Thats correct.

A return to the top 5 system is a must, some of the results in the first week were embarassing.

How can results like Wigan 46 Catalan 6, Leeds 42 Wakefield 20 and Hull 46 Huddersfield 10 be seen as entertaining. Although it was gutting to be on the wrong side of the scoreline I'd rather see plenty more games like Friday's where you had no idea who was going to win even in the dying moments of the game.

I know people say that you need a top 8 to keep fans interested in the results of teams in the lower section of the table, why not as alternative do as the Premier League do in the football and award prize money depending on your clubs finishing position in the table at the end of the league rounds?

A Top 5 wouldn't generate enough games for Sky. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for it but realistically Sky will dictate the format of the play offs.

This thread has put into words exactly how I have felt since July.

The problem is SKY's top 8

play off system is driving people away from attending matches. It's awful going to games and seeing loads of empty seats, must be bad for players having to perform in an atmosphere like that when come the business end of the season you want to see packed crowds and feed off the energy from the stands.

LISTEN TO THE FANS, BRING BACK THE TOP 5 PLAY OFF SYSTEM!!

[size=50That's if we have to even have play offs as the team finishing top of the table should be regarded as champions.[/size

I know what you're saying and i share some of your frustrations but even you would rather have had your path than say

Playing Wakey week 1
Away at Catalan week 2
& Leeds away week 3.

Much better system! Won't happen though and as I've said a few times a top 5 PO system in a 14 team league with no promotion and relegation leaves too many teams with nothing to play for by the midway point of the season. So a reduction in teams in the league would be required. But because the RFL refuse to make any big decisions we will be stuck with the current format next season guarenteed!

Sky dont care as people dont go live but watch it on their channels

The lack of competitiveness is definitely what's killing the excitement for me. There's no incentive for teams to fight for every point. Wigan have recorded some pretty straightforward wins over teams that have been in the top 8 and even the top 4 and during those games it's been hard to see why those clubs should even care about those results.

When Wigan battered Leeds away from home there was no way at all that the Wigan team on that day was that much better than the Leeds side. For me that game just showed the difference between a good team that really wanted to win that game and a good team that would have liked to win but weren't particularly bothered either way.

There's just a lack of quality right through Super League and while all teams this year have been capable of good performances the number that have been capable of consistently good performances has been quite small.

The salary cap was supposed to even things out but even when 'smaller teams' like London spend to the full cap they are spending that money on players that make up a team of much less quality. The best teams still monopolise the best talent and that forces sides outside the 'big four' to overspend on what little talent remains.

I bet there are some better players than Kevin Brown at top 4 clubs earning less than he'll be earning at Widnes, but his value to a club like Widnes is huge because compared to what else is available he could make a difference.

I take your point but isn't it in SKY's interests to maintain viewer interest, how can they do that if they drive fans and players away from the sport as they become more and more disillusioned with the play off system.

Surely people will start switching off if we continue getting one sided scorelines in some games and star players leave to yawnion or the NRL.

I watched the NRL Grand Final on Sunday and as good as the teams are taking part in this Saturday's final at Old Trafford I can't see it being as entertaining.

You can have a repeat fixture in the top 5 system it just didn't happen too often. Week 1 2 bt 3 4 bt 5 Week 2 1 bt 2 3 bt 4 Week 3 2 bt 3 Final 1 bt 2 That run there has 2 repeated fixtures. It is the better system though but the top 6 pushes ot very close. Week 1 3 bt 6 4 bt 5 Week 2 1 bt 2 3 bt 4 Week 3 2 bt 3 Final 1 bt 2 The only repeat in that is the final and that can only happen between the top 2. leaguechatter.wordpress.com/2012 ... ff-misery/

You can have a repeat fixture in the top 5 system it just didn't happen too often. Week 1 2 bt 3 4 bt 5 Week 2 1 bt 2 3 bt 4 Week 3 2 bt 3 Final 1 bt 2 That run there has 2 repeated fixtures. It is the better system though but the top 6 pushes ot very close. Week 1 3 bt 6 4 bt 5 Week 2 1 bt 2 3 bt 4 Week 3 2 bt 3 Final 1 bt 2 The only repeat in that is the final and that can only happen between the top 2. leaguechatter.wordpress.com/2012 ... ff-misery/

Got to agree with the majority of the sentiments on here. The standard of rugby is appalling and has been getting gradually worse for years. I'd say it's gone downhill since around 2006 when Saints had a truly good team (as much as that pains me to say). I'd say our team of 2010 which I was proud to call champions was actually a poorer team than the one we had for the first part of this century who couldn't win a grand final for love nor money.

The weekly games are meaningless, course you want your team to win but they're so dull I spend half my time just having a pint and a chat and not actually watching the game. It's only the social side of things that keeps me going.

The play-off system is a farce. I think the people at the RFL need to do one simple test when they come up with their next great idea...try explaining it first to someone who isn't a rugby league fan and examine their face while you are talking to them. I've got sick, tired and quite frankly embarrassed of trying to explain our play-off system to non-rl fans at work. They just stare at you in amazement as if to say, "you what"?

The only plus point I can think of in recent years is Sam Tomkins who is a genuine superstar and a joy to watch. He is the one shining star who does attract outside interest and it's people like this we need to keep hold of to help publicise and market the game. That said who could blame him if he were to go to the NRL to truly test himself or go to RU. I think even he will be getting bored soon enough of scoring hat tricks against dire sides.

Other things which don't help are the standard of officiating during games, the inconsistency of the disciplinary panel afterwards and the head of RFL being the inept Nigel Wood.

It's also poor having such an awful international fixture schedule. I think the heads of RFL need to realise that the England thing isn't working on its own. We need to set in stone having Great Britain v Australia ashes tours atleast every 4 years if not every 2. This was the bedrock of our game for so long and for some unknown reason we turned our backs on it? At the end of the day it's a successful international team that will attract Southern media interest and subsequently sponsorship. At the moment the only people who seem interested in RL are Sky Sports and it's always dangerous to rely on one source of income. Sky aren't daft and sooner or later they will realise this and start reducing the money they pump into the game knowing that we have no one else to turn to.

I could go on and on and on there are so many things wrong with the way the game is run.

That said I will continue to attend with my usual apathy in the hope that something miraculous happens. Rugby league is still a great game with the potential to be so much better, it's just sadly run by morons.

Same here. I couldn't possibly stop going. It drives me up the wall when I miss one game let alone 23/24

Well done to all the posters on this thread. This has been one of the most informed and intelligent debates in recent months. I am a season ticket holder and have been for the last 12 years. I came out of the match on Friday feeling very disappointed and thought I would not post until I had had several days to think and reflect. I agree that there are too many meaningless games and the RFL management need wholesale changes. Still undecided about renewing my season ticket though but I can see that my heart will probably rule my head at the end of the day. I almost feel that I would be letting the boys down if I didnt.

Look at the nrl semi 71k and we get 12k think that says it all

If the rfl get it right then we all know how big it will become but they haven't we could get bigger deals sky,sponsors etc.... thus giving every club more £££ and increasing the cap to keep the youngsters

What was the cap brought in for? to make it more even for smaller clubs has it worked? haha NO

Smaller clubs are losing talent to bigger clubs and getting average players so that their team never really get a fair shot up at the top or in the spotlight

Players will always gravitate towards teams that can win honours, London spend to the cap although you wouldn't think it, the salary cap won't even teams out but i don't really think it was brought in to even things out, even though it was sold that way, it was brought in to stop clubs going to the wall, obviously it's not working there either.

It pains me to say it as i would love more teams in one league but we need to cut 4 teams.

You can't even begin to compare the two. The population of Sydney is 4,627,345 and the number 1 sport is RL.

The population of Wigan and Leeds combined is 832,703 and football (I'm not talking Latics here, I'm talking football in general) is the biggest sport in both areas. In fact, the population of Wigan, Leeds, Warrington and St Helens is only 1,137,542.

I love the NRL but you can't use that as an example.

Realistically you could compare it to the GF only due to all the neutrals that go as they come from all the different teams usually but even then the entire league was only watched by 1.88m people this year so still a fraction of Sydney's population so we do well really to get that many into old Trafford.

Just read the thread from start to finish and could not agree more.

Will probably renew my season ticket because I enjoy the friendship but the game really has one down hill. Too many matches are just boring with no atmosphere.

No easy answer when the powers that be can,t see what most of the fans can.

Its a bit like some of the well known Retail names that have gone bust recently, all down to bad management, continuing with a product that customers are fed up with, not realising they are disallusioned and wake up when its too late when the customers have gone elsewhere.

Lets hope that doesn,t happen to this great game because of the muppets in charge.

Sour grapes. Plastic fans! Get over it. You should follow your club no matter what the league structure or position you are in. Hang you heads in shame Pie Eaters!

You've completely missed the point of this thread.

Whoosh

Bilko. A little word of advice and encouragement from some one who is (fairly) independent of this Site. Take a bit of a rest through the winter months, then see how you feel about it after the New Year. You do an excellent job, your Site is a credit to you and it would be a shame to let it go to waste.

I wonder if your other 2 posts are as insightful as this....

Be quiet, the adults are talking

I don't think he has entirely missed the point. Bilko and others have said the league structure is a joke and some don't see the point in watching any more. I guess your all frustrated that you won the league yet the GF winners will get the plaudits. I agree with some that the top 8 should be scrapped. To be honest i don't think you would be complaining if you finished where Leeds did and ended up getting to the grand final.

The playoff structure needs changing, yet the rules are laid out at the start of the season and they are no excuses. You guys failed in play off footy.