he's an utter backside....

Sam Tomkins Needs protecting
[urlhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-league/18538370[/url

After a late high shot from Michael McIlorum
"I don't think the referee got it right. Leaving your team-mates in a massive game against your arch rivals is like a suspension in itself. I don't mind the sending-off if they are consistent through the year.
[urlhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-league/19469243[/url

what a door handle.

I can understand him looking after his players but on both counts he is wrong.

Sam's team mates should protect him and the officials should deal with what they see.

McIllorum deserved sending off, he was late high and I think it was intentional, not to hurt but to let the player know he was there. I don't think there is an argument for him miss timing it from the VT evidence, full on head shot.

If Saun thinks any different then he is deluded.

He might be a backside but he's won them the league in his first season in charge, with a lesser squad than ours, so he does deserve some credit.

only cause we kept resting players lol they only did it once really v widnes

Yeah Wigan have been playing their full strength team every week apart from that Widnes game

No excuse, we've got a bigger squad than them with better young players so we should have been able to handle it.

Sorry Sally don't agree, we have the same size of squad, they have some good youngsters.

I think it was to do with player 'resting' by us and a desire to play their best team each week. We were one point behind, one win where we rested players would have given us the LLS.

Tactics and a desire to gamble for the Super league play off trophy.

Hope we perform in the Play-Offs, but:

2nd in the League and another Challenge Cup isn't too bad from where we were a 5+ years ago.

He deserves credit, definitely, but so does Maguire for the legacy he left behind. I think Wigan have been a weaker side this year than last season, the problem for us being that we were weaker by a bigger margin. 2nd and Cup holders again is pretty good, definitely, but I reckon we could have managed top of the table as well with a bit less chopping and changing every week.

On another note did anyone else hear the Brett Finch interview on GMR. Wasn't happy to say the least.

ive got no doubt we have the better team just hope we prove it now it matters

I wouldn't exactly say we were weaker tbh. You look at the way we've rotated our squad this year, we've rested a lot of players throughout the season and some games in particular were lost due to this. If we had won these games then we would of come top of the league by some margin. Wigan have pretty much played a full strength team every week apart from the blip against Widnes.

As far as pure talent comes in to it; I believe we have the most talented squad in the league as can be seen by two wins of Wigan this year; the first was close but we were playing awful at that point and the second could be called a demolition and to be fair we didn't come out of third gear in that game.

Wigan will run out of steam in the playoffs like we did last year, and remember, nobody remembers who won the league leaders shield!

Still like to see where Wigan have played full strength every week apart from Widnes, but no one has backed up this made up fact yet...

We beat Wigan twice and still finished below them. In a 25 game season V the other teams in Super League they won five points more than we did - scoring more and conceding less in the process - which is an impressive achievement especially considering their Magic Weekend fixture was a lot tougher than ours.

Shaun Wane has done a good job this season as Tony Smith did last season. It is clear that Smith has held a bit back at times this year though, and we'll find out over the next month if that pays off or not. People who are trying to dismiss Wigan's chances altogether though are kidding themselves big time.

I was going to mention this also. The fact Warrington have played Widnes 3 times and Wigan played Saints 3 times, should have a bearing too, even more so when you consider that Wigan lost to Warrington twice and also Widnes once.

I think the table is a fair reflection. Warrington have been consistently good over the whole season, whereas Wigan went through the months of May and June on fire and that was just enough to see them come out on top.

Warrington have not been consistently good this season. Indeed far less so than last year.

The table is a fair reflection of the results of the season as points are given for winning games but in these days of play offs it isn't necessarily a reflection of how good teams are. It is no secret that Warrington hasn't placed emphasis on finishing on top of the weekly rounds and have all season rested key players. Wigan have finished top, are they the best team in the league?

I would say just slightly yes. Unfortunately for Wigan, even though it's more down to the tactics instilled by Tony Smith, Wigan seem to struggle against Warrington.

However I don't think any team in SL shown the same sort of form Wigan produced in May/June, by putting 50 on Leeds away and destroying St Helens at MM.

Saying that though I feel Warrington are the team to watch in the playoffs, but if Wigan recreate the form from May/June they will be favourites. I just hope we get a Wigan v Warrington GF because it is fully deserved and will be a cracker!

Did Wigan and/or Saints/Leeds for that matter place as much emphasis on finishing top last year as Warrington did?
Were Warrington the best team in the league last year?

It's sad that the weekly rounds have far less importance so it is hard to say who was or wasn't gunning for top spot and who really is the best team. Imo over the last two seasons Wigan and Warrington have looked the best 2 teams and they they both went for it last season, Warrington pipping Wigan to the top, the only difference this year is Warrington's indifference to the LLS. If Wigan have a poor play off series this year Wane might follow Smith's lead next year and another team might emerge and take the LLS

Well i'd say no, Everytime Warrington has needed to win an important game (including beating Wigan twice) they have achieved it (hopefully that will continue)

And if Wire don't win it will Tony Smith change his plans again?

Basically what I'm trying to say is that the LLS is neither here nor there under the current play off system.
Nice to have and if your in with a chance of winning it with say 10 games to go then fair enough, give it a go.

But basically 1st or 2nd is basically the same.

As I say every year (and more so under the Top 8 system) If finishing top at the end of the year meant you were the Champions (I.e no GF) then EVERY club would have played out there season and rested/rotated and utilised their squad etc in a different way than they do now.
So as far as I'm concerned finishing top of a league system that not everyone is trying to finish top of 100% means pretty much nothing?

well wane did come out with something last week, that i agree with, there needs to be a benefit to finishing top, whether it is a cash prize(though you can't see anyone stumping up something that'll blow your socks off), or the right to have a player exempt from the salary cap the next year, or a certain amount exempt.

Some sort of reward, or incentive.

Andy Wilson proposed that the league leaders should be the team to represent super league in the world club challenge as an incentive for finishing top on last weeks backchat. I thought that was a good idea but the rest of the panel dismissed it.

We shouldn't even have the league leaders shield, giving more rewards for finishing top would be wrong. The 'league' fixtures aren't even equal so some teams start 2 points up on their rivals. What we should have instead is fewer teams, fewer 'league' games and more representative games.