it isnt a sad indictment of jnr RL in england, its a sad indictment of Hull KRs ability to bring through young players,

this is a an all english Leeds team, of players, at Leeds right now,
1. Ben Jones-Bishop
2. Lee Smith
3. Kallum Watkins
4. Keith Senior
5. Ryan Hall
6. Danny McGuire
7. Rob Burrow
8. Ryan Bailey
9. Matt Diskin
10. Jamie Peacock
11. Jamie Jones-Buchanan
12. Carl Ablett
13. Kevin Sinfield

14. Paul McShane
15. Luke Burgess
16. Chris Clarkson
17. Luke Ambler

that side would imo, be the equal of Hull KRs which will include 10 overseas players, i would guess Wigan, St Helens, and Warrington could put out English sides of similar quality.

There are many british players out there the equal of many of Hull KRs over-seas players, they havent been signed or developed by HUll KR because Hull KR dont want to take the long-term sustainable option, they want to try and take a shortcut to success.

Dont try and pretend that there arent the English players out there, its simply Hull KR failing to find them, or to sign them, nobody is asking you to put out a side with 17 english players, just saying that one with only 7, 5 years into SL, from a supposed heartland teams is a pathetic return,

Wires would be:
Mathers
Riley
Bridge
Atkins
Williams
Briers
Myler
Morley
Clarke
Carvell
Harrison
Westwood
Grix

Higham
Wood
Cooper
Mitchell

Honestly not much weaker than the current one although as seen on SC's thread, we havent developed many of those

St Helens team for next year would be....

Wellens
Gardner
Wheeler
Shenton
Foster
Lomax
Eastmond
Graham
Roby
LMS
Clough
Dixon
Wilkin

Moore
Magennis
Emmit
Ashurst

Bulls

Halley
Ainscough
Sykes
Platt
Finegan
Addy
Southernwood
Lynch
Godwin
Scruton
Whitehead
Walker
Langley

Wardle
Hargreaves
Kopczak
Crossley

Add Leon Pryce to that . . . . .

Can some one clarify for me.....

There is a steadily reducing quota for non federation trained players on each squad, right??

The only reason some clubs have more foreigners than the quota suggests is due to guys who'd signed contacts before 2008 when the new rules where brought in, who are exempt?

Need?

We dont "need" we just have.

We're playing by the same rules as everyone else.

Hull kr home grown

1 briscoe
2 fox
3 welham
4 ratu
5 colbon
6 murrell
7 spaven
8 watts
9 hodgson
10 wheeldon
11 netherton
12 cook
13 cockayne
14 latus
15 mariano
16 latus
17 taylor
18 beaumont

no, you 'need' to have these players to finish above clubs who are investing in youth and showing faith to their young players, you also 'need' to have these players because your club wont take a risk on English players. You 'need' to have them to try and shortcut to success.

And you arent playing by the same rules as everyone else, you were given a dispensation on overseas players, which in turn benefited you when you kicked up a stink over the previous quota rules.

Hull KR had a choice, they could have made a long term investment in british players, given them the chance and a couple years down the line reaped the rewards. As it is, you have chosen not to.

exactly, that team would get battered from pillar to post. But had you spent a few hundred thousand less on 30 year old Aussies, and a couple hundred thousand more on young british talent, then in 2 or three years time they could challenge,

as it is, in 2 or three years time when you lose Vella, Clinton, Mason, Newton and Galea you are really really going to struggle

My word, I can hardly believe it but Hull KR can put 17 Englishmen on the pitch too!

Briscoe
Colbon
Welham
Latus (S)
Fox
Cockayne
Spaven
Wheeldon
Hodgson
Watts
Cook
Netherton
Murrell

Latus (J)
Mariano
Taylor
Beaumont

Fact is in order to get around any potential legal issues the changes were made to the rules regarding who was classed as a quota player.

As long as the clubs stick to those rules they can – and in my opinion have an obligation to their fans to – bring in and retain the best players they can, regardless of where they are from.

Rovers need a stand-off – if Blake Green is the best they can get within the rules and salary cap restraints then I’m happy

Rovers need a prop - if Willie Mason is the best they can get within the rules and salary cap restraints then I’m happy

In coming years the numbers of non-english players on Rovers books will have to reduce in line with the rules. The challenge then will be to manage the decline of foreigners by bringing through the talent that has been nurtured in the academy. At that point, if the quality coming through the ranks isn’t good enough I will not be happy!

in a couple of years times those players could mature in too a good outfit and then challenge.

Im unsure where this pool of Super League standard English players is?

Do you know of a trick wherein a first class academy and group of young British talent is granted upon promotion to SL? Because if you do please show me.

We are making a long term investment in producing our own players and this is coming into fruition now.

As for our club not taking a risk on English players?

Paul Cooke
Scott Wheeldon
Danny Ward
David Mills
Josh Hodgson
Shaun Briscoe
Peter Fox
Mike Ratu
Matt Cook
Liam Watts
Liam Colbon
Chev Walker

Few risky ones in there im sure youll agree? Coupled with first team outings for Kris Welham, Scott Spaven, Frankie Mariano, Sam Latus and Scott Taylor. We're just about where we should be with progression.

We should put a cap on over 30s Aussies and as i don't mind players in their prime coming over to SL and playing e.g Lyon because they add so much to the competition but these journeymen who come over and add nothing can buggerr off

which players?

other clubs have done it.

And it would be fairly simple to bring your overseas players down, maybe you could have given a shot to Andy Ellis and got rid of Ben Fisher, maybe even planned ahead and brought in a McShane?

Maybe spent some of the money you are paying Webster to buy Charnley? or sign Ash Gibson?

Look at Danny Allen or Jamie Rooney, Mcnally instead of Blake Green, or maybe even stick with I'anson.

its not rocket science, clubs bigger and better and more prestigious than yours have been comfortable taking projects and moulding them into something, maybe if the Hull KR wasnt 'when in doubt look to the NRL' you could find the next Keith Senior, Shaun Lunt, Danny Kirmond, Richie Myler, Ade Gardner, Rob Purdham





they werent risks, you havent plucked a superstar from obscurity, found a diamond in the rough, all those bar Ratu, Hodgson and Watts were established first team players at established clubs.

And Bar Welham none of the others have come close to establishing themselves.

I wonder which 23year old british halfback who has played 33 first grade games in his career is being released for a 23 year old Aussie Halfback who has played 39 first grade games?

as i said the job of the Hull KR CEO and coach is to make sure HKR finish as high up the table as possible, its what the fans want, its what the sponsors want and it is what the RFL want (see license points for being competitive and drawing a crowd)

Looking at how our scholarship and academy programs are progressing I am confident over the next 5 years we will see more and more local lads becoming stars, until then I want the club to be competitive and if that means 10 NRL players and 15 English players in teh 1st team squad so be it. If we finish lower than 7th next year then I will come back on and agree it was a waste of money/opportunity.

So signing young unproven English players isnt a risk? Please tell me what is?



Surely having a handful of first team games is close to becoming established isnt it? Or by your reckoning is it debut BOOM 1st team regular?

In answer to your question, no need to wonder... its Chaz I'Anson and Blake Green silly!!...

and what about say Castleford who looked Arundel, Walker, Westerman, Owen, Shenton, instead of overseas players and finished outside of the play-offs because Hull KR 'wanted' to finish higher up so they claimed dispensation and relied on overseas players? is that fair?

as i said, Hull KR only benefit from relying on overseas players because others dont

You are aware that senior British players take wages and eventually retire too? Or are you suggesting that we should have gone without senior players, full stop, irrespective of where they came from? You see, a team which cannot challenge it's opponents is what is known as 'rubbish'. People are reluctant to pay to watch rubbish for periods of 2-3 years, which can affect a club's financial position and prevent them from investing in developing young players, meaning they remain rubbish.
As for us really struggling - Mason and Clinton will free up quota spots when we lose them. For the rest, we'll have to make our own, and their is significant ongoing investment in that area, or compete in the fed-trained market. This will either be fine if assumptions about lack of opportunities for young players underlie British RL's problems (8 club-trained players in every squad from next year) or will be an issue for [ueveryone[/u, if there isn't the raw material.

so which of those players you listed, bar Ratu, Hodgson and Watts, were unproven

Tom Bush has played a handful of games for leeds this year, if he makes a career in SL I will not only eat my hat, but every hat in Yorkshire. See Ben Kaye, Dwayne Barker,

Mike Coady has played for Leeds this year, is he close to being Leeds established centre? no at the moment he is probably 5 choice behind Watkins, Smith, Delany, Ablett, Senior

exactly, same age, same experience, if in doubt go for the Aussie, its the Hull Kingston Australia (trademark gutterfax) way

[iHull KR[/i do not have any dispensation. The way the rules have evolved may not have turned out to be fair, but if you get dealt a good hand you play it - especially if it is the first you've had in a while.

there is the raw material, we see the raw material week in, week out at other clubs, in fact we see senior british players move between these clubs but rarely to Hull KR,

It seems to be the SL way, given that I'anson has dropped down to the Championship.

they do, at the times the rules were changed (when hull kr kicked up a stink) Hull KR had a dispensation, this still benefits them now.

At the time the players needed to be signed to be exempt from the quota, Hull KR had an overseas dispensation, because of this they have more players who qualified for the exemption than other teams,