I'm not with you on the Rads question to the audience, he didn't dwell on it, he just asked it mid sentence and seemed to be more of a "Surely you don't want us to change this approach"?

The Highlighted bit is interesting, because they did mention that there were occasions when players not being selected to compliment the youth had them scratching their heads. Spoke to someone earlier today and they said someone was telling him that IL/Rads tell Lam who to pick

, I can't believe that to be true and would make me question Lam even more. So I'll leave that as complete and utter BS.
In the bit where they talked about Lam leaving they didn't crucify him, but I got an undercurrent that certain things like that had played a part in their decision to let him go. Now thats a short explanation of my feeling of what went on, it was far more nuanced than that. But I'm just trying to show that they accepted that things hadn't been good enough and that it was time to part ways.

They didn't play niave, they said they e created the issue by working him too hard etc etc.
That imo meant that they didn't manage the condition the way they should have done and that caused the situation were else then couldn't perform to the level he had at Souths were the same injury was being managed correctly.

Yip
You quoted the important part

As to Rads question it read as though Rads was challenging the audience not as if it was mentioned in passing. As you said no one piped up with an answer I took that to mean it was a direct and pointed question.

If the selections had them scratching their heads I am left wondering why they didn’t do something about it earlier. In my opinion the fact Lam has played a pack of young players far too often is damaging those players you mentioned they see as integral to the pack in the next few years. What were they afraid of?

So who was responsible for over training him then? This is a pretty astonishing admission that our coaching and physios aren’t up to the job.

Quote ="Jukesays"Which bit of it do you not understand? If its the bit about not streaming it I've said a dozen times I'm 50/50 I can honestly see why people may question it, but I can see, given negotiations/issues the club are currently involved with and have been involved in with a number of other parties they may not want to risk being caught on the hop. I get the argument that they could have done a forum "light" and live streamed it, but I'm sure lots of people, pro abamy the same who are up in arms now would probably call it rubbish and they didn't tell us any detail etc. If they edit it and put it out delayed im sure there will ne complaints about that. Now I expected people having a whinge, but people saying that's them done with the club, being appalled etc somenofnthe language used about thise that went, I could go on. I've spoke to 4/5 mates who couldn't go in last 2 days, none of them Have moaned about not going. Maybe thats not a fair sample, who knows? Maybe 99% of people.are outraged? I suspect the outraged may be the most vocal 10%, but I could be wrong I can honestly say, if I hadn't have gone, or it clashed and I couldnt go I genuinely wouldn't have given it more than 2 seconds thought. Picked up a few snippets here amd there, spoke to people who may have gone etc. But maybe I'm in the minority, I'm not one of those that thinks I need to know everything I don't get outraged about stuff and feel I have to comment on most stuff (ill clarify that, I mean I'm not one-off those on twitter, Facebook commenting or having opinions on stuff all the time). What typing someone put this in out WhatsApp group https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby- ... es-3369420 I think to myself what makes people do that? I don't like Lam as a coach, but I do wonder if people actually think before they say things, do things etx. And the gods honest truth is i don't think so As I said the other day, I thought that people may be understanding more of the issues,problems etc that people have gone through and show a bit of u derstanding But it seems like some people are even more enraged about the tiniest thig etc and perceived wrongdoings theyve "suffered" than they ever were. It'll its about any particular topic you'd have to be more specific.'" Imagine getting stuck in to Lam to that degree I’m his biggest critic on here but I like to think it’s constructive and it’s never personal. I think the world of Lammy the player and Lammy the bloke. The coaching version is sadly not good enough IMO but when I see idiots younger than his playing boots at Wigan, holding banners up calling for his head, that feels sad. I read about Lams press conference today where they asked him about his times at Wigan and they said he filled up and was in tears talking about how he loves it here and he loves the club. I hate questioning a guy like that, I know he hasn’t meant to be a let down as a coach but it’s just turned out that way. I really hope whatever happens now, we can have a good send off for Lammy. He’s a Wigan legend and we can’t forget that.

Quote ="Jukesays"Which bit of it do you not understand? If its the bit about not streaming it I've said a dozen times I'm 50/50 I can honestly see why people may question it, but I can see, given negotiations/issues the club are currently involved with and have been involved in with a number of other parties they may not want to risk being caught on the hop. I get the argument that they could have done a forum "light" and live streamed it, but I'm sure lots of people, pro abamy the same who are up in arms now would probably call it rubbish and they didn't tell us any detail etc. If they edit it and put it out delayed im sure there will ne complaints about that. Now I expected people having a whinge, but people saying that's them done with the club, being appalled etc somenofnthe language used about thise that went, I could go on. I've spoke to 4/5 mates who couldn't go in last 2 days, none of them Have moaned about not going. Maybe thats not a fair sample, who knows? Maybe 99% of people.are outraged? I suspect the outraged may be the most vocal 10%, but I could be wrong I can honestly say, if I hadn't have gone, or it clashed and I couldnt go I genuinely wouldn't have given it more than 2 seconds thought. Picked up a few snippets here amd there, spoke to people who may have gone etc. But maybe I'm in the minority, I'm not one of those that thinks I need to know everything I don't get outraged about stuff and feel I have to comment on most stuff (ill clarify that, I mean I'm not one-off those on twitter, Facebook commenting or having opinions on stuff all the time). What typing someone put this in out WhatsApp group https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby- ... es-3369420 I think to myself what makes people do that? I don't like Lam as a coach, but I do wonder if people actually think before they say things, do things etx. And the gods honest truth is i don't think so As I said the other day, I thought that people may be understanding more of the issues,problems etc that people have gone through and show a bit of u derstanding But it seems like some people are even more enraged about the tiniest thig etc and perceived wrongdoings theyve "suffered" than they ever were. It'll its about any particular topic you'd have to be more specific.'" Imagine getting stuck in to Lam to that degree I’m his biggest critic on here but I like to think it’s constructive and it’s never personal. I think the world of Lammy the player and Lammy the bloke. The coaching version is sadly not good enough IMO but when I see idiots younger than his playing boots at Wigan, holding banners up calling for his head, that feels sad. I read about Lams press conference today where they asked him about his times at Wigan and they said he filled up and was in tears talking about how he loves it here and he loves the club. I hate questioning a guy like that, I know he hasn’t meant to be a let down as a coach but it’s just turned out that way. I really hope whatever happens now, we can have a good send off for Lammy. He’s a Wigan legend and we can’t forget that.

There’s been far too many poor decisions regarding the playing squad for Rads/IL/head coach not to take blame for the lack of recent success and a poor season that will result in losing a lot of fans. The sum of these decisions cannot be blamed on “bad luck”.

I’m not that bothered about him but the situation around Hankinson seemed bizarre and conflicting messages that seemed like we didn’t know the detail.

Both French and Field arrived as square pegs in round holes with seemingly no real clue where to play them. Luckily French found some great form at FB whilst wearing the 6 shirt after starting on the wing.

Add onto that moving on Davies and Sarginson which seemed rash at the time and even worse now. Both in England squads after leaving.

Signing a 30 year old centre who plays for a relegated club to replace a 25 year old international.

The as mentioned Tony Clubb extension. Signing Clark and Bullock, two of the worst props in the league. Navarette was awful. Tautai



Sammut signing was bizzare.

We’ve won nearly all of the U19s championships in the last 10 years but now have a bunch of slightly above-average youngsters. I can’t pick one that I could safely say will be a regular international in the future. What is going wrong?

Interesting to hear the question about bringing young lads through. It should not be either develop our own or buy in, it should be both. The club has failed to strengthen successfully in too many areas for too long. We have relied on inexperienced players and in so doing have probably retarded their development.
Sadly we really are trying to get back into the top four yet our best rivals seem to be able to pick up quality. Saints manage to bring in players close to their peak whilst we are looking for projects which too often fail.
This has all come back to bite us. Rather than being able to build and recruit over time we are now scrabbling round for enough quality so that we do not miss the cut when the league reduced to ten teams.

Cameo of the Leeds team bringing all the young kids at once under Dean Bell we all know how that finished they all matured together and won trophies galore . When Dean Bell was coach the Leeds fans stayed away in droves because he was picking a young team we all know how that went on to win everything. They got a change of coach the rest is history .

Possibly in a "You are going to be trained hard to remove that blubber" kind of way, and the additional training may have been a contributory factor in doing his hip in. Civil Law is based on a balance of probability and if the club were 51% to blame for training him, whilst he was 49% to blame for letting himself get into a condition that he needed training, he'd win.

The first bit of what you said is pretty much how it was put, that their handling of his preseason and getting him ready pushed it too far.

Agreed. It's OK describing at a fans forum numerous people are involved with identifying players the club signs with IL and Rads having final sign off but how much acknowledgement if any was made of the issues above? Where they trying to share the blame for bad decisions amongst the collective and do they even realise many if not most of the fans think decisions like signing Thornley (again) are a rubbish move? They appear to have a process in place but don't seem to realise it quite often delivers bad results.

Not sure they're too concerned with who fans think we should sign especially given some of the names banded around on here.

Come on Dave

First it was bad when people thought it was IL/KR only signed the players so lets have a go at them
Now because they say there are others in the process its they're deflecting blame so we'll have a go at them.

I'm sure IL would love to go and sign lattrell Mitchell, we haven't got the money and he wouldn't come etc etc

I've said it before, I will blame IL/KR for asking Lam to be there for 1 Yr, then subsequently extending it when the Edwards fiasco hit.
I do blame IL/KR for announcing Edwards without having his name on a contract and all details agreed, especially when they get stick normally for dotting i's and crossing t's and not announcing stuff earlier on most other things.

But the current trend of blaming rhem for everything is poor form.

We have failed do get the best out of virtually every player and every junior over the last 3 years with a lot actually regressing.
I blame Lam for that, but I blame IL/Rads for appointing/sticking with him too long.

We cant change the owners as easy, we need a strong coach and coaching set up that will oversee thigs and get us back on track (Look at the transformation at Saints since Holbrook came in, even with same owners that were getting flak for the previous 6/7 years whilst Wigan were doing so well).

The added complications of covid/less income/other rfl&sl issues make it a poor time to be struggling, but the overwhelming thingbi took away from the evening was that a lot of people are working very hard to get us through it and come out the other end "Relatively" unscathed and in a better position than most.

Details finally here.

[urlhttps://wiganwarriors.com/blog/2021/09/03/fans-forum-the-first-hour/[/url

I’ve read both articles and it may sound like I’m backtracking here but I’m relieved and encouraged. I’m glad at their brutal honesty at the situation of the club, the future and everything else (I’m not getting into the Edwards saga of which I know little about).

It should have either been live streamed or made available on Wigan TV but it is what it is. Most of my frustration was borne from a poor season topped with the - at the time - closed shop ‘fans forum’.

The future is bright for Wigan. I believe that 100%. We have the squad and set up for it to be so. We aren’t going back to 2005/06. We’ve made signings where needed, looking at signing more and appointing a new Head Coach, which by the looks of what IFL said isn’t Shaun Wane. What we all need to do now is get through 2021 and look forward to 2022. The potential for this team is clear to see.

Glad this has been made public now. Maybe a lesson for the club to at least put out a holding message next time letting people know it was coming. Got to say I'm disappointed with Hardaker. I'd like to think if an employer took a chance on me after doing all the things he has done, that I would need a much better reason that that to try to get an early contract release. Not quite on the same scale but it reminds me of what Hock did. We got some good performances out of both but there's no appreciation there for the club going out on a limb.

I was worried when they said only £73k left under the budget before KR corrected that we had money for a halfback on top of that! George Williams - it's funny how no one ever wants to 'try a new challenge' for the same money or less.

Pretty sure both left of their own accord. The club didn't want rid of either as far as I'm aware. Davies was the third best winger at the time and left to somewhere he would be a starter. Sarginson more about making a new start after a bereavement as I understand it.

I’m hoping when they talk about player welfare but maybe being too nice in the past is a nod towards telling Hardaker to get his head down. If he wants to live in Yorkshire that’s his choice but his job is at Wigan and he has a contract. He’s a very good player and the club can’t just roll over. At his best he’s one of the best players in the league, so if Cas, Wakey or whoever want him, we should be getting either a healthy amount of cash or we should be getting a player of a similar standing in return. There’s not many Zak Hardakers at Cas or Wakey but guys like Trueman, Evalds or Tom Johnston should be in any conversation or they should be told where to go.

Sounds like 2 years of hell.
You cannot complain now. That is a mirror on the situation of the club at the minute.

Time to get behind them.
And whoever the feck is ringing the ticket office and giving the staff their wants to hang their heads in shame!!

That really bugs me I have to say. People too thick or self-entitled to realise who or what is really at fault. They need to get over themselves.

Very glad the details are out. Enjoyed reading both articles.

There are always some who, whenever there is a vague sense of dissatisfaction with the club, take it as an invite to go open season on everyone involved with Wigan RL.

Are they real Wigan fans? Most probably think they are.

Apparently, Lam and the two female administration members of the club staff who have been with the club for many years were subjected to all kinds of disgusting abuse, which included foul mouth language.

What kind of supporter is the club and the game attracting these days?

I would like to thank Ian and Kris for releasing he blog. They’ve either listened to the frustrations of many or intended to do it anyway, if the latter it would have saved a whole lot of angst if they’d stayed it would be released in due course.