No its you who are wrong - yet again because you had [unothing[/u at all to base that opinion on.

Or do you go off reputation rather than what you actually see with out own eyes?

Why was I wrong? Because he was ripping up sides week in week out and being a rock in defence? He was neither.



Well IMO the support for Roberts came from the pro Noble brigade who had to justify his selection to support the coach. It's the same now as the attempts to rewrite history that he was obviously a top player for us in 2009 show





He won't pick Pryce in a game like that and given Goulding has bee in the 19 for the past two weeks but has missed out I can't see MM bringing back a player on loan even if it is dual registered in favour of Goulding.

It seem pretty logical to me he will pick Goulding but you obviously want to know would I prefer Ainscough. I would say yes because Ainscough has that something about him that makes him a dangerous player.

I suspect Goulding could not go out on a dual contact due to how much he earns so Ainscough went and I don't think he will be called back given Goulding is fit and is a good player in his own right.

As an aside I am sure I have read somewhere Goulding is off to Salford (might have been on Mikes forum) whether loan or permanent I don't know but if he is going that would increase the chances of Ainscough being called back depending when(if) he goes.

Dave

Defensively is Goulding up for it love him or hate him Briers is no mug and will kick to whoever comes in I just wonder will Pryce be a better option than Goulding. I would like to see Ainscough back but I would also like to see Josh get a shot at the FB role.

God I wouldn't like to be Maguire at the moment, but I suppose that what he gets paid for making the big calls.

I've mentioned this before on here. I spoke to Amos last year, and he told me that the injury he had before last season started meant he wasn't fully fit and carried that injury into the season. His exact words to me were "Give me a proper off season and I'll show what I can do." And he did start playing better in the second half of the season.

Amos WAS a good player last year, our team just never attacked down the right hand side. Has everyone forgot all the moaning that was happening about Gleeson not being the player he should be too? When the ball did eventually find its way to the right hand side and Sam Tomkins missed out his brother, Amos did as much as Richards in attack. And no one on here said Richards was bad.

The fact that our team has learned to attack down the right hand side as well now, is maybe highlighting how much better Amos is playing, because he's getting more ball.


I will say one thing though... I didn't notice the ball land in Amos' hands all that much when Hull KR were kicking to his wing. That's still something that needs work on I feel.

It's not re-writing history to say in the second half of last season Roberts was the best winger at the club.

Better than Pat??? Just a question not a dig, but how do you come to this conclusion????

Because that is his, and a lot of other people's opinion? Because when DaveO states something it isn't actually FACT?

Big difference is, those who wanted Ainscough in the team at whatever expense used Roberts as the scapegoat to try and make that happen.

Those who Knew (In their opinion) that Roberts was a Good un and was playing well didn't need to have a pop at anyone else to justify his inclusion.

It's too easy for people to talk about him being a "Different Player" or he's playing Better because of a "Diggerent coach".

End of the day he was IMO & a lot of others, the best winger in the club last year and certainly the best right winger. His performances have got better, but I would say he's gone from a 8/10 to a 9/10 player for us.
Not the 4/10 to 8/10 that some people would, in their opinion, have you believe.

Last year certain posters claimed BN had a vendetta out against Ainscough and his non-inclusion was a disgrace and a complete mess up on BN's Part.

I asked the question, what will you say when MM picks Roberts over Ainscough? I again ask this question.
People will say oh well, that's because he is playing better than Ainscough now but he wasn't last year! Well I don't agree, I can't "PROVE" it, no-one can prove otherwise though.
All I know is that MM has picked almost the same team that BN did, he may be getting more out of them (We have a long way to go to prove this one yet) but that's a different argument.

As Woody_Woody says DaveO, He was the best winger at the club for certainly the 2nd half of the season and IMO probably the last 2/3rds.
He certainly was the best right winger.

Quite a lot of people agree, so having a dig at Rogues for having a different opinion to yours, stating things like "No its you who are wrong - yet again because you had nothing at all to base that opinion on." or "Or do you go off reputation rather than what you actually see with out own eyes?" and infer that these people you are quoting are some kind of idiots is nothing short of pathetic!
There's only 1 person who's coming across that way IMO

I would say that Amos has gone from a 6/10 last year to a 8/10 this year. I hope the guy does well because he came with a big reputation as a flyer. Like I said last week I hope that this is the Roberts we signed originally, he just looks hungrier this year, faster and sharper. I think he will certainly benefit from a fit and in form Gleeson this term. As for picking him over Ainscough if he is playing better and training better and scoring like he is doing so far. I wouldn't change him, as I was always a little unconvinced by Shauns defence, this was a area that Phil Clarke used to rave on about Amos his ability to get back and make the tackle. But I just think last year he needed time to settle, this year lets see how he goes in the next 4 games, Wire, Dragons, Bulls and Long FC as these will all have half backs who will look to kick to him.

Not having a great "rugby brain", I must defer to most of the comments made here. I would, however, like to make some observations as a former winger.
BN came to Wigan to save us from relegation, not to play "exciting" rugby. To do this he implemented a policy of tight play using, primarily, the pack. In attack, the ball was passed slowly along the line and across the field. This was demonstrated by investing is Stu. Fielden, one of the world's best forwards. The price we paid was that the outside men had no space in which to move. The system worked, we were saved from the drop. Howver, our whole plan was "forward" dominated. I said at the time that even Offiah would struggle to score in this team. Poor Calderwood has been slated here, but I remember some of the match-saving defending he did. Not what he was brought in for, but all he was able to give in the circumstances he was in.
Now we have a coach who wasn't a front row forward, the relegation threat is no longer and he can see the opportunity to use our backs. The team can play more adventurously, and Amos is no longer squeezed into a foot of space between him and the touchline. He has options to attack either side and is,
making best use of them.
One thing has been explained to me too, if he was carrying an injury last year, I understand why I thought then he wasn't fast enough to be a good winger.

but we also invested in a scrum half to sort the backs out, we invested in Fielden due to our other major front row forward being knackered (seu seu).

Noble just was inept at any other game plan except route 1.

We also had a hooker who didn't have a pass in him. Isn't it strange how we managed to score more tries after he left?

what does ainscough offer, he offers nothing, hes ok when he has no one infront of him and he is 5 yard from the line, he can run himself up his own and he it pathetic under a high ball, i think daz should have a go on the wing or even at full back,

Now that's a desperately unfair assessment of Ainscough as a player. He's a very agile winger with great acceleration and deceptively strong for his size, and also has great determination. Whilst he lacks a little experience defensively at super league level and does need to contest the high ball more (I believe he's been doing more since the early days last season), it's totally ridiculous to have a dig like that. Fair enough you can prefer Goulding or whoever you like on the wing or FB or whatever, but really there's knack all need to have a go at one of our own players so unfairly.

I agree. Ainscough has good acceleration, is strong and knows where the try line is. He is not as fast over the distance as say Roberts, Richards, Charnley or Marsh, but he is very dangerous from 0 to 40 metres out.

He's almost the polar opposite of Richards. Richards uses his power more than he steps and takes a while 2 get 2 his top speed.

I like Ainscough as I love watching him making the half breaks with his excellent footwork and darting runs. I hope madge can work on his kick defence cause it's his one weakness even if it's not as bad as some on here make out.

Imo i would play amos at fb put goulding on the wing mainly due to the fact that ainscoughs defensive positioning from kicks is a bit dodgy but it may have been worked on in pre season as amos has shown lol

And the only major threat i saw on saturday from warrington was from their attacking kicking game

I'll answer your earler post later but I just had to comment on this little gem. Dave, as someone who also can't see why anyone thinks O'Loughlin is a good player, I'm not sure your opinion on who is good and who isn't carries much weight with the majority of us on here....well, maybe BrettKenny!

I think that is the single biggest load of tripe you've ever posted Dave. "That is how it should be"?!?!? How arrogant a comment is that! These are human beings, not robots or computer programs! Each person is different and responds differently to different circumstances. You can't just take the example of a given person and say "all people should respond the same as that" just because it suits your argument! THE most pertinent fact in this argument is that there are numerous examples of both situations and that is how it IS!



Oh, I don't know Dave....maybe it came from actually understanding that not everyone responds, acts, performs etc. the same in any given situation. It's called 'real life'. You should try it sometime!



...and you're not???? How is it reasonable to use Smith's injury as a reason for performing under par yet say Amos should have hit the ground running despite his? There is only 1 disingenous viewpoint here and it isn't mine! As for the change of coach, I completely agree.



No, but he certainly played better.



Now, Dave, I'm fully aware that you're an intelligent man who is more than capable of understanding that his improvement can be down to any number of factors and the fact that a new coach is one reason he has improved does not exclude his being more settled as another reason. It's certainly not 'plain as day' as you so wrongly put it. In fact, why do you keep putting these things? You put 'everyone can see that' (or similar) further into the thread when, of course, not everyone does see it. Do you somehow think it makes your argument more valid? It doesn't.



This really is scraping the barrell Dave...even for you!

As such I won't even bother gracing it with an answer.

amos at full back for sat, richards did a great job there throughout last season, but is needed outwide in defence to deal with the kicks. would like to see price get a few games while phelps is out!!

Amos, obviously couldnt understand what Nobby was saying last year.

Nothing to do with poor form or being a bad player, just lost in translation

I think the logical call for next week would be to play Pryce on that right side with Roberts at fullback. He's a big lad that can hopefully deal with the ariel threat of Matt King and the guy needs a chance to show what he can do before it's too late. Hopefully if he does play we can all just have a good few weeks look at him and then people can make 'proper' judgments on his abilities either way.

The exciting call would be to bring Ainscough back in but that would have to be on the left wing imo with Richards playing at fullback. Like I say the exciting call but I want a win and aren't overly fussed on it being exciting.

Good call imo, I also think it would do him good being outside an inform Gleeson who's not only been great defensively but hopefully will be wanting a big game against his former club.

Gleeson will have a big role to play and will need to act as a leader and mentor for Pryce over the coming weeks(if thats the call). Pryce probably couldn't find himself outside a better centre really at the minute because Gleeson looks sharp and hungry in attack to add to his fantastic defence from last year.

I'd love to see Pryce come out on Saturday night and really throw himself into it. Get himself in at dummy half and take some runs out of his own half. Abit of hard work will soon change peoples opinions(including mine tbh) on him.

I hope the coaching staff and players are working Pryce up this week and really getting accross to him that this is his big chance.

I agree mate, it's a good chance for him if that's what the coaches feel best. Whilst I think he can make it as a centre in the long term, I think he needs a solid run in a position that's not quite as key and being on the wing outside a good centre would be ideal.

Said in pre season that Pryce imo has to settle in on the wing before he moves to centre. I'd never throw himself straight in at centre because he just looks very rusty which is totally understandable.

Even if he has a nightmare against King on Saturday he still should be selected for the Catalans game and the ones after that. The time has finally come for us to make the judgement on him.