We need to learn from Rugby Union conditioning. Interview with Josh Charnley in today's Times says he is 6ft 3ins tall. Incredible. They've given him an extra three inches in height in less than a month at Sale.

Sounds like more of the 'overselling to their public' doo-dah that RU routinely indulges in to justify such expenditure on RL players. A bit like 'Sam Burgess can literally run through brick walls'.

And then, of course, when the RU fans discover he's a man of flesh and blood, the knives appear.

I saw him say "It was like going to a new school", i immediately and bitchily thought "junior school?"...

6ft 3

I'm sure i saw somewhere he was 6' 1"....

Jeez, Wiki has him as 6' 1" and[u 16 st 3 lb[/u... lol

They always seem to beef up these stats, can only guess that it's a marketing thing.

I think the usual stats for Josh are about 6ft and somewhere north of 14st 7 but having once met him, I have to say I think those might be slightly generous...

Every inch matters

Just back from Sale v Wasps (free ticket) Charnley played just under 20 minutes made 1 tackle was second man in another both in midfield did not have any ball in hand not a pass or kick to catch.

One regular sat behind me commented "baby steps, he'll learn" well may be he will and may be he won't but one thing is for sure he won't have made many easier pay packets.

If that's the usual fare dished up by our rugby union counterparts then I'd question the value of my ticket, terrible conditions granted but a grind of a game

Only one thing to say to Josh about this:

'Welcome to the rest of your career.'

But at least it's easy money.

It was a very odd experience for me actually wanting Charnley to get the ball bust through a couple of tackles, scorch down the wing and dive over in the corner, but, in my defence last night he was representing Rugby League.

I have no idea of what his motivation is I can't see a straight path to England a la Burgess, but, I wouldn't be surprised to see him back in a couple of years. Any more of that witnessed last night and he'll be bored to tears with a lot less miles on the clock if he'd stuck with the superior code so will be fresh as a daisy.

Before last season, I'd have said that his motivation was to find an easier career ... and didn't surprise me in the last that I heard he was toying with the idea of switching to RU.

During last season, when we saw the Josh of old - a hard and fearless worker - I decided he was just going for the money. That can be the only explanation. He'll also probably score a lot of tries, because judging by the defence on show from the All Blacks against Ireland yesterday - "the best rugby team on the planet" - he won't have to worry about breaking many tackles.

It must be money, and i can't blame him to be honest...

No one can ever blame any RL player for going to RU for money, there is an abundance of it in RU and our code will always play second fiddle to the dark side and the best RL players will always go to RU for an easy large pay check, Denny Solomona being another example it seems.

Hello Sale fan here (and Warrington). One of those rare folk who loves both codes equally. Of course money is a factor. A decent Union player will earn more than most top league players, so Sale can probably pay him an extra 50K without breaking sweat. Ironically, Charnley didn't break sweat in his debut.

Its a bit embarrassing frankly not getting the ball in 20 mins. However there are mitigating factors. As pointed out the weather was shocking, and when Josh came on we were trying to close the game down, having established a decent league in bad conditions it was the right tactic. As a result Josh wasn't going to get any ball, but at least he got a run out. It was bizarre that Wasps didn't kick to him and put him under pressure as he would have been nervous.

Sale, especially since Deacs took over the attack coaching play an exciting brand of rugby when weather dictates. Josh knows Deacon as a coach and that must also be a significant reason for joining, as well as the money. International Union is also a much bigger product, so the chance to put on an England shirt is also a massive fillip. There is decent competition on the wing, but I think he has a chance. The last two wingers from Wigan didn't do too badly (I know Ashton was a RL full back).

It is unfortunate that you got to watch such a dire debut, but it isn't so bad normally! Sadly, Sale have decided to play on Friday nights, which isn't so much of an issue for a summer sport like League, but in Union it really does have an impact on the quality of the games when it is dark, dingy sub zero temps, wind rain etc.

It isn't a coincidence that we are targeting League players since Deacons appointment, so I wouldn't be surprised to see more. I'd be looking at Gelling, obviously, though not quite sure where I would play him.

Happy to keep you updated on Josh's progress, if you are at all interested. I'll be honest and criticise Sale and Union, if needs be!

Hooray! I can't think of anything more exciting than seeing Gelling waste all his talents as well.

Obviously you'd have to pay Gells to change his nationality first, so you can dangle the England carrot ... but that doesn't seem to be a problem for you lot. Perhaps you could then do what you did with Burgess ... play him in completely the wrong position and afterwards blame him when he doesn't shake the world for you.

Just promise us one thing, mate ... if/when these lads come home again, can you try to break the habit of a lifetime and not ruin them first?

Why not go to Union?!?

More money? YES
More opportunities for worldwide recognition and of course recognition in his home country? YES
Less wear and tear on his body YES
More opportunities to in from of big crowds in internationals? YES
Opportunities to play in a REAL world cup? YES

And this is coming from a RL fan.

Who has been ruined by Union? Sonny Bill seems to be able to switch between the two. Tompkins has been pretty good for you since returning. Burgess is England captain. I'm trying to think of others who have come back from Union?

Was Scott Quinnell or Inga ruined when came to League?

I wouldn't really want Gelling, to be honest, as I don't quite see where he would play.

This could be the start of a great Wigan Sale relationship. We get Charnley, Robinson, maybe Gelling. You get Andy Powell.

Henry Paul, Lee Smith, Chev Walker, Iestyn Harris....

Arguably Sam Burgess hasnt come back the same player either

As for Burgess he wasn't completely played out of position. It was either centre of back row. Personally I would have taken him as a utility sub, but Lancaster's refusal to play him in the back row didn't make sense.

Plus, he actually did ok when he played, unlike some who played at that World Cup. The criticism of him was total nonsense, and to be fair more of a criticism of Lancaster's selection policy and the impact that Burgess selection had on moral. It wasn't a dig at RL or the player, more that he shouldn't have been selected.

Henry Paul was old when he came back. Walker had injury after injury didn't he. Lee Smith was only in Union for about 5 mins, and I'm not convinced he was any good anyway. He won Harry Sunderland trophy I think which elevated him way beyond his ability.

Harris, I'll let you have. At the end of the day, players have come back and been a success, so perhaps that says more about them, rather than the respective merits of the two games.

I think Burgess is an unfair example to use, he was never in Union long enough to definitively say it ruined him. Players have been out injured longer than he was in Union and still come back as good as before.

Rearrange into a popular phrase or saying " the shoot messenger don't" perhaps clutch like me thought you may be interested

Lee Smith won the MoM in the 2008 GF from fullback when he scored two match winning tries IIRC. He played in and scored in three successive GFs. He could play right across the backs and even after he signed on for Wasps he played for England RL. Tony Smith picked him at centre in the 2009 Four Nations. I remember him playing against the Aussies at the JJB/DW.

I always thought he was a bit of a mixer, but talented nonetheless. In fact he only played one game for Wasps, so we can hardly blame Union for his demise. However once he returned to Leeds he wasn't the same player.