My concern after reflecting on that last night is the power of referees to control the ruck speed to such a degree it almost nullifies any of our threat from a quick play the ball to get teams on the back foot. If a team like Leigh are able to do that on a pitch the size of ours, I’ll be concerned when we go to places like KR and even Castleford.

By no means was it the reason we lost last night but i thought the referee let the game flow a bit too much which probably sounds a bit ridiculous becuase we are all forever saying the refs are giving too many penalties. There were clear penalties on both sides, the ruck was too slow and i think if he blew a few times it would of broke the game up. Good game though, enjoyed it. We'll be fine and congrats to the Leigh.

[quote="NickyKiss":13qm1ymr]Yeah, I don't think a few shocks early in the season will do us much harm in the long run. Motivation to keep winning can be difficult when you've had so much success (not saying we lacked it last night) but a champion side doesn't like losing and the enjoyment that brings around the game and I think our players can then feed off that. I'm finding myself a bit 'meh' about games at the minute and that's from the run of winning trophies but last night just gets you going again. [/quote:13qm1ymr] I've felt exactly the same - adds a little more bite to the coming games.

[quote="1872_WiganRLFC":ko4gibqr]By no means was it the reason we lost last night but i thought the referee let the game flow a bit too much which probably sounds a bit ridiculous becuase we are all forever saying the refs are giving too many penalties. There were clear penalties on both sides, the ruck was too slow and i think if he blew a few times it would of broke the game up. Good game though, enjoyed it. We'll be fine and congrats to the Leigh.[/quote:ko4gibqr] This notion that less referee intervention leads to a more exciting game is so misguided. If the ref had clamped down on the slow ruck speed early then the rest of the game would likely have sped up. Liam Moore is the absolute worst for not intervening with the ruck. I think he's a good ref outside of that and talks to the players very well. But its almost a free for all on the floor when he's in charge.

I don’t get the hate on Moore, the PTB was equally slow on both sides so no advantage to be had for either team, difference is you normally get to slow the PTB down but enjoy a quick PTB, I’d say we just “out wiganed” you last night. What I will say it was amazing watching Wigan defensive structure and composure live is immense, proper old fashioned proper rugby! Quality stuff

I think the PTB was definitely slow for both teams and to be honest if it was sped up would we have got the game we did defensively. Both teams would have been blowing out their backsides 20mins in. Like people have said nothing to worry about both teams were matched for most of the game, credit to Leigh there as they never creaked, gave away a silly pen. Hull is always a bogey ground for us and if we put the effort in for the Leigh game into that game I think we can win. No excuse… excuse incoming, I think we need to get the vegas game then the following game out the way and hopefully we’ll fully settle then. Again no discredit to Leigh we threw everything into that game.

I'm not gutted at all to lose that one, great game. We did look super clunky, still had the chances to ice the game, but ultimately didn't. The two sin bins were correct calls so we can have no complaints on them however I am not seeing how the refereeing is earning widespread praise; the ruck was painfully slow. Add in the boggy pitch and no wonder the attack for both sides struggled. Two poor examples, one in each half; O'Neil didn't clear the ruck and the ball cannoned off his legs and went forward 2/3 yards and the shout was play on. Then in the second half, Wigan player clearly tackled and then O'Brien goes back on and it's a clear as day 6 Again, but nothing given. I'm sure Leigh fans would be able to find 1 or 2 similar calls that didn't go for them round the ruck also, by the way! Yes, he did let the game flow, but it can't be a free for all. We'll be ok, and long term it may turn out to be a good loss to take. Nonetheless, I was only thinking yesterday that we may see a lull at the start of the season after coming off the quadruple. Field looks in promising shape though but his decision making needs to improve. He was weirdly the biggest positive for me from last night.

This HKR v Cas game is a lot more exciting than ours was. It's about 3x faster as the ref put the marker down early to speed the ruck up giving a couple of 6-agains. And it helps that both teams are actually trying to score and actually pass the ball rather than 5 drives every set.

[quote="Wigg'n":1l3kvlbb]This HKR v Cas game is a lot more exciting than ours was. It's about 3x faster as the ref put the marker down early to speed the ruck up giving a couple of 6-agains. And it helps that both teams are actually trying to score and actually pass the ball rather than 5 drives every set.[/quote:1l3kvlbb] Agreed, and that's my point. It was a great game due to the intensity levels, it was play-off like from both sides. I think the first break in play was 18 mins in. Nevertheless, I think both coaches will be frustrated with how the ruck was refereed.

Looks like we've got a game on our hands next week, FC currently beating Les Cats

Do teams receiving the ball from kick off in golden point ever win? Does anyone know what the stats are on that?

I wish they'd put golden point in the bin. Forget us last night, we lost in a tight affair, against a good side and don't need every point we can get but Cas deserved something from that game tonight. I don't know why a draw can't just be a draw.

[quote="apollosghost":3iep7eef]Looks like we've got a game on our hands next week, FC currently beating Les Cats[/quote:3iep7eef] I know it’s just the opener but I thought Hull looked fit and well trained tonight

[quote="NickyKiss":1h5l1kpk]I wish they'd put golden point in the bin. Forget us last night, we lost in a tight affair, against a good side and don't need every point we can get but Cas deserved something from that game tonight. I don't know why a draw can't just be a draw.[/quote:1h5l1kpk] If they're dead set on having golden point for the 'drama' then I don't hate the idea of giving a point to each side for an 80 minute draw and an extra point to whoever wins.

[quote="Stranger":liawn407]I know it’s just the opener but I thought Hull looked fit and well trained tonight[/quote:liawn407] Having watched three games now, our pitch is a disgrace compared to the 2 on show this evening. It didn’t help anyone last night.

A draw at 80 minutes should be 1pt each. Don't forget the player welfare were players are allowed to play so many minutes in a season, and then we have this xtra time, and an extra game to play in the CCup. Flippin crazy.

[quote="NickyKiss":38cfg58u]I wish they'd put golden point in the bin. Forget us last night, we lost in a tight affair, against a good side and don't need every point we can get but Cas deserved something from that game tonight. I don't know why a draw can't just be a draw.[/quote:38cfg58u] I said the same NK. I was more gutted for Cas than I was for ourselves to be honest. I understand the "excitement" for TV of golden point but it's no way to negate the 80 minutes of endeavour that preceded it. Also, there is no real jeopardy in the sense that seemingly all golden point games go the same way. It's effectively won by a coin toss.

[quote="DannyT":1qid2ls8]Do teams receiving the ball from kick off in golden point ever win? Does anyone know what the stats are on that?[/quote:1qid2ls8] Leigh started their set of 6 in a worse position than Wigan did when they received the kick-off. Had tackles not been missed, then Leigh would have been on the 6th tackle around halfway and not been in range of the sticks.

[quote="LewCharnock":3vitoij9]Two poor examples, one in each half; O'Neil didn't clear the ruck and the ball cannoned off his legs and went forward 2/3 yards and the shout was play on.[/quote:3vitoij9] They changed the ruling on this a few years ago. There was a season a few years back where teams realised they could get easy penalties by deliberately playing the ball into the defender who had just made a legs tackle or passing it into retreating offside players. There were games that were made into a complete farce by this loophole. They changed it midseason to say the guy playing the ball has to find space to play it, the hooker has to use his skill to play around defenders who have been left on the floor behind the ruck (as long as they don't deliberately obstruct play as O'Neil didn't), and if you deliberately pass the ball into an offside player you will be penalised (didn't happen here but relevant to the overall rule). It's not perfect but penalising O'Neil wouldn't be a good outcome either. He's not trying to obstruct the play and if he moves he's likely to make it worse.

[quote="DannyT":3grpsv4f]Having watched three games now, our pitch is a disgrace compared to the 2 on show this evening. It didn’t help anyone last night.[/quote:3grpsv4f] Wait till you get to the mkm next Friday, apparently the pitch is in a right state too for us