Well William Webb Ellis was born in Salford so I guess it's kind of relevant...

Jesus wept if you don't know that most of that is tongue in cheek, though I do think that if the stadium owners got a football team involved you'd face issues from local residents as pretty sure they thought that there was only going to be events at the ground on say a Friday night or at weekends and my understanding of reserve football is that it is played during the week.

We all need to remember the stadium isn't our toy so the owners can let whoever they want play with it, like it or not it makes perfect fiscal sense to utilise the facilities as much as possible.

At times too little here inspires a serious response.


I really should but they fascinate me. Like that cycylops piglet in a jar that was doing the rounds online; grotesquely curious.


As it stands they've not embarrassed our administration and driven us out of our ground but speculating on those aspects seems fair game on here. I'm just offering some balance.


It'd be a pretty big blunder on the club's part not to chat with high profile sponsors of rugby when they're sat upstairs. A year-round corporate package shouldn't be that hard to sell to someone enjoying a half-year deal already.

Well to be fair, considering you've willingly admitted you can't stand football it is quite hard to tell the difference at times.



United's reserves play home fixtures on a Thursday night, 7pm kick off. Considering the numbers who attend it would hardly create a problem - the outdoor pitches and other facilities are in use during the week as well.



I agree. We can still be wary about the motives of others, our own mis-management and the potential issues we could face in the future. If it all works out then I think we'll all hold our hands up and move on.




That's true. But there's also times where attempts at serious debate are dismissed in the same manner. If more people were willing to engage in these discussions properly the "this club is sh*t f**k tarry and wilki lol" type nonsense would soon vanish.



That, my friend, reads a sign that you need help.





That's fair enough, but at times that balance could do with expanding on - and this isn't something that's just aimed at yourself. One word responses like "marketing" when asked what the benefits to Salford could be, followed by details on Sale's season ticket deals isn't offering a fair balance and isn't really comforting anybody other than Sale fans.



You're assuming one of the following scenarios: a) our own club staff will constantly be present at Sale games b) Sale sponsors will automatically end up at one of our games at some point. Will either of those happen? Remains to be seen. If either of them do, have our own club got the nouse to "chat up" these sponsors and sell the club properly? I would hope so, but again, that remains to be seen.

It's born more of the omni coverage in the press that percieves everybody in the country enjoys it and wants to read about the sordid lives of some of the people involved in it, and scandelous wages paid that at some point must surely come to an end and then the whole thing will start to fall like a house of cars in a hurricane.


I've been to the new gym almost every evening after work and the football pitches are used sparingly, the real surface one is still not in use and looks like they are about to resurface it again. I just think that the stadium management company will need to be careful if they start creating issues with traffic during the week as the local residents will only start to kick up a fuss.



Sorry but what people seem to forget is that we will have a contract of use for the stadium, Sale will not be able to change that without the stadium management club renegotiating with the club certain aspects of it. There seems to be lots of people screaming for club to play on Sundays and should Sale want to play Fridays it looks like they might get what they wish for and if the club is savvy (yes I know but we live in hope) we get something in return for giving that up.

I keep saying it but it's done and dusted so the club (and as they seem to cherry pick certain ideas we moot on here) need to get their collective thinking caps on and make it work for them, I'd start by kissing the people who organise the media coverage and promotion at Sale on their Lilly Whites and getting some help as frankly we need all the help we can get.

Which is actually something that those of us that do follow football would agree wholeheartedly with you on.



There's an American Football team just started using one of the pitches, I'd assume they'd be using the grass rather than 3G but I could be wrong. We're arguing a moot point anyway, seeing as it seems fairly obvious United Reserves won't be moving in now.



Again, I think most of us would agree with that, what is playing on people's minds is the lengths of each lease, the fact that Sale have been far more open in what's in it for them than we have been and knowing that we need to improve ten-fold so that when that contract is up for renewal we're not in a weak bargaining position.



And once again, I don't think you'd get any argument on that point. We remain to see whether it will happen or not. Fingers crossed.

I see Gloucester are launching legal proceedings against Sale cause they've tried to poach their coach, lovely club.

Threatening rather than launching at this moment [urlhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/17755346[/url but says a little more possibly about Mr Diamond and his ethics (allegedly m'lud)

Agreed, but many of the fears raised are just as unfounded and lacking depth. I've not noticed anyone rejoice at the news, most seem to agree we don't yet have a clue how it will unfold but we appear to have one camp dead against it and another willing to wait and see what happens.


Perhaps not constantly, but I'd be shocked if they didn't sieze the occasional opportunity (likewise Sale with our sponsors). Everything ahead of us remains to be seen and some scepticism is natural but should also be looking at how we can exploit the situation for the better.

A lot of the fears raised are based on looking at what happened last time Sale moved into a ground. I can only hope the Council nor Peel ever get an excuse to try and sell the stadium to recoup cash. That may well come down to how well we perform on and off the pitch rather than anything else.



You'd be shocked if they didn't, I wouldn't be surprised at it. But then again, I'm a natural sceptic so that may well explain that one.

the stadium sale might depend on who is Mayor and only one of them is a Salford fan and two others who are leaders of their parties but don't like the stadium.

Don`t like the Stadium Pev,have they ever been? Are you sure its the stadium and not the cost to the Salford people they don`t like,and letting another sporting club who have never contributed anything in to the coffers of Salford City move in willy nilly.Just a thought.

We should just merger both clubs and become the Sal(e)ford city red sharks

Sorted!

I'll no doubt get a load of abuse for this but I'm going to try to reintroduce some rational debate by chucking in a few facts, a couple of questions and an opinion.

First the facts:

* Once Red City Developments went belly up, the only way we could achieve a new stadium was by choosing to accept the role of paying tenants, rather than owner occupiers (as we had been at The Willows).
* Once we made that choice we gave up the right to decide who else plays at the stadium and there was a tacit acceptance that, at some point, we'd be sharing the stadium with another sports club (most likely Sale Sharks)
* The fact that we've been awarded our last two Super League licenses is largely down to the promise of a new modern stadium.
* The stadium itself was financed and delivered by Salford City Council in partnership with Peel Holdings.
* the stadium itself is not viable as a business on the strength of Salford City Reds playing 13-15 games per year in front of 5-7,000 gates.
* the necessary improvements to stadium infrastructure and transport links are more likely now that the facility will be in use all year round.

Now some questions:

* would fans of Salford City Reds prefer to see the stadium fail as a business?
* in this eventuality, would the fans of SCR be happy to see the stadium bought from its current owners (the people of Salford) or be closed altogether?
* will the fans of SCR be happy to see vital improvements made to the stadium (including a proper supporters bar) and better transport links or will we be more concerned because "it's only happened because Sale are here."
* will the fans of SCR be pleased to finally see some of the club's history/identity imprinted on the stadium (eg, pictures of legends in the concourses, bars named after past players etc) or will we be more bothered by the fact that Sale - as co-tenants - have got equal representation?
* would the fans of SCR prefer to see the club die a slow death at the Willows or at least have the fighting chance of success in partnership with Sale at the new stadium?

Finally, an opinion:

As a fan of Salford City Reds, I wouldn't have chosen to have another tenant in situ at a time when we've yet to really stamp our own mark at the stadium. However, the fact is that we are now co-tenants and it's incumbent on the club to enter the partnership in a positive manner and ensure that the relationship yields results for Salford City Reds.

Personally, I believe Sale Sharks offers a better fit than some of the other supposed options being banded about (FCUM, MUFC reserves etc), and if the two clubs can treat each other respectfully, with tacit agreement not to poach players/staff and not to do anything that can harm the other club, I actually think that all parties can benefit. I also believe that both sets of fans have the responsibility to be courteous and respectful and that those who aren't do great damage to their respective clubs.

Let's not forget that 12,000 Salfordians packed out the Willows for our final home game last year (the reasons why we've struggled to carry anything like those numbers to the new stadium so far is best left as a topic for another discussion). IMO most of those people (other than the 3000 regulars) were there first and foremost to support 'Salford' itself rather than any specific interest in 'rugby'; we need to find a way to convert that civic pride into bums on seats rather than worry about where and how Sale gets its fans from.

My opinion is that if we are bold, positive and proactive we can turn this situation to our advantage. I also believe that the fact that the people of Salford part-own a fantastic stadium and that the city will hopefully soon host two world class rugby teams, will do wonders for our city's standing and will help put Salford on the map for all the right reasons.

But whatever I or anyone else thinks the fact is that Sale Sharks will be sharing the ground with us and we can either choose to be positive and try to chart a successful route forward or we can curl up into a ball and wait for our club to die.

Entirely logical.
Now wait for the abuse !

an interesting analysis waywardfan, and I'm pretty much in agreement with you, but just one correction.... the rugby club was not "owner occupier" at The Willows - the ground was sold some years back to Watson Godliman Homes, presumably we're quite used to paying rent!!

Very good point. So, in that respect, The Willows was no more 'ours' than Salford City Stadium is.

Wayward fan: too sensible a post, keep giving the facts & maybe with some the penny might drop!

I entirely agree with your post, some need to get real!

Odd isnt it - after a well crafted summary from Wayward Fan the dinosaurs have failed to appear?

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Karlos 13 asked you a SIMPLE question earlier in this debate. "What are the benefits for SCR in this co tenancy". You answered with a pathetic ONE answer without even elaborating, you answered "marketing initiative". So that tells me how inept our board really are and have been for 30 years, we've the same budget relying on Sale's marketing initiative's of pulling rabbit's out of the bag, how deluded are you, unless the club explains the benefits i'm keeping a skeptical mind thankyou. Keep thinking of the positives boys, should keep you busy for a bit.

I could give maybe 20 - no maybe 30 benefits to the club - the opportunities are boundless. However with you lads there is just no point. If I said the sky was blue you would argue that its brown.

We are now in `business` with Sale - fact - between our clubs we now have an opportunity to market year round top flight Rugby - no other club has that luxury (bar Quins).

Whats done is done - they are here - so are we - we now have to be very positive about how we benefit. It could be the makings of the club if we use our resources well.

Hello EB,this dinosaur is here,wrong again,So we are now in business with them now,thats news to me,we would say the sky was brown because it is,i feel sorry for you,i bet the stockport county fans have fallen in love with the sharks to and are heart broke they have left them, IMO,they don`t belong in this stadium,they have not put a penny into its construction,its been part paid for by the people of Salford,Salford City FC,Swinton and any other sporting club from Salford should be there not some out of town entity who have no affinity with our city. Schools from around the City should be made welcome to use it,our local amateur RL and Football finals should played there to,that just might make the people of Salford aware that we play there to.

I do like you EB you do talk a lot of sence

Us fans don't really know what goes on behind closed doors we can only see what we are allowed to see out of these 30 benefits how many are reliant on sale playing ball and basically sharing their resources? From the outside sale look ruthless in every department and us fans including myself are worried they will take take take to benefit themselves.

Saying that I'm struggling to see what we offer to sale in this beautiful relationship unless its more about how we make every pound work and its THEM who need to scale down their spending on promotion and playing staff and they are looking to how we finance our club

What do you suggest Mitie Mouse? What is your grand plan?

It is so easy to keep criticising everything associated with Sale, which is fine but I would love to see some of you showing a little support or offering a real alternative.
I would be happy to see an alternative master plan instead of the negativity being shown.
It appears I was one of the few to make the journey yesterday, remember the club will only grow with your support & if that's not going to happen then it will need to look elsewhere to survive.

Agree redgunner & thanks for the comment the optimist.

The problem with the dinosaurs is that their Agenda is ............... sorry there isnt one. Unless mitie & his pals start looking to the future instead of the past we have just zero hope.

Playing RL at Barton equates to say 20 matches a season or 36 hours per annum. What a waste of a facility like ours. Assets have to work to provide revenue and our 20 matches just wont suffice so its quite understandable why Sale have come and maybe others too.

Barton is a RUGBY Arena and the first thing the club(s) should do is to market the year round opportunity to the whole Manchester conurbation - not just the Salford City regulars. If we don't then we will fail.