt agree to implement the majority of their recommendations.

Now of course the LDF is seeking to re designate the Newmarket site for B8 employment land and I think that would seem very likely (currently!) to happen because Wakefield has a legal obligation to designate 95ha of land on the M62 corridor to B8 development and Wakefield have, in the opinion of there planning policy team, picked the best possible sites for the job, Newmarket being one and biggest of them. The issue here is that the arguments against allowing Wakefield to do this from Leeds and some residents appears weak, the best they can come up with is, use some land in Leeds and you should never have made Wakefield do this in the first place, change your mind please... but they can't and the legal obligation is now cast in stone... so they really have to suggest alternative sites in Wakefield... which they can't... because it would appear this one of the best possible sites!

I really can not see the LDF failing to re-designate the land at Newmarket to B8 but how the PI does or does not impact on that process is a total unknown! Answers on a post please!

It is a buggers muddle but it does currently look like it will be over by this time next year at the latest... possibly!

Don't doubt your logic, i just remember when we were having the discussion on NM and it not guaranteeing us a franchise and wether or not the development sustainable if we were to find ourselves in NL1. There was no mention of us taking on the RFL if we went down, indeed i remember a number of posts, regarding the RFL having SL clubs over a barrel with some kind of legal agreement.

Thought the knockback was Wakey saying No to a Council report on both sites, and feasability of sharing and possibly pooling of the Land/Money.......

Pretty Sure Agent Ted said Wakey would only play at NM, while RW said they would consider the councils report.

We can argue the toss about who's furthest on with their stadium plans till doomsday but its completely irrelevant as far as the forthcoming franchise decision is concerned because according to the RFL website, 'New stadiums or redevelopments of existing stadiums will only be taken into account if the RFL is satisfied that the stadium will be open or the redevelopment finished by the start of the 2012 season,' so that counts us both out.
Given that Quins, Crusaders and Catalans hold the expansion clubs' get out of jail free card unless the RFL radically shift their position on one Championship club coming up and one SL club going down its a straight fight between Cas and Wakey, judged on their current status and not what either side is promising for the future (since frankly neither can be trusted.)
I think administration has done for Wakey in this round of franchises and Cas will survive by default.

only if you promise to bring more than NINE fans down each time !

the point is that,despite a recession the french in general both publicly ( Gilbert Brutus is owned by the FFR I believe !) and privately are building and investing everywhere cos' money is so cheap to borrow at the moment.

They realise interest rates will no doubt rise so they are investing now when the money is more freely available.

everywhere you go in france properties,both commercial & private are being built.

Most of thats fine and i would tend to agree, the worry Cas have is the GT incident and other crowd problems that have blighted them in the past, the RFL are not keen on this.

Plus they don't believe the broken promises from old Dickie, Glover on the other hand is welcomed at the RFL.

So its maybe not clear cut.

They said final warning, NEXT time it will count against a franchise.



Apart from RW has been careful with his words and has never said for DEFINITE a date in which the stadium will be completed, but has taken steps to ensure it will be built - and full planning permission coming in next month is just another step towards that, the RFL will see the positive steps there. This is also the same RFL who recently PAID Cas commission on getting PROBIZ to sponsor the WCC, because of PROBIZ Cas are currently in the RFL's good books.



A bit more clear cut then:
Contribution to the competition? Cas currently 2nd with a game in hand, 3rd in the u20's, contributing to the international side, turning a profit, in a better stadium than Wakefield - who in turn have been in administration, are bottom of Super League and look a very poor team and have a chairman who as good as admitted yesterday that the team will be in the Championship next year.

But it was a waste of time me even putting that because you lot don't appreciate balance over here





It was but that doesn't suit the agenda over here.



Bingo, and Glover is the same and saying a lot of the same things as Ted, sounds like a clone really...

Did he not say Cas would be in the new stadium by 2009?

Its based on 3 years not your current league position I think we win that one, I think we win community projects hands down so if we want to score brownie points stay on your board and spout the tripe.

Lets see what happens then in the coming weeks it should be an interesting time.

Hard to disagree with that

Actually this is what its based on;

Clubs are assessed on criteria in 5 key areas:

a. Commercial, Marketing, Media and Community.
b. Facilities.
c. Finance.
d. Governance and Business Management.
e. Playing Strength and Player Performance Strategy.

Clubs that meet all of the A Grade criteria across the 5 areas will be awarded an A Grade licence. Clubs that materially meet all the A Grade criteria and/or satisfy the RFL that they will meet the criteria in the next round of licensing will be awarded a B Grade licence.

The RFL will then allocate the remaining Super League licences to those existing Super League clubs and/or Championship clubs which applied for a licence and met the Championship Club Minimum Criteria. The licenses will be allocated to those clubs that the RFL board believes are the most suitable, taking into account the:

a. Extent to which each club helps meet the SLE Strategy and the strategic aims and objectives of the Licensing process;
b. Historical activity of the clubs under consideration; and
c. RFL’s reasonable opinion as to future performance of the clubs under consideration.



Clearly the RFL have allowed themselves enough leeway to fix the decision however they see fit, but on the 5 'key areas' I think it would be hard to convince any neutral observer that Wakey tick more boxes than Cas.
(How do you think you beat Cas on 'Commercial, Marketing, Media and Community' when the bloke presenting the World Club Challenge Trophy was wearing a Cas scarf

)

OK cas are in cos the sponsor presented the WCC wearing amber and black, the same sponsor now courting Wigan

On the criteria based on 3 years I think you beat us on finance nothing else just IMHO

Business management...by a long way
Facilities - PROBIZ Coliseum is better than Belle Vue
Media - TigerTV was the first of its kind for clubs and probably has the most features of any team
Commercial - Craig Poskitt was voted as the best in the league at what he does, so by default nobody beats Cas there.
Playing strength - finished higher last year and will this year so 2/3 years a higher finish is better

So it's pretty fair to say Cas beat Wakefield in every criteria.

Well going into admin you lose hands down on finance and governance and business management so that's 2 out of the 5 to Cas straight away.
Facilities? Well Wheldon Rd is hardly the Noucamp but as you've sold Bellvue its streets ahead of what you have, which is nothing. So 3 out of 5 to Cas.
I don't honestly know how the two clubs compare regarding 'Commercial, Marketing, Media and Community' but as top of the league with our kids performing so well and you propping up the foot of the table we are certainly on the up regarding' Playing Strength and Player Performance Strategy.'

But as you rightly say, its all opinion and the RFL will have their own agenda and fix the decision accordingly.

There used to be a time us rugby fans argued about who had the hardest pack or the most creative back line. But now and thanks to the idoits at red hall, its about who has the best business model, the more powerfull sponsor or the best stadium . I didnt fall in love with this great game beacause of any of the previous. I LIKE WATCHING RUGBY. And thats all that should matter. How and when did snobbery enter what is the most working class of any sport in this country?. I would rather watch a ace game in a crap stadium, than a crap game in a stadium with a roof.

you sir have been awarded the freedom of the bar!

i have for a long time not wanted to get into this debate over who is going to build first etc etc.

however, like IA i also work in the building trade and i am party to some information that may be not in the public domain.

cas are planning to start building work on their ground in january 2012 with a 12 month build timescale, so if all goes to plan, ready for the 2013 season.

how do i know this? my company subscribe to "project leads" company called glenigans (anyone who works in the building industry will be aware of this). the information about cas, who the developers/builder are and when it is due to start was on there. this information is subject to change, but it will not be brought forward, only backwards.

for this information to appear on glenigans, someone from either the builder/developer/owner has stated this

i know this adds nothing to either argument in terms of who will build first, but it is statement of fact. if any cas fans thinks they will be in a new stadium by the start of next season, please contact me and we can have a bet!!!

btw - IA knows what he talking about, and despite been a *&^%$ (i cannot bring myself to type the name) fan, i do have faith and confidence in what he is saying.

Been wanting to say that for ages!.

It's based on the last two years, not three. HTH.