He has looked nothing more than solid when I have seen him the last few seasons, although that might be a step up from what we have? The fact he’s gone Hull KR probably tells a lot.

Clubb Flower Navarette Hamlin Bullock and another big prop isn’t a bad pack imo. Don’t get all the negativity surrounding next season. Get both Lam’s in and we’ll see a good team. Only worry is Bateman but maybe Greenwood could give us an advantage, if we could improve his fitness he could be an 80 min machine

I don't see another prop coming in, it looks like we will have little salary cap to work with!

I don't think SO'L is carrying on next year, moving into coaching and last night my boss seemed to suggest Tommy is moving on. Source, Paul J. Should free up some serious cap space.

Shows how good a Ryan Sutton has been for us (And IMO How much we've missed him this last 6 weeks or so) to have played 100+ games for Wigan at the Top level by the time he was 22 (He's 23 tomorrow BTW)!
And maybe some shouldn't be so quick to criticise and understand that it takes time for players to Mature especially in certain positions.
I was absolutely gutted we lost Gelling and IMO Right Centre with everyone fit it would still be 1 area of concern (Sarge has been very good last 2 weeks - cue derision - but he's not a Right for me he's a Left or FB)

Sutton is the same - Gutted he's going
22/23 is still Young IMO for props

I really hope that the reserve league kicks on next year, Wigan have three excellent props who will be coming out of the academy, Byrne, Partington and Kibula, plus Havard who will still be academy age.
I'd also still like to keep Joe Bretherton to see if he can get over his injuries from the last two or three years.He's till only 22 years of age which is nothing for a prop.
I agree we also need more depth in the centre position, I hope we can give Sam Grant a contract, he's very elusive and deceptively strong for his size.

Is Jack Wells still around?

Yes, but I'm hearing that he won't play again this season. He damaged his foot in the pre-season game v Leigh and had an operation to fix it. However it hasn't gone well so it'll probably be next year before he's fit to play again.

I'm sure Tommy as already said he's playing on next season.

Phil Wilkinson is saying Leuluai and Lockers are expected to play on. His record is very good when it comes to rumours.

I didn't say he was retiring buddy.

Not doubting him or his record, I am simply stating this may have changed in light of impending appointments.

May well have done. He’d be one hell of a brave man (whoever he is) to show two experienced head like those the door (to another club or in to his coaching team) thoughgiven we’re losing some good quality players for 2019.

I reckon James Cunningham from London Broncos would be a great signing for any SL club

I think he's a very good hooker, didn't start in Hulls academy and play junior international before moving to London?

This is true and some would argue " lads will filter their way down to championship and league one clubs at 19/20 years of age" is an example of the system and salary cap working. I don't think it is. All Wigan and other clubs will do is release these players. I doubt that SL clubs have the time to spend trying to find clubs for players they will release and even if they did or the players found clubs themselves there is no guarantee the championship clubs have the resources to bring players on as well as SL sides especially as most are really part time. Players being released and ending up in championship clubs is not part of a well thought out master plan.

It bothers me that this "system" we have meaning no reserve grade probably means players are lost to the sport as a whole who might otherwise mature into really good players.

As to looking at the championship while we suffer with this system, I have no issues with that. Bullock looks the right sort of target player to me. He's not a total project player. He's 25 so is physically more mature for the position he plays in. If we had signed a 19 year ol prop who had potential I'd be skeptical as we have enough of those ourselves and there is no guarantee they will make it. This is why I was surprised we went for Hamlin. A singing like Bullock makes a lot more sense to me.

I'd like to see SL clubs work with the NCL more. That's an open age competition of good standard where some sides are starting to struggle for numbers. Get reserves playing at NCL clubs and they are guaranteed a game, and it gives good NCL players a chance to get picked up later in their careers if they look good alongside SL reserve players. It would also help ensure players aren't lost to the game if they don't make it at SL level, as they would be more likely to carry on in the NCL. Aside from the obvious benefit of getting some top players, the NCL clubs would also benefit from the kudos of being associated with an SL club, which may help attract more people to play for them/watch their games.

Obviously it would need to be sensibly managed - e.g no more than 3 reserves per club, maybe restricted to the top two divisions of the NCL, but I think there's mileage in it

I don’t buy into that at all I’m afraid. I think it’d be a terrible idea meddling with the amateur game.

The only effective remedy is to make academy teams compulsory across SL with non compliance resulting in removal. Bring back the old u18s and u21’s systems so we can have proper youth development and still keep the loan option to Championship and L1 clubs.

Putting professionals in against blokes who train once maybe twice a week and play on a Saturday for the love of the game would ruin the NCL IMHO. Dropping players also to accommodate them would turn players off, it would have certainly vexed me if was still playing NCL and was dropped for what I would call a Billy Big B*llocks

The way I see it There’s only really 2 options.

1: All SL clubs have a reserve side.

2: NCL clubs become feeder teams in the same way the NRL works with no chance of promotion.

Why should NCL clubs lose their own identity and be answerable to SL sides? It is like all the questions about SL sides really linking with clubs outside like they do in the NRL. To be fair there is no promotion from NCL premier anyway. Dual reg has been discussed and voted on in the conference, but how would you work it? The initial idea was about letting kids/players outside SL go back to their junior club but that would completely give an unbalanced advantage to a couple of teams such as St Pats, and Siddal.

This isn't a rant at all just be interested to see how people think it could work on a fair scale? I think there could be scope for it if done correctly but not where a club can not have the choice to play players from the pro game. It has to be a two way street. Participation levels are down and we need to find ways of cutting down players being lost to the game. In the good old days people would be signed from amateur straight into professional teams.

The academy structures for me give young kids dreams far too soon and when the clubs release the players they deem not good enough the kids especially nowadays lose complete interest straight away. This isn't just a rugby problem its across all sport, attitudes of young lads have completely changed.

Sorry for the essay just interested in the point with being involved with an NCL side

I don’t think it would would hence I’m in favour or a compulsory reserve grade.

Me neither mate far too much grey area surrounding. I think it's ridiculous that all SL don't have reserves personally. Especially when clubs like us (Bulls), Halifax and Keighley put sides out. I think Halifax have seen quite a few lads work their way through reserves to first team. Shows it can be done

1) Definately

2) Absolutely no chance of this. This could never ever be considered in any capacity whatsoever. It would kill the amateur game and a lot of clubs would rebel and breakaway.

I don’t get this sudden idea of making amateur clubs feeder teams. Why are we actively wanting to destroy the backbone to the game? It makes no sense whatsoever, utterly ridiculous notion that shouldn’t be considered in any shape or form.

It should be compulsory for all top level clubs to run an academy side. It’s bloody criminal it was ever put as non compulsory.

To be fair you will know better than me, I'm involved heavily with the amateur game but not as a player (couldn't tackle a Sunday dinner

). I'd prefer the system you propose, but clearly the clubs can't or won't pay for it, so we have SL fringe players sat not playing any rugby, meanwhile amateur clubs are struggling for players. I don't even mean just the smaller ones either. Blackbrook folded, Ince are struggling to fulfil fixtures, loads of Widnes teams have gone. Do you not think this would be a way to catch late bloomers also? A 25 year old who is killing it in the NCL amongst SL fringe players might have more chance of being noticed by an SL/Championship club, as opposed to having the door shut on him at 20 as is currently the case.

nothing wrong in making a suggestion, even if some disagree!



Possibly a way to get late bloomers but there are players from the NCL and even the North West Men’s League picked up by L1 and Championship clubs. Martyn Ridyard for example was picked up by Leigh when I played at LMR First Team and going further back Sam Gee and Chris Tuson picked up by Wigan when I was at St Pats moving from u18s to first team.

Much more recently two lads from Ashton were picked up by Swinton Lions when they were in L1 and one continued with them into the Championship before having to leave due to work. This season a player from Ashton returned to Barrow and played there for a few games. I know of one player from Folly Lane also picked up by Swinton and is playing quite regularly now.

So it does happen with players being picked up, I’m not aware of any SL clubs picking up an “older” amateur player - perhaps someone else does.