Not saying who was the better player, but Burns stepped up when the chips were down and we stared into the abyss of relegation. Without Burns, we wouldn't have seen Waterhouse.

Thanks Sally - that's pretty much what I would have said, so you've saved me a lot of typing! Chris Riley, we salute you.

If Swann had played in the peak TS team then he would have been a real handful running out wide on the right edge with King/Bridge and Hicks/Joel Monaghan. Swann was probably more of a threat to the opposition than Louis Anderson was.

The reason I put LA ahead of Swann is on consistency. He was good in his first season 2008, when the team wasn't (Cullen's final season/Lowes took over) and our two big signings Michael Monaghan and Matt King struggled that season. With LA we got a consistent level regardless of how the rest of the team was playing. Swann was hot when the team was in form and then in his second season when the team struggled, he faded away too. You could say the same about that whole famous right edge of Swann, Gleeson and Fa'afili. In 2006 they were way down off where they'd been in 2005.

I don't think Swann was a bad player or a signing bust, I just wouldn't have categorised him as underrated. He was like Simon Gillies. Gillies was only here for one season, but we had a good run of form where Gillies was great, scoring tries, had Toa running off him. Then the final month or so of the season we were garbage and he disappeared. Swann was like that but over 2 seasons.

Louis Anderson was more like Darren Burns, you knew that when things were falling apart around him, he was still going to deliver. Ben Westwood, Paul Wood, Simon Grix all fit that category too. It was noticeable when TS took over, which players from the Cullen era he stuck with long term.

Bang on Sally. I was gutted when louis Anderson left us and would have been happy to see him return at absolutely any point between him leaving and his retirement. Him and Westwood in the second row could handle absolutely anything that was thrown at them! Possibly the toughest 2nd row in wire history, certainly in my time. Grix was my favourite player for a while, he had everything a real shame he was cut down in his prime the try he scored when he dummied a kick over the top was genius, absolutely spot on with his decision making. Wood was overshadowed at the time by carvel and morley but I'd absolutely love Paul Wood coming off the bench at interchange now.

If Waterhouse had held onto that pass 3 metres out against Leeds in the GF, we wouldn't be hearing those chants either. Turning point of the game.

Chris Bridge
Trent Waterhouse

Bridge for his last 3 or 4 years was fantastic at centre, and I was sad to see him go.

Problem was those injury hit 5 or so years at the start of his Wires career, when he was being in/out of the team and bounced around different positions.

Bridge was a good servant for us and underrated. Ten years he was here and scored 104 tries in 228 games and kicked 209 goals. Th couple of seasons he had with Joel outside of him he was on fire and I remember Joel saying when he left how highly he thought of him.

I put it straight to Paul Cullen that had Bridge stayed...’out of trouble’, you’d still be a Warrington.
“It’s interesting you should say that....”
Make of it what you want.

One of the hardest things for a fan to understand is why players, in general, are not as invested in the club as we are. Rationally we understand it is their job, but emotionally given that we would all do just about anything to pull on the jersey to play we just don’t get it. Which is probably why most players are very careful not to be as blatant about their intentions as A Gregory was.

Andy Gregory gave 100% when he played. He wasn’t looking to go Pies. He went because he fell out with the coach as he did at Widnes. The disappointment was that it was something that could have been resolved as Wire were on the threshold of being better than Wigan. AG had the opportunity to take an average side into the history books...alas he went then to a team that didn’t need him and offered little but to continue their status quo.
I do know that he played the Wigan club too, to suit him. There was one particular day that a doubles golf game was due the same time as a Wigan match, he told the club he wasn’t fit and played golf.
He had said more recently he loved his time at Wire, we’d built a great team and didn’t want to move, and some regret he didn’t stay longer.

Think you lads have drifted off the wrong thread??....

What about Paul Cullen as an underrated player? I know the title is "in the SL era" but I'll sneak him in to the conversation as he is such a significant figure in club history.

I think Cullen got taken for granted in his playing days. I saw the later half of his career, where he was largely a back rower, and I thought he was very good. For me he had the best attitude of any player I've seen in the Wire jersey. Not just about his drive to get the best out of his talent and his commitment to the club. He had incredible mental strength for being able to switch on to a challenge. I don't remember ever seeing him play in a game and thinking he wasn't "up for it". He was never overawed by big games or seem to show any nerves. He wasn't afraid of any opponents or reputations, and he wouldn't coast against lesser teams, he was always competitive. He missed his one chance to play at Wembley because of getting suspended which must have been gutting, but he knew it was his own fault and he just sucked it up and got on with it.

I don't remember him playing centre or stand-off but I thought he played at a pretty high level, for a number of years, when he was in the pack.

I wonder how Cullen would have done if he'd played 20 years later, he would have thrived in the full time professional era. Imagine having Westwood, Cullen and Harrison in the back row in TS side. I bet he'd have played for England.

I used to love Cull’s interviews pre match, “the important thing is that we keep our discipline” said with absolute sincerity, and every one knew who would lose it. BUT he was 100% commitment. I always assumed it was his size that probably held him back from international recognition.

You were lucky , sal.
You missed Cullen's attempts as a half back, which were poor, at best.
As a centre, he reminded of Carl Gibson (Leeds centre late 80's early 90's). No idea, attacking wise, but little got passed him, defensively (Gibson, amazingly, went on to play for GB).

A total revalation, when he moved into the pack.
He almost reminded me of one of those characters from those clichéd war films. You know the ones. Always the first to go into battle, with no thought of his own safety.

(iirc) his move to the pack, was due to his loss of pace (if he had any) after knee/leg surgery . Thank God for that injury.
For that reason alone, Cullen DOES deserve the tag underrated, for his forward work

Paul Cullen was described in open rugby magazine as 'The classy centre with the film star looks'!! Yes, seriously.
He was actually on the verge of making the GB squad until his incident with a certain Mr.Goodway.

Yes I think Cullen thinks that was where he blew his chance because Mal Reilly was at Wilderspool that day, he thought he might have had a chance of the 1988 tour to Australia.

Stretching the rules about "SL era" again (this guy did play for us in 2001 so technically counts) how about Gary Mercer for another underrated player. In his first spell from 1989 to 1992 he was possibly our best player over that time. Certainly would have been up there. He had a tough mentality as well, and was a big imposing guy who was quite fast in his first spell. He had an arrogant swagger to him, not in a bad way, he just gave off the impression that he privately rated himself as the best player around and he was another who was never going to be intimidated by opponents or by pressure situations.

Whereas with Cullen you knew he would stay at Warrington for life unless something really drastic happened, I always felt it was a matter of time before Mercer joined one of the big clubs which happened in the end with Leeds.

I was pleased when he rejoined us in 2001 too, not just for sentimentality reasons. He was in his mid 30s then and seemed to have fallen out with people at Halifax where he'd been player coach. We were going through a difficult season and the team was sliding in the wrong direction, Mercer came in and seemed to bring confidence and toughness to the dressing room and played pretty well too. Later in the season, when we announced the replacement for DVDV as coach, Mercer quit straight away and went back to Leeds. I think he joined us to position himself to go for the coaching vacancy and as soon as he saw it wasn't happening, he was off.

Gary Mercer underrated??... The opposite I'd say.

Came in December 1989 with Duane Mann, off the back of the NZ tour, as an international centre and so there was a certain expectation that we were getting something special.

What we got for the first 12 months was a distinctly average centre, with no more talent in the centre than Paul Cullen, who himself was very limited in that position.

An injury crisis in the winter of 90/91, led to him being moved into the second row, we then went on a run which saw us lift the Regal Trophy and suddenly a new player was discovered.

Overall, he was a (accidentally) good second row for us, but considering his reputation when he initially signed, I'd say underrated is being very kind.

It's interesting to hear other people's perceptions. Maybe me putting in Mercer is similar to the earlier poster who included Logan Swann where I disagreed - a player who made a good contribution that doesn't get talked about much now - rather than underperforming against expectations at the time. Like Swann, Mercer was an established Kiwi international. Also I only started watching in 1989 and was getting to know the players from scratch so I didn't have prior expectations in my mind of Mercer being a big name player.

I thought Mercer was rated well but I am only old enough to remember him under Cullen.
Thought Mike Wainwright always got a rough time of it, Always looking for the offload and didn't miss tackles. Would of looked great in a better side.

Didn't like seeing Fa'aflli on defending kicks chasing back If i remember correctly. Going forward under the high ball. I don't remember anyone better. I remember him being shifted to centre towards the end and seeing what looked like a world beater at times.

Fa'afili had his flaws but he seemed to attract more stick than he deserved. Everyone was quick to have a moan when he made an error but explained all his tries away as Gleeson putting them on a plate for him. He wasn't a winger that was going to excite the fans, given his style of play. Fans like wingers with pace who can go the length of the field and guys who can do that will get the benefit of the doubt from the crowd - everyone was rooting for Kevin Penny to make it when he went through a bad patch, and Allan Hunte who could be lazy was also a popular figure because he scored some burners for us. Fa'afili was the slowest winger I can remember at Warrington. He was basically a kick receiver and someone who could finish well from close range because he had a strong build.

Fa'afili's skill set was quite similar to Joel Monaghan, although JM was better. We used them in similar ways. JM benefited from playing in the TS era when we were winning Challenge Cups, whereas Fa'afili played in the Cullen era when we were signing lots of big names but always seemed to be the same underachieving side, hovering on the fringe of the playoffs. Fa'afili was probably judged in a more critical way because of the frustration of the fans during that era. I wonder whether if you swapped the eras where those two played, if JM would have attracted more criticism, as he was also a winger that didn't have great pace, and if Fa'afili would have been given an easier ride from the fans.

You could make a similar case for Mike Wainwright vs David Solomona. Solomona was a better player but they had a similar skill set (Wainwright had better stamina and work rate, Solomona better at creating magic plays, but they were both ballplaying forwards). Solomona may have been seen as a frustrating luxury in the Cullen era and Wainwright could have been seen as an underrated gem if he played in the TS side. I always thought Wainwright would have worked in the Saints side of the era if he'd been there instead of Bennett or Stankevitch.

Wainwright was a good player for us in his second spell. Cullen seemed to believe in him whereas DVDV never seemed to rate him. Moving away did him good because at the end of his first spell he had a really bad time where he was making handling errors, the fans were getting on his back and DVDV was making it clear he didn't think much of him. He came back a better, more confident player from his spell in Salford.

The stick Mike Wainwright used to get was totally unjustified, another one of those players who crowds seem to scapegoat for not always apparent reasons.

For those of middle age Gary Sanderson Roby muller Paul ford roger O'Mahoney just a few who were most underrated... No doubt there's many more

Agreed. Mike hit a period during his Wire time where the team around him were pants. If he wasn’t so loyal, he’d have been playing for England not Scotland. I look at what moving to Wigan did for ex Wire forwards on an international scale.