Not THAT old chestnut AGAIN.





Unbelievable. That myth/urban legend/pro-SC, anti-Wigan propaganda has been trotted out and then demolished so many times on this board.... dearie me....

Thats the best post i have read on this site in a long time! Proves everyone wrong who says it is better under the current system.

We are simply rewarding crapness now!

You'll find if you look back over the years that there are few of us that have been trying to educate the Super Duper League lovers, but alas they are so blinkered.

They are from the Eddie Hemmings school who believe players x and y are the "best in the world"

Like it or not Rugby League in this country has gone backwards massively since Super League came into being.

The World Cup was the culmination of years of competitive mediocrity and the majority will not admit it.

"There are none so blind as those who will not see."

With a tear to my eye your right, the standard has gone down so much.

Someone said on here the other week when we played Manly our half-backs and LF was Gregory, Edwards and Hanly, Leeds had the other week Burrow, Mcguire and Sinfield. That is a massive gulf in class.

Yes Saints came joint top in 92/93. That Saints team would get MURDERED by the team of the last 5 years, so no drop in standards at KR thanks.

Wigan fans bang on about how their all conquering team was full of Wiganers - in that case your youth structure isn't developing players as well any more and the drop in standards at Wigan is down to your own failures, not some imaginary salary cap failure.

What a load of nonsense. Just because one club (i.e. your club, Wigan) don't have as quality a team as they did years ago, somehow the WHOLE competition is inferior? Yeah right.

No one really believes Eddie when he says Wellens is the best in the world, and maybe the international team isn't as good as it used to be. But then again how many Ashes series did GB win when it was stacked full of Wigan players in the 80s and early 90s? Yes there were one off wins, just as there have been throughout SL. The difference is that the competition has levelled out (it still has far to go mind) so that no one team is certain to win the league from the start of the season, and the quality players are more evenly distributed around the competition. OK, so Leeds have won the GF two years running, but both times they were arguably underdogs to do so, and other teams including Wigan could well have prevailed instead.

Why is it that out of 14 clubs in the competition only Wigan fans are bemoaning the lack of quality of SL compared to 10 years ago... It certainly is a fairer system than when one wealthy club was able to have the pick of the available players (from league and union). Unfortunately Wigan appear to be stuck in this mindset that success can be bought, and until that changes the club will continue to fail to win trophies.

Please go Back And Read again!

The elite players produced by this competition are no nearer (And IMHO further away) from their Southern Hemisphere Counterparts than they were 15 years ago!

SL and it's supposed increased competitiveness would prepare our players better and produce better results in the ultimate test, International Rugby!

Has it done that???? I won't insult you be giving you the answer as deep down you know the answer really.

It comes down to this

Success of the SL Competition and the success of the International team have almost NO bearing on each other!
This has been proved in the Premier League and in SL IMHO.

The Premier league is the "Best" League int he world supposedly but are the National team any better than they were in 1990???
Are they Hell !

Are the players in the current international team any better than their predeccessors at both sports??
Are they Hell !

Would the GB team of 90/92 beat the team of today??
Course they would! and if you fool yourself otherwise and talk about fitness then basically all your saying is that whatever team Saints/Leeds/Wigan have in 20 years they will be better than the current teams because their Fitter. They may be be, but they won't be Better!

Steadman
Hampson
Lydon
Offiah
Davies
Schofield
Newlove
Connolly
Deveraux
Powell
Hulme
Edwards
Gregory


V


Wellens
Sykes
Gardner
Senior
Gleeson
Calderwood
Smith
Burrow
Pryce
McGuire

Yeah, I know who I'm Backing!

Yeah, the team with 13 players

The Point my Friend, is that 15 or so years ago we had far more Quality players vying for International jerseys (certainly in the Backs that's why I highlighted them) than we have now!
IMHO they were also closer to their Aus Counterparts!

Whatever the

was for I'm not sure but if you would like a resoned debate then expand your thoughts a touch further if that's possible???

AJ,
To highlight it even further you have missed Bateman, Ellis and Goulding off you list.

And probably Many More! TBH I Couldn't think of Many More for the Current GB Team!



Yeaman??
Raynor (Probably should have out him in)
And then a Whole Host of untested players who IMHO wouldn't bridge the gap at all.

Connolly?? Newlove??? Powell??? P- lease! They may have good for their clubs but they were poor for GB/England. Senior, Gleeson, McGuire, and even Burrow have performed better than they did at test level. Even Edwards (again, class in a dominent Wigan team) did nothing at test level (apart from deck Bradley Clyde.

And Davies is Welsh!

On top of that, just how bad would have been all those years ago if wern't able to bring in the best Union backs over like now?

I don't thinks it all as cut and dry as that, the game has changed an awful lot in that time, there no doubting that the modern players are a lot fitter and faster, who’s to say that the 80s/90s players could keep up with the pace of the modern game for 80mins.

Maybe they looked more skillful because they had more time on the ball (think Long, McGuire, Pryce in the SL compared to International).

And who's to say that we have a god given right to have the most naturally skillful players in the world, we could swap entire coaching and youth development systems with the Aussies but if the raw natural talent isn't there then we will always be second best.

But were they not just as fit?
Don't forget they played more game time, none of this 12 interchange rule.

You're halfway there. Gregory, Edwards and Hanley are a massive gulf in class away from your players currently occupying those positions.

The reverse applies to those from Leeds; their current 6, 7 & 13 are better than those filling similar slots back then.

You could be right and proving either is a pointless fog knitting exercise but IMO just from watching the game I think today’s players are fitter.

and yet, those guys never won anything at international level either. The current crop may not be much good (in your opinion) but in terms of achievements, they are on a par with every player you have listed there.

This is an impossible argument,

however i think it is apparent that we had more depth back in the day than we do now! And that was always seen as a problem back then.

I dont think past players are 'better' than modern day players, however it would be interesting to see someone like Hanley, with all the modern day methods.

One thing i think is true though, is that as a whole the 'skill level' is down on the 80/90's

We as a sport are still suffering from the bigger the better mentality of the turn of the century teams, with what is nothing more than a second row in each position, and a scrum half/stand off who can play a bit.

The sport has gone backwards in my opinion in skill, however it should have improved due to summer rugby meaning we didnt have to play on muddy pitches in the middle of winter.

And How Many of our players are coveted by the Aussies Down Under????

Not Many!

Back then they would Have snatched our hands off for a dozen of our players!

SL players earn far more playing in SL than they would to play in the NRL. 20 years ago it didn't matter because the seasons ran at separate times of the year

And if it was the same as 15 years ago, How many would they come for splashing Decent Money At???

Well Jordan Tansey, Ian Sibbit, Chris Thorman, Keith Mason, RICHIE MATHERS, Gareth Ellis, Adrien Morley have all gone to the NRL in recent years so I'm guessing theres a fair few who could go to the NRL if they wanted to go.

5 of those are average at best as proved by themselves in the NRL and SL.

Thats my point. If players of that standard can get an NRL gig I'm sure SLs top British players could.

(I forgot to mention Carney as well whom was the top winger in the NRL when over there)

Connolly and Newlove, two of the best centres this country has ever produced and never once let GB down. And you're saying Senior and Gleeson have performed better than they did at test level?! Not sure what Davies being Welsh has to do with anything. I think you need to ask your friends to do some more research for you.