So what you’re saying is indoctrinate the kids, no leave them alone.

Nobody needed to tell my brother he was gay, nobody needed to educate him, he found out for himself in his teens. He was supported by all his family and came out in his late teens. Good for him. He babysits for me, comes round for parties and so in and he and his partner are very welcome, if he starts telling the kids about pride and homosexuality then that’s when I’ll tell him to stop but he won’t, because he’s not preaching, he’s not a militant in your face, like LGBTQ or you’re a bigot type, he just gets on with it.

This isn’t a workplace whereby everybody is a free thinking adult, this is a rugby club where many of the fans are children with impressionable minds and they shouldn’t have this issue thrown in their faces, it’s uo to the parents to teach it to them if and when they see fit.

Bit odd to throw the term indoctrination when we're talking about someones Christian values meaning they don't like gay people. I'm not sure saying "LGBT people are normal" is indoctrination either. Is educating a child about race indoctrination?



If this is true, then that's great, however, many families don't welcome and support. Many people grow up hating people like your brother, and perhaps some conversations at an early age might change that.



Do you think telling children that sometimes men can love men and women can love women will give them the gay? Do you think it's more damaging than having soldiers turn up and have them know about wars, for example? I'm sure your children already know about homosexuality given your brother, however, most people don't grow up in that environment. Do you think knowing your brother loves a man instead of a woman has harmed them in any way?

You've got a bee in your bonnet about this haven't you.

People.have different opinions - they aren't going to change them, just as much as you aren't going to change yours.

Keep calling each other names tho. That doesn't make either party look stupid at all.

On the day of the new season, one that I’ve been waiting for for what seems like ages is upon us we are debating teaching people LGBTQ stuff and it should t be the case. Like I said before, politics and religion should be kept out of sport same with this. As nothing should take the limelight away from the sport, that’s is why I’m against it. If they want a parade fine, have your parade but leave the rugby alone and especially leave the kids alone.

Couldn’t give a toss whether 1 rugby player believes that all sinners will go to Narnia, heaven, hell, Hull or Hogwarts.

Couldn’t care less of someone wants to marry a man or woman, or both, or his coffee table I couldn’t care less.

One thing I do care about if when it encroaches onto Wigan rugby league club and when kids are involved. Like I said before, just because I’m not ‘for’ something, doesn’t mean I’m against it.

I’ve made my point, I’ve made my feelings known, I won’t be attending the Catalans game which is a shame because I was looking forward to seeing James Maloney play. I won’t be speaking much more about it because we’re going over old ground and off topic and detracting away from what is important and that’s the Warrington game.

I mean you haven't answered my reasonable questions which is a shame, I was looking forward to hearing your logical and moral gymnastics.

This thread isn't about the Warrington game, so it's not detracting away from the Warrington game. That's why we have multiple topics, to discuss more than one issue.

Anyway, enjoy the game.

Not interested.

Just on this, none of the above are socio-political causes. You could, I suppose, make an argument for armed forces day but I thought the specific link there came through the affiliation to forces rugby league.

I can't say that I'm comfortable with the way the point is being made but that shouldn't detract from the meaning (or maybe it should) which is not every event or theme is directly comparable. Mother's Day is not the same as Brexit. Celebrating one does not mean you should celebrate the other. Similarly, having a Mother's Day theme does not mean you should have a Pride day. They are different animals.

No cause is more or less worthy than any other, except on a personal level. That's why support of any given cause should be a personal choice unless, as I say, that 'personal' link is to the club itself or the sport or community it represents.

Being a mother is just a thing that is. Being gay is just a thing that is. Its not a social issue or a political one. It just is. So i would say both are free to be celebrated. Personally i don't like it when the club celebrates fathers day, as mine is about as useful as a chocolate fireguard, but i wouldn't say they shouldn't do it

All I'm pointing out (And I believe the other poster is making it clear what his views are) is that no-one is ramming LGBTQ down anyone throat anymore than an armed forces day is ramming the "Glory" of War down someone's throat for example.
Championing LGBTQ is no different to holding a Mental Health awareness day (And remember not long ago it wasn't as acceptable to be open up about Mental Health issues which created a lot of misery for sufferers).
Not that long ago people with mental Health issues kept them secret for fear of ridicule, and that stigma still exists, but we have to keep on championing it's cause so it doesn't become one again.

I have No idea why anyone recognising any part of the more marginalised or vulnerable parts of society should cause anyone else who isn't interested in it a problem?
I will 100% guarantee that if a player had expressed horrible views about mental illness and then Wigan had announced they would hold a mental Health awareness game against that players club No-one would have batted and eye and criticised the club for doing it
Why is this any different?

You 100% correctly make the comparison that celebrating 1 thing doesn't necessarily mean we should celebrate another and quite rightly make the link to the Club itself by saying "That's why support of any given cause should be a personal choice unless, as I say, that 'personal' link is to the club itself or the sport or community it represents".

However - Why is the club linked to Mental Health awareness but not LGBTQ?
Why is it linked to Armed forces day but not LGBTQ?
Why is it linked to Disability issues but not LGBTQ?
Even if the club doesn't think it's linked to LGBTQ (Which it is) why does it matter that they want to help?
How does it affect the casual fan that may not be interested in LGBTQ issues?
If it's because they have to look at a Few Rainbow flags & hear a couple of announcements over a tannoy I'm not sure that's a big thing and not sure why anyone would feel Bad about that?
Especially when the same things happen for other worthy causes and no one bats an eye?

Will Hardaker be playing that day?

You're a bit late to the party sunshine

By bit he means quite a lot. At least 3 days and 10 pages.

But to answer the question, yes, yes he will

There's quite a difference between what Hardaker and what Folau did.

In your own personal opinion. of course!

I hope all the straight people boycott the game. Wigan should not have done this, as supporters who have season tickets lose out if they prefer not to attend. I certainly wouldn`t go if I was a Wigan supporter, I would be afraid of being classed as a gay or rainbow warrior.

Or worse, a Huddersfield fan!

6% of the UK are LGBTQ.

10% are ginger, the one demographic that is openly oppressed yet goes totally ignored.

If anything, we should have a ginger day and celebrate gingers because they are the friendliest bunch going.

Had this comment been racial the topic would have been locked, just saying.

"Gay pride or LGBT pride is the promotion of the self-affirmation, dignity, equality, and increased visibility of lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender people as a social group. Pride, as opposed to shame and social stigma, is the predominant outlook that bolsters most LGBT rights movements."

I'll leave you to ponder on what constitutes a socio-political movement for yourself.

And if we did, I'd be ok with that, would you?

Firstly, let me make it clear once again, as it doesn't seem to be getting through, that I'm not expressing support of those views and certainly not in the manner they're being expressed, I'm expressing the support of someone to hold an alternative viewpoint, whether it's popular or not.

You seem to be agreeing with me on many points although I'm not sure you're aware of it. For example, I couldn't agree more that, if this is the stance the club is taking, then it should be rolled out across more causes. Why just one game? Why not every game a different cause? The point I have been making throughout is not one cause above all others.

To address the main point we seem to disagree on. You say 'why so and so and not LBGTQ?' Well, the answer to that goes to the 2nd point I've been making which is they have specific connections to the club, sport or community. Mental health through it's direct impact on former players, notably Terry Newton and forces and disability through their respective rugby league competitions,

Had we had a player suffering homophobic abuse or there were LBGTQ rugby league competitions then I would agree that this was a similar case. I'm not aware that there are but if that's indeed the case then fair enough. Failing any particular affiliation to our club or sport though, my original point stands. All or nothing is not an unreasonable stance.

Not really, and for the same reasons. Similarly I wouldn't be against it if the club decided to go down this route as long as we had similarly themed blonde days, brown haired days, no hair days, changeable colour hair days. In fact this, ludicrous though the intent, illustrates my point perfectly.

Religious persecution?

I've genuinely never heard the term before so I'm looking at it and now. I understand the social part, not so much the political part. I guess wanting equal rights is the political part?

I stand by saying being gay isnt a sociopolitical issue, but I understand why pride events would be

Yes, that's the distinction I'm making. In no way was I aiming any comments I've made at the state of being gay. It's specifically being marketed as a Pride event. I have no problem whatsoever with Pride as a movement either btw. I'm only raising a point about why one socio-political movement should be favoured over others when there is no specific connection to either the Wigan club or rugby league in general.

If they'd marketed it as, say, an 'inclusion event' and aimed it at minority, disadvantaged or disenfranchised groups from any walk of life then I can see an argument for it as it isn't excluding other equally worthy causes. I still wouldn't be convinced of the validity of a sporting club making these, what should be personal, decisions for it's supporters but at least it would, by default, be more representative of it's target demographic.

It's been an interesting debate but the rugby season has started now so I hope you'll excuse me if I respectfully bow out of the conversation here. Have a good season.