I've had the pleasure of root canal this morning, however reading this has more than eased the pain. Please God let this be true.

There was a tribute paid to Eddie Hemmings at the MOS dinner. He announced it was his last time and that the reason was Stevo's decision to retire after the next GF. Presumably they want to shuffle off together. Not a moment too soon IMO, not least because I distinctly heard him say to his companions "come on you Leeds" in the hotel bar afterwards.


EDIT: Apologies for derailing the thread.

Farrell's a great player. The niggly stuff needs to go though. Could have cost Wigan the game much sooner imo

Farrell is by no means small himself. He never takes a backward step and has played against larger players, at both club and international level, many times and fared better than most. He is in the England set up on merit.

It'll be interesting to see him up against Taupau if he gets the chance. I can't see it ending well for Faz!

Faz has come up against plenty of big players in Superleague and in international rugby and I've yet to see him be totally dominated or taken apart. He cause lots of problems going the other way with his footwork, speed and running lines and his defensive technique is impeccable.

It's not ideal to be giving size away but he can handle it IMO. That link up with George Williams and Joe Burgess has been pretty special this year at times and I expect McNamara wants to recreate that with England.

Spot on NK.
Liam Farrell is the best rugby playing second rower in SL by a mile.
He isn't the biggest but he is the best.
Personally I don't want a 17 stone but no rugby brain guy to be my main forward line breaking threat. Farrell has speed, toughness and can pass a ball well which differentiates him from Southwrn Hemisphere numnuts who consider strength to be main the only ingredient required to be a top forward.
Bring on the Kiwis

He'll do just fine. For me he's the best second row forward England have. Westwood has had his best years & Ferres doesn't have the same work ethic or ability. JJB falls into the same category as Westwood & Ablett the same as Ferres.

Good SL player Farrell, but too small at international level. Loads of energy but he'll be a penalty machine in the Test.

Who would you play in the second row then?

I think Bateman has done enough to get a go, and from the squad I'd go with Ferres. Incidentally, I wasn't saying that I would play him, I just think he'll struggle against the very physical Kiwi forwards.

I expect Farrell will struggle at times with the size and power of the Kiwi pack. But then so will anybody else. Lots of NRL players struggle with it too.

We should pick him because he's a terrific player, and the best option for the position. On the flip side of the size problem, I think some of the kiwis might struggle with the footwork and turn of speed that he has. The acceleration for the opening try of the GF was superb.

I'd be very tempted to partner him with Bateman. I find both of them quite hard to like (because they're niggly b*st*rds, and like everyone else, I only like niggly b*st*rds when they play for my own team). But they're not paid to be liked. They're paid to get the job done and I think they've both been excellent every time I've seen them this year.

We also, I recall, had this debate before the 4 nations last year. I too thought he'd be too small. I revised that view after watching the matches. He never looked like he wouldn't cope physically.

He should play against the kiwis. Simple as that, IMO. Pick the best players.

Personally I'd pick the criminally under-rated Ablett in there somewhere too. But that's the trouble with being criminally under-rated. C'est la vie.

On the original topic, his reaction to the two McGuire tries did him no favours. But again, he isn't paid to be likeable. He didn't deserve to be on the losing side, but then out of two squads of 17 I didn't think anyone, except Tony Clubb's aberrant last few minutes, played badly.

Farell is bigger than Bateman

I seriously doubt there's much in them but, to me, Bateman is bigger. Not that it matters, of course.

I don't think so. We commented on Saturday when they were walking back together for about the fourth time

after a try had been scored. Bateman maybe slightly taller but I reckon Farrell has the bigger build.

Farrell is definitely bigger than Bateman

Not according to the England RL website he isn't.
EDIT: Mind you, that site says Bateman is taller and heavier than Ryan Hall, so.....

Yeah I've stood next to Bateman he's never 6'1, think they tend to fabricate stats for those things

Quite a few years ago I saw some stats given for a GB team and Rob Burrow was given as 5ft-10.

He was stood on the SL trophy when the photo was taken

Farrell has a good 5kg on Bateman. John may be slightly taller, but it Farrell is bigger built.

To misquote Mark Twain - “It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog.”

Bateman and Farrell both do just fine for me. The effort that these two put in every time they cross the line is awesome - Who cares if they are 5'11" or 6'??

"Farrell is too small for internationals" is one of those buzz statements that people churn out without much to substantiate it. He was the only forward to play the full 80 on Sunday, he got through a ton of work both defensively and in attack and didn't look out of place. I think the combination of Farrell and Whitehead with Ferres coming off the bench is a pretty good balance in the SR.

Well I for one hope he continues to prove me wrong. He may well turn out to be the exception that proves the rule. Time will tell.

My views were based on his performances in the 4N last year, when he lost the ball in contact a few times and simply didn't look comfortable in the collision. I still have my doubts but his workrate in defence can't be faulted.