Something has gone sour in the club. It could be the personnel changes etc?

On the field we have had three wingers partnering the same centre, has anything changed?

We have a low effort prop?


We have halves that clearly have no confidence or no idea? We have some outstanding forwards putting in 110% every week with nothing to show for it.

Something has to change.

If every morning you put coffee and milk in a cup then add boiling water you get white coffee this will happen every time without fail. I think our problems go deeper as we have made changes but sadly got the same result.

I am no coach, but i can see/feel sonmething is wrong. If the team building in Aus and Leeds hasnt worked then we need to look deeper, we have gone beyond lacking confidence and/or quality.

Something is not right but I still have faith that TS can get it right and have a feeling he has a few signings up his sleeve for next year to give the club the boost it needs.

I'd be tempted to give Moz another season. I'd bet he'd want out of Salford. He is low key but he has been exceptionally reserved considering he is the Salford skipper.
We know how to wrap him up in cotton wool to get mpg out of him.
BUT it's his attitude and example that is missing from Warrington I reckon.

This 'mentality' point gets overdone IMO.

Warrington hadn't been in any major finals for nearly 2 decades and we won our first three in a row despite the theory that "you have to lose one to win one".

We have played Leeds the bastions of big game strength in 3 major finals, won 2 lost 1.

Our overall record in major finals under Tony Smith is won 3 lost 2. Factors of luck will influence any one individual game you can only really judge fair conclusions from looking at a bigger sample of games where you would expect luck on the upside and downside to even out over time.

Last year's Grand Final for instance, people talk about Wigan's great big game mental strength over ours, but how come they were getting panned before we lost Monaghan and Ratchford? Sure they came back and ran the tries in when we had a completely disrupted backline, but had Monaghan and Ratchford been on the pitch, do you think Wigan were going to put on a great comeback and turn us over? We will never know, but my money is on no.

t.co/agWfyzMtaF Matty Russell talking about him speaking to Tony Smith & Simon Moran about the plans for the future before signing his new deal.

t.co/agWfyzMtaF Matty Russell talking about him speaking to Tony Smith & Simon Moran about the plans for the future before signing his new deal.

In this week's Guardian Smith (again) talks about youngsters whilst glossing over the fact that senior players are not up to scratch. Found myself wondering, why does Russell not fall into the ease him in gently catagory? I'm a tad worried about over relying on him- people seem to forget his age.

I agree GO, he's an exciting prospect and should be regarded as such and given time to grow into his position.

We can simplistically blame all of our ills on Briers's retirement, but, in addition and in the case of Russell playing with a misfiring/injured first choice back line with shuffling HB's and no settled wng/centre combinations then I feel a bit sorry for the lad.

Although given his age and relative inexperience his attitude does seem to be first class so no olong term worries from me

Russell has his negatives but they are things that can be coached out of him. Plus he gives his all every game and you can never fault that in a player.

I have to assume that this is 'Cinnamon-like' irony. Leeds fans were apoplectic about McDermott right until the day he won them the GF against us.

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Russell is simply too good a player now to benefit from kid gloves. He's already passed the point where he would benefit from less games or a spell with swinton... he needs to be tested against the top clubs to improve.

As for the original premise of the thread... this does have to be the most ridiculous suggestion in the short time I've been around. The only reason Smith would have taken us as far as he can, is that there really isn't anywhere to push on from 4 trophies and 2 grand finals. Yes it would be nice if we'd pulled it off at OT, but sport doesn't always work like that. Smith pulled together a team of utter misfits after Cullen left and moulded them into a championship quality side... he did the same with (an arguably much stronger group) at Leeds and there is no doubt that he has the ability to do it again here.

...not without a decent front row.
Hill cannot do it by himself.

Poching must have served his apprenticeship now, time for him to start looking for a coaches job somewhere.

Get Briers and (wait for it) Shaun Long in, have them working on attack, also lock the pumps and beer fridges and make some use of the NHS building.

TS can then work on the defending.

Or get sean longs dad on the phone!

Ironic that Matty Russell is given time to grow into his position...yet he is 1 year younger than GOB but with more experience due to him playing in Austrailia & for Scotland....yet GOB is yet again made the team scapegoat.....unfortunately Rubbie Duckie is right as far as HB for Friday go.
With no attacking play being coached, Briers is busy coaching the U19's who are flying, the only way for him to learn is in a match but with no one to help he is out of his depth...Myler is a support player not an organiser but doesn't want to be the support player with a less experienced player...and Ratchford plays better at centre than stand off....but TS wouldn't be able to play all his superstar players is that was the case.

My theory has always been the same.
It's that you have your best players closest to the ball.
The two best players with ball in hand at present is Ratchford and Bridge.

No brainer, they play at hb.

And if we bring in another hb then he plays with Bridge and Ratchford is moved to 3/4 or bench.

Agreed to some extent that it is ironic, but ,although I've never 'scapegoated' GOB he is in experience terms more than a year older than Russell with his stints here and elsewhere in SL. An experienced, new signing would have been given time to integrate into the team.

The writing's on the wall for me for GOB as when picked others have kicked. I'm surprised really as he's a belting place kicker and knoicking the two's over wouldn't have done his confidence any harm surely?

i haven't seen anyone making a scapegoat of GOB... Just an admission that he doesn't appear to be good enough to be a HB for a top side.

He's an inexperienced HB for a side that has many failings atm....

and where does Myler fit into your plan?

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agreed. I wouldn't go so far as to say he is one of the problems, but he certainly doesn't appear to be one of the solutions either.

I agree he's not ready mainly due to the lack of game time and/or confidence....I think there needs to be a few 'solutions' and I'm not one who is wanting TS to go...I think its on the pitch/players where the main problems lie

Isn't there a position available on blue peter now?