In some cases its true though, less so these days of course.

Lawrence im not yet convinced tbh, Cudjoe should definately be in there.

I am not sure Lawrence is ready to play at international, but he should be in the train on squad.

Cudjoe is an option (yes i did read ALL the posts just forgot him). Out of the options Widdop seems the more natural fullback of what i have seen. IMO Cudjoe will make a good winger rather than a fullback. All the options have question marks and i hope one does step forward and make the postion his own in the upcoming internationals.

My only problem with Widdop is...how many NRL games has he played?

Kevin Brown would get murdered because he's lightweight and the Aussie forwards would target him and run over the top of him.

The same with Luke Robinson.

I like Leroy Cudjoe + Michael Lawrence but they are not international standard players.

I'm afraid we are clutching at straws here fellas.

Big forwards running at the smaller, lighter backs? What a revolutionary tactic, i don't think anyone in england's ever thought of that. I bet Kevin Brown's never even seen a back row forward, never mind tackled one.

This is the 6ft, 14st 9lbs Kevin Brown?

Yes, I wish the Aussies and Kiwi's had half backs that small for our forwards to run at

Or Robbinson who was happily bringing down Graham by himself at the weekend, yeah, he'd get trampled.

Lets not bother going eh.

Graham aint exactly big for a prop forward and the Aussies do tend to be slightly more aggresive than ours.

Those lads just aint international standard players and I apologise for being negative but I do worry that we are going to get are backsides kicked!

I hope I'm wrong

Graham is 6ft 2in and 16st 9lbs - that's a pretty useful size for a prop

I dont think playing Widdop is any more of a risk than starting with Tompkins or Cudjoe at fullback. Dont underestimate the quality of the reserve grade that Widdop is playing in Australia either. The production line of players that seamlessly graduate every year from the reserves to first team is testiment to the quality of that grade.

Personally i think Robinson and Brown are better defensively than Burrow and McGuire and we have never had a problem playing them in international fixtures. Robinson in particular is quite tenacious in defense. I dont see playing either in an international game as a problem.

Its too early to judge McNamara just yet. He can only play with what he’s got and he’s got a lot more to choose from for England than he did for Bradford. He beat Wigan this year with that dire Bradford squad which proves that he can get a team to produce a shock win.

Whilst he didn’t leave Bradford in the best of shapes that was his first time coaching a top club. Everyone makes mistakes and I’m sure that Steve knows that more than anyone he has to produce something good on this tour because no one will want him as coach if he’s got progressively worse after leaving Bradford.

Last chance saloon for Steve at this level and all the best.

I aggree, I would take Brough along, I would like to see him take them on up the middle in broken play.

And that is the problem in the UK, since the A team folded there is no longer a pathway through for emerging players to cut their teeth, they are put straight into the 1st team and its a case of sink or swim, and if they only just tread water we are ready to slag them off because they are'nt cutting it, we should be looking at better pathways to break in future emerging players.

Widdop had 2 years in the Acadamy (U1icon_cool.gif at Melbourne Storm, 2 years at U20 Toyota Cup and was voted Player of the Year at fullback and named in the U20 Dream Team of the Year, 1 year NSW Cup playing fullback and stand off and also picked for the NSW Residents, State of Origin Team at stand off, was stand off of the year in the NSW Dream Team of the Year.
He made is debut during the last year playing centre in place of Greg Inglis, then played two further games at fullback and centre. And then we all know about his debut against France.

I,m not trying to big up Widdop in anyway, but am trying to highlight the probable reasons for what seems as an earlier than normal call up than that of a Uk based player, the different pathways he has received in Oz as opposed to the pathways that are on offer in the UK to other emerging players are far greater. The Storm have nurtured him through their feeder teams, as they have done with many other players in the past, (Ingliss, Slater, Smith, Cronk, Hoffman, D Johnson, Blair, Lima, etc, etc, all Internationals) before releasing him into fulltime 1st grade,
he will move into the 1st grade team next year at stand off.

So as far as the question of experiance goes, he has had quiet a good pathway to be considered for the England squad, he has already played against many of the players that you will see in the Aus/NZ Squad so mentally you could say he is more prepared than most debutants, physically, only time will tell. If infact Steve is getting a team together for the World Cup, then I think he should allow more of the younger emerging international players to tour irrelevant of wether we win or lose, they will gain valuable experiance playing against some of the best players in the World, I'm not saying fill the whole team, but take some of the names thrown up above instaed of bringing back some of the old guard.

Going off thread a bit here but I have listed below the pathway's that most NRL players go through beforte reaching grade.

Harold Matthews U16
SG Ball U18
Bundaberg Red Cup Open Age (Feeder Teams)
NSW Cup Open Age (Feeder Teams) Qld Cup Open Age (Feeder Teams)
Toyota Cup U20 (2nd Grade)

Then NRL 1st Grade.

Also you have the Arrive Alive National School Boy Comp (U1icon_cool.gif and the National School Boys Chamionships (U1icon_cool.gif that the Junior Kangaroos are picked from.

All the above are good standards of Rugby League and are heavily supported by the NRL.

There is not anything like the same pathways in the UK?

THE END

Four more players have just pulled out of the Australia team. Jennings, Lyon, Minichello and most the dngerous of all Thourston.

It will be a shame to see quality players missing from the tournament but if ever there was a time when Australia were there for the taking this is it. They have a handy nal of players to replace the injured with but they aren't of the calibre of those who would be starting.

Would nobody have Chris Riley on the wing?

of the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse,inglis,thurston,slater &lockyer...2 horsemen have gooorrrrnnn and of the other 2 only one of them is fit.....


this blows it wide open.....as its normally a combination of the feaks (inglis,thurston,slater & lockyer) that destorys us......their replacements are'nt freaks...just decent RL players

FFS, Brough is Scottish.

well he's not......but he has gone back to playing for scotland

But they are also at their most dangerous when they have their backs to the wall and are written off.



But they display one very important trait that we don't see enough in English players:

They raise their game above their club performances.
They are fiercely proud of their National shirt
They learn very quickly from poor performances.
Every Australian believes that they can still win the game when down by two tries with 4 minutes to go.

Teams that beat them raise their intensity and maintain it long enough to crush the fightback.

We can do it in one off's and NZ have shown they are capable of playing them at their own game. I actually think it could be an "interesting" series.

Lunt you are having a laugh - his defence is a joke

So Todd Carney, Mark Gasnier, Chris Lawrence, Scott Prince are just decent RL players!!!

I haven't noticed any particular weaknesses in his defence to be honest - are you talking about the strength in the tackle, missed tackles or some aspect of marker/cover play?

Besides, the way that Brown has developed the Giants in the last couple of seasons, I wouldn’t have thought he would carry a weak defensive forward, especially as he has moved Lunt to second row this season