he's not going to be as good as if he played there all year is he? he hasnt been that great at stand off this year, and he's a far better stand off than he is a centre. I can understand your desire to get him in the team as on his day he can be a great player but i would rather play someone in the position they play all year than just slot them in somewhere for the sake off it. Theres no recent evidence to suggest that pryce would do well in the centres.

Bridge has been far better than Pryce this year

Neither however should be in the final England Squad

From memory Bridge had played 2 or 3 games more.

I was just responding to someone who said Yeaman's stats are better than Bridge and therefore he is more deserving than Bridge to be in the England train-on team. In reality this wasn't true.
It's good that people are suggesting alternative names rather than just slagging Smith off without justifying who they would rather pick. I think certain players may feel slightly hard done to such as Welham, but I don't think there is a clearcut case of someone who is clearly more deserving than Bridge and Harrison who hasn't made the squad, Yeaman included.

bridge and yeaman are nothing alike, kirk has always been argued about as a centre cum second rower which is what was holding him back from being a truly class centre and kicking on, more in the style of senior and latterly atkins where he runs hard and direct, bridge is a gleeson footwork style where he's got the ability to put the step on and accelerate around a defender through a gap, this is how in our eye's he's done a bloody good job of replacing big gleeson. And some of us have been saying for ages that he's a below average halfback but would make a great centre.

Ben Harrison I can understand as IMO he has great potential but Chris Bridge? Seriously?

I think I'd prefer Fielden in the squad than Bridge.

The biggest problem I have with this is not the selection of players for a train on squad that in reality is not going to beat Australia any way.

It's the blatant abuse of powers as the national head coach in appearing to be picking players for the squad becuase they play for him. ATEOTD and IMO neither Harrison (yet) or Bridge would be any where near the squad if Smith wasn't in charge.

I like Smith as a coach and the effect he has had on the domestic teams he has coached cannot be argued with, however at international level he just has not cut it (not had the cattle perhaps).

I just don't like the advantage this gives him/Warrington when it comes to delivering a message of 'come play for me and the national setup awaits', nor do I feel to comfortable in having some of the leagues best youngsters in the presence of someone who is appears to not be bothered about abusing his position.

This squad would of had 8 Warrington players in it if Atkins hadn't pulled out, thats more than both Leeds and Saints are likely to have and don't tell me that Smith didn't play the I'm the England head coach card when trying to sign Myler/Atkins

I don't particularly blame Smith more the RFL/system, it was the same whilst Noble was in charge it just didn't seem as 'in your face' as it does right now.

I like the idea of train on squads and bringing players who are on the fringe into the setup for the experience but as far as I am concerned the coaching setup should be headed by a full time coach (no idea who) who is not linked to any club and is therefore not providing any unfair advantage to any team in the league.

Whilst last year was pretty poor, the way you and many others talk, you would think the 2007 series against NZ never happened.
How did the team we stuffed do a year later?

Is it a full time job though? What does he do for 10 months of the year? Who are you going to get for the job if it's a full time role? The honest answer is that we would get a coach not regareded as good enough to have an SL or NRL head coaching position.

There also the fact that in a sport not awash with cash, a full time England coach might not be the best use of what would be a much greater expense for a full time coach than it would for a PT coach.

Beating half-a-side is hardly comparable. Look how they did against us in the 2008 World Cup.

IIRC, they had a full 17 out each game.
Look at what we did to them in 2007.

Why do we have such a hard time accepting success?

It's almost as if our supporters prefer to see their team lose, so they can bitch about it.

Quote ="Durham Giant"When i posted thisthread i had my doubts about Tony Smith viewtopic.php?t=430528 Now with this it has confirmed them www.sportinglife.com/rugbyleague ... gland.html Is Bridge really going to be an England half back ahead of Pryce, Myler, Tompkins, Rachford, Burrows etc. Is Harrison going to be ahead of Wilkin Burgess, JJb etc. then why are they in the train on squad for England now . What has it done to attempts to get a meaningful international competition now Ireland have lost two key players. Between the RFL and Smith they are messing up International RL. Aditionally what does it say to club players come to Warrington and i will get you in the international squad. The sooner Smith **** off the better for England internationally he is incompetent, nepotistic and possibly a fifth columnist for the ARL and RU. What a waste of space Particularly when you look at the players left out. Dale Ferguson should have walked in ahead of Harrison. What a joke'" Really........ you sure about that???

Quote ="Durham Giant"When i posted thisthread i had my doubts about Tony Smith viewtopic.php?t=430528 Now with this it has confirmed them www.sportinglife.com/rugbyleague ... gland.html Is Bridge really going to be an England half back ahead of Pryce, Myler, Tompkins, Rachford, Burrows etc. Is Harrison going to be ahead of Wilkin Burgess, JJb etc. then why are they in the train on squad for England now . What has it done to attempts to get a meaningful international competition now Ireland have lost two key players. Between the RFL and Smith they are messing up International RL. Aditionally what does it say to club players come to Warrington and i will get you in the international squad. The sooner Smith **** off the better for England internationally he is incompetent, nepotistic and possibly a fifth columnist for the ARL and RU. What a waste of space Particularly when you look at the players left out. Dale Ferguson should have walked in ahead of Harrison. What a joke'" Really........ you sure about that???

now that is a bold statement!! (not literally

)

You know what I meant. The 17 they put in the Tests against us was nowhere near the same side as they had out in the World Cup. In fact, they were so weakened, I'd never heard of half the players.

OK, even if I gave you 2007 (which was against a very depleated and poor NZ setup, which if I recall correctly, changed it's coaching setup immediately afterwards) last year was more than embarassing and that was with Smith full time, how can it possibly help the situation to go backwards and then make him part time?

You know what....the 17 England play this series will be quite different to that of 2008. Will Australia and NZ be trying to qualify out their wins over us in 2008 because of that?
Why do we find it so hard to accept success?

So why so keen to make excuses for when another country loses, but when it's England everyone wants to revel in misery?



Was he actually coaching full time, or did he have other responsibilities that have now been filled by others?
I have already said why I don't feel the role is a full time one.

I think it is a full time job yes. How is it the world champions, without essentially a major league in their own country to develop (as they mostly use the NRL and Super League) can operate a full time coach yet here in the UK the RFL don't beleive it to be a worth while investment? If it's as part time as you make out with the leagues we have running and the size of our organisation in the UK, Stephen Kearney must be bored out of his t@ts.

ATEOTD we are not Australia and everything is not running tickety-boo

You cannot tell me that a Full time national head coach could not use his time wisely by going round each UK club, not just Superleague, meeting players, watching training sessions, advising head coaches, bringing together train on squads and trying to help youth development to it's full potential in this country.

OK this might not simply fall under the job description of just a head coach but surely this would be a worthwhile investment (and not a million miles away from what Smith was doing in the first place, it appears he just simply wanted to get back in to a head coaches job). I'm not saying it would be glamerous but do feel it is partly (a big part as well) to do with why our international teams fail so badly when it comes to the big stage.

At least they would be involved on a full time basis, what would be wrong with taking the elite players into train on squads throughout the year once a fortnight maybe, teams don't do set play training 5 days a week they have weight sessions/cardio or day's off, surely theres a way to take these elite players out with the agreement of the clubs for the good of the national game without affecting the domestic one to much?

I appreciate it may not be ideal and may not work but just feel there has to be a better way to maximise international player development within the current structure of Super League and National Leagues?

As far as the Coach goes, well at this point I get stuck becuase I can't think of anyone but IMO you'd need perhaps a decorated quality coach who is looking to slow down a bit, doesn't want the day in day out of a club head coach but is looking to stay heavily involved in the game (a Bobby Robson of 10 years back if you like). One thing people will never agree on is who that should be, there has to be someone good enough out there after 150 years, isn't there?

I'm not keen to revel in the misery and I was please with the 2007 series win but you cannot say it was against the same New Zealand that was at the world cup.

I am as keen as many other British fan's in seeing our National teams be the best in the world but when you don't agree with the current setup unfortunately it maybe reads as though we a reveling




As a national coach it would be impossible to coach full time however as I have mentioned in my last post IMO the role of head national coach in rugby league must be a lot broader than just coaching. I still don't believe that it can be a forward step by making the head coach part time. It would be like having a full time sales guy with a part time sales manager, where's the motivation coming from?

tbh i thought david waite was doing a good job back in the day

You have had a great season but what have you won....You need to look at internationals as one off cup matches where a team is picked to peak.And winning the cup shows he has the ability to pick such teams.

Course not. Every team changes every year. Teams that lose tend to change more than teams that win.



There are plenty on this thread who have clearly dismissed the 2007 success. We have seen Smith described as a failure - despite 2007 being a complete demolition of the team that later became World Champs.
We have seen a team that was completely smashed by England come back to win the World Cup just a year later.

Harrison is a cracking player and Bridge is one of the best british centres when fit.

Don't see the problem.

he was doing the off field stuff well, just a shame he was a rubbish coach. he was of the "pick the best 13 players regardless of position and fit them in somewhere" coaching school, which resulted in us having 5 loose forwards playing at a time.

You know what the funny thing is?



There is one guy who is a specialist at bringing together a representative side, simplifying their game, giving them a few things to break down the opposition with and giving them all the self belief in the world.


Problem is, he couldn't be stuffed to go back down the levels to coach your park footballers.