TBH there are several reasons to be positive about Crusaders:

A town that seems to want them
Good ticket sales
Good stadium
Noble
Reliable kit manufacturer
Good sponsors

Yes, they moved across Wales, and yes they are nearer to the "heartlands" but my god, lets give the new club a chance.

But that's the point.

It's not a "new club" - It's a failed club that's being allowed to start again as if last year was just a practise run.

As I said. they should have been put in to the National Leagues, where they could both prove themselves, build a fan-base and prepare for the step up to SL.

Surely the simple answer to all of these gripes is simple. Don't go and watch them either home or away, it won't take long for every other club to get sick of the lack of gate at home and the message would be clear to the RFL.

Crusaders problems are not popular by a long way but I'm not sure they are a new club. They haven't been put into administration that I know of.
Loads of "heartlands" clubs have been in admin and been started again as "new" clubs.
Bradford, HKR, Widnes, Rochdale, Oldham to name a few.

Celtic's problems are no longer financial, they are their squad. Noble has not had time to sign and train them and quality is going to be a problem.
End of season they are eveyone's 14th club including mine.

However they do have a good ground and it will likely bring in more revenue than the likes of Salford or Quins. Their overall revenue situation will depend on the crowds. Long term they will attract players from areas west of the pennines and we need a SL club nearer to us than S Wales.

The original difficulties with Celtic have been overcome and the outcome is that where as five years ago we didn't have any clubs in Wales we now have two.
Hopefully from 2012 there will be 5 SL clubs near to us. Saints, Wire, Salford, Widnes and Crusaders. With two outside the northern areas Quins & Cats.
The Celtic situation could have ended far worse for Rugby League than it has and in that respect I'm more than happy with the outcome.

The Harlequins game is going to be in South Wales, 100% certain.

London got RFL help on more than one occasion and any new team that is started to expand the game will get the same.

They have found a new backer and a ground which is one of the better ones in Super League. A very good potential fan base yes they have been pulled out of the proverbial but at least give them to the middle of next season to prove themselves under the new management. Then if they have not improved then complain to the RFL to stop them getting a new franchise.

What difference does travel time make, FFS?

How do you think football or yawnion fans get on? They travel up and down the country to get to away matches on a regular basis, so why is it such a big problem when we have to do it once in a blue moon?

Get a grip.

Yeah but its not once in a blue moon. Its every home game. Wigan should play more games in Gloucestershire.

I think it may make a difference if you work 60+ hours a week, have a couple of kids to look after etc. Oh, and then the cost is going to be greater. What percentage of home crowds of Union/Football travel to the 4/5 hour distant matches BTW?

With your view we may as well have a South African team in the SL too, sure it takes a while to get there but there really isn't an issue is there?

Utterly stupid statement.

They've been reprimanded for that and lost a lot of their senior players which is a far greater punishment than anybody else in rugby league has ever been given who have cheated the rules, Wigan included.



Any club in any sport can suffer, you only need to look at Portsmouth FC and Crystal Palace to see that. Just because the business side of things AFTER the licence was awarded has struggled doesn't mean their on the field achievements should not be rewarded.



After everything that has happened, the move from South Wales and the poor first season I am inclined to agree that the Crusaders have been fast tracked into Super League without proper consideration as to how they will cope but they have two years to prove that is now behind them and to move forward - to right them off at every opportunity is detrimental to them and to the sport on the whole IMO.

We're obviously dealing with a flatcapper, here. No neeeeeeeeed to go further that th'M62 lad. It's allus bin like that, why change it?

Yes, I do 60+ hours a week, I have a kid and I have to pay to attend games too. Same as several thousand others.

4/5 hour travel time to matches in other sports? Let me think. A damn sight more than us RL lot, who have it easy.



Don't be silly.

Yes a bit like the one where nobody cares about travel, and indeed yours. It's not rocket surgery to figure out that travel does matter.

Good for you that you can fit it in, I'm pleased for you. If travel isn't an issue why are there more home fans than away fans? There are a large number of fans that don't travel to away games, why could that be?

Just because I made a statement showing long distance travel as option when you said, "What difference does travel time make, FFS?" does not make my point silly. How about if we play them in Neath on a Friday night at 7:30pm, do you think anyone would complain about travel time or would everyone be happy with taking the time off work, watching the game and then getting home in the early hours?

tbh its the bradford fans i feel sorry for.
its a tidy trek for them to south wales.

have the RL thought this through?
why not quins and CATS........cats fans are used to flying over here, and wales is closer.
they do still have an airport in cardiff ???

I know where you're coming from with that point about Catalans and quins, but they'd still want a game in south wales against a team that sends a big following, for gate money obviously. I mean some of the new fans in wrexham might decide not to go down so the "away" team has to help make up the numbers. Bradford are one of those teams that send big followings.

Catalans have announced that the games against Wigan, Leeds, Warrington and Bradford are to be played in a bigger stadium because they'll be the biggest crowds, so sending a crusaders game to south wales they'd really want one of the matches to be against one of those 4 teams to get a decent(ish) crowd. Maybe Warrington would have been a better option than bradford though, as they're closer.

Never REALLY understood the whining from UK fans about having to travel to away games ?






I thought the idea was to take the game to a wider audience

Why should it be anyone though? That's my point.

They chose to move out of South Wales and up to Wrexham.

There is now a new team in South Wales that needs to build its own fan-base.

Crusaders should either play everyone at Neath, or play everyone at Wrexham.

I just think it sucks that fans of teams that take lesser away followings (Leeds, Saints, etc.) get to travel 50 to 80 miles, whereas (most likely) Bradford and Wigan, who tend to take larger followings everywhere, get stuck with a 200+ mile trip, to a crappy stadium, just so that Crusaders can try to ease their own guilt about moving up North.

Last year was no fun, travelling all that way with a 5-year old, on a coach from 7am, not back until 1.30am.

It shows no consideration for anyone IMO.

(And yes, we will be up at Murrayfield - That's different. It's a planned weekend)

hang on a minute here.
Its a bit rich for people to talk about how easy it to get to games when to my knowledge they do not bother going (for whatever reason) to all that many away games themselves.

And showing a map of the whole of australia is a bit misleading.
the bulk of the teams are in Sydney.
if you cut out all the middle where no one lives, then all the bits where there is no rugby it looks very different.

That's apart from Melbourne, Canberra, Newcastle, Brisbane, Gold Coast and North Queensland, and New Zealand Warriors



Parramatta and Penrith are more than an hour from Sydney centre.

They travel much further than we do for games.

people in london will tell you that they spend far far more than an hour getting just accross london Brian.
Most of their fans do not travel to everygame.
same as most of ours don't.

and my point stands if you look at that map its not a real comparison is it.
I was not trying to say anything about who travels further. was I?

i mean, an hour from wigan gets us to about huddersfield.
and thats not talking jumping on public transport like you can do to get round sydney very easily.

i know i'd much rather jump on that river cat up to the home of the mighty eels than chug over the M62 to Huddersfield even allowing for the delights of the Nags Head!

One of my favourite trips to a rugby game that up the Parramatta river.

The South Wales games are Quins and Bradford.

They are the only two.

Your game will be at Wrexham without doubt.