Really not ar$ed anymore Gutterfax (or Codhead for that matter). I see it like this:

1999:

Hull KR were in administration and playing in the (now) NL1, averaging 2000 fans

Fulcrubronquins Experiment were a competitive Super League side who reached the Challenge Cup Final at Wembley (though for the record, they failed to sell out their ticket allocation for the biggest game in their history, in their own city

). They were however (IIRC) averaging at least 4000 fans for home games.


2010

Hull KR are not in administration, and are a competitive Super League club, reaching the play-offs in their 4th SL season, and have averaged a minimum 7000 fans during each of their SL seasons so far.

Fulcrubronquins Experiment are a struggling Super League club (in terms of league position), and average 2500-3000 fans.


I know which club/experiment has progressed more over the last 12 years, and it isn't Fulcrubronquins Experiment.





Like I said before Gutterfax, all those young London players have received their opportunity because Fulcrubronquins Experiment do not have the resources of other (successful and real) clubs, if you did you would still be the team of 17 Aussies that you were when (wrongly) fast-tracked to SL in '96.

are you sure about hawaii ?
the british union flag is incorporated into the hawaiian national flag.

Cheating your way to Wembley with a non-registered player , must have also been absolute torture

Then why post?

In response:
1999:
HKR in lower league with a squad of English players. Fulhamcrusaderbroncoquins in SL and the CC final with a team full of aussies.
2010
Fulhamcrusaderbroncoquins STILL in SL but now with with a squad full of English players. HRA in SL with a team full of aussies (note the absence of a mention of the CC final)

Now, given the RFL's rules on player development, stadiums, overseas quotas etc.....I know which club is making moves in the right direction....and it ain't the one from east hull

I don't think that is right. Vella and Newton surely can't count on the quota if they have EU passports. Having an EU passport is what gets you "off quota".

Just looking at the RFL statement, it says that the following players are quota players:
Ben Galea, Blake Green, Michael Dobson, Joel Clinton and Jake Webster.

"RFL said Mason was not able to be classed as a quota player due to the 'Cotonou Agreement'."

If they are the five quota players, then your list may be like this (using your interpretation of the confusing RFL rules):
Quota:
Clinton (signed after 2008, so counts as both quota and non-fed)
Green (As Clinton)
Dobson (As Clinton and Green)
Webster
Galea

Non-Fed:
Mason (exempt from quota after buying Tongan PM a pint)
Clinton
Green
Dobson
Webster
Galea

Neither:
Fisher (exempt from quota as qualifies for EU through residency? Exempt from non-fed as signed pre-200icon_cool.gif
Lovegrove (apparently exempt from quota - he has played for Scotland, which might have something to do with it. Exempt from non-fed as signed pre-200icon_cool.gif
Vella
Newton

I don't get how you can be on the quota but federation trained. Surely if you are an Australian that is trained in this federation, it gets you off the quota? (And, do any of the Hull KR players come under this anyway?).

The RFL statement has explained nothing really! In fact, it's only led to more confusion. I'm beginning to be concerned that they may not even understand their own system!?

I stand corrected. Thank you JS.......





Don't pat a strange dog Bertie.....you never know if you'll get bitten.

I see you are an East Hullian. Would your pi55 poor attempt at trying to look clever have something to do with the now often used name, Hull Kingston Australians perhaps? It's not my fault that a fair number of posters on here adopted it to use when discussing your overseas players.

Given most of your time is spent trying to and failing to wind up fans of the bigger and more succesfully run Hull club, I suspect you felt that by jumping on a geographical history post, you'd try to look clever.......well guess what? You failed.....miserably.
Unless you'd like to list the other "wrong" posts that you can attribute to me. There are over 10,000 posts to search through and I have no doUbt there are a few incorrect assumptions scattered amongst them, but in the main, I generally think before I type.......something you should do.
If you need help with your search, ask dally messenger......he's always on the look out for new chums

Since when have the RFL ever understood their own rules ?

Vella - Maltese
Mason - New Zealander
Lovegrove - English
Fisher - Scottish
Newton - American
Webster - New Zealander

This Hull Kingston Australians name really is poor considering we only have 4 Australians playing in our team!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (And if Galea gets his Maltese passport it'll be only 3!)

yeah, good argument, people will definitely fall for that.

Some people fall for Jordan James and Anthony Blackwood being Welsh , let alone Eistin Harris , Chris. Morley and Kieron Cunningham , Mick Nannyn and John Duffy being Scottish

Yeah, cos thats the same aswell.

It is , but I don't recall you criticizing anybody about it

It clearly isnt. Those players came through this system they are entitled to seek work in it. If they then go on to choose any one of the four countrys which make up this single sovereign nation then that is fine. If they choose to move to and play for a club in the home nation they have chosen that is a positive thing. It would be silly to argue otherwise.

The other players were born and raised in Australia or New Zealand and have Australian/NZ passports, they arent products or representatives of our system. They are actually and factually NZ/Australian citizens and Passport holders.

If you want to pretend Wales and Scotland arent part of the United Kingdom that would be up to you. It would be no more ridiculous than many of your trolls.

Lighten up Smokey, it's a sport, you're a fan just enjoy watching the game leave the worrying to those who get paid for it!

By been a Rhinos fan he's presumably a fan of Kevin Sinfield. Therefore he's learned from the best when it comes to b1tching and moaning constantly.





Put that gumshield back in you tw*t!

Possibly the stupidest post I've ever seen


Apparently getting an additional passport no longer makes you from the previous country you hold a passport for



I'll give you a hand...
Rhys Lovegrove - born Sydney, NSW
Ben Fisher - born Sydney, NSW
Clint Newton - Australian parents (born in USA whilst his golfer Dad was on tour)
Ben Galea - born Parramatta, NSW
Mick Vella - not sure where he was born, but was a production of the Aistralian system and has represented Australia
Willie Mason - Grew up in Toronto, NSW and has represented Australia
Michael Dobson - born Junee, NSW
Blake Green - born Sydney, NSW
Joel Clinton - born Riverstone, NSW
Jake Webster - born Melbourne, VIC

All your imports are Aussies

Have to say I agree it is a bit silly.

Right - I hadn't seen that bit of the statement. In that case it will be as you've written, but Webster will not be non-fed, as he signed prior to 2008. It seems Vella has a Maltese passport and Newton must have an EU passport as well.

The reason you can currently be on quota but classed as federation trained is because the quota rule has been around for ages anyway, and the RFL don't face any legal threat from players regarding their quota status, and as such the RFL don't need to offer any exemptions from it. As the 'Non-fed' thing is a new restriction introduced by the RFL, and one which is legally sensitive, they have offered exemptions [ifrom that status only[/i to players who were around before the restriction came into place, doubtlessly to avoid legal action against them from players who would lose their job as a direct consequence of it.

You can't really blame the RFL. They're obviously playing it safe at the moment so that the system will survive the transition period until all the pre-2008 players have retired - if they put their foot down and refused exemptions then players would get sacked, sue the RFL, the whole system would come crashing down and we'd be permanently stuck with unlimited kolpak imports. It's just a shame that Hull KR have so brazenly taken advantage of the situation.

I think that's the crux of it there then. Webster, although debuting in 2008, signed his contract in 2007 so will be exempt from the "non-fed" ruling.

I just couldn't get my head around the need to have a "quota" ruling and a "non-fed" ruling when they are essentially the same thing (in that they count on the same list). But, as you've (I think) correctly pointed out, due to the old "quota" system and the new "non-fed" system, their is a transitional period where exemptions will mean you can be one and/or the other.

After this transitional period, probably about 6-7 years, I think the word "quota" will no longer be used as there will no longer be a need to use it. All quota players will also be non-fed players (there will be no exemptions to the non-fed, so you can't be on the quota and not on the non-fed list).

So the lists look like this:

[uQuota (those that were classed as an overseas player before 200icon_cool.gif:[/u
Joel Clinton
Michael Dobson
Ben Galea
Blake Green
Jake Webster

[uNon-Federation Trained (those that were classed as to be trained outside of the RFL [or is it RLEF? and signed AFTER 200icon_cool.gif[/u
Joel Clinton
Michael Dobson
Blake Green
Willie Mason
=#FF0000[EDIT - I put Jake Webster on this list instead of Joel Clinton for some reason. Corrected!
[uThose that are exempt from the quota (due to having an EU passport or because of the Kolpak ruling):[/u
Ben Fisher - UK passport
Rhys Lovegrove - UK passport
Willie Mason - Tongan passport
Clint Newton - UK passport?
Michael Vella - Maltese passport

[uThose that are exempt from non-federation status (due to having signed for a club in this federation before the 2008 ruling came in):[/u
Ben Fisher - signed for Halifax in 2004
Ben Galea - signed for Hull KR in 2007 (played first game in 200icon_cool.gif
Rhys Lovegrove - signed for Hull KR in 2007
Clint Newton - signed for Hull KR in 2007 (played first game in 200icon_cool.gif
Michael Vella - signed for Hull KR in 2006 (played first game in 2007)
Jake Webster - signed for Hull KR in 2007 (played first game in 200icon_cool.gif

So really, Hull KR could technically sign ANOTHER non-fed player with an EU passport or on the Kolpak ruling! And if they get Ben Galea a Maltese passport, that would make him exempt from the quota AND non-fed status, which means they could sign another fully-fledged Aussie. Or even worse, they could sign a player exempt from the quota but not exempt from non-fed AND a player exempt from non-fed, but not the quota (say convince getting Scott Donald to come out of retirement)! In fact, they just sign a full team full of foreigners that signed for SL clubs before 2008 with Kolpak rulings or EU passports and have a full team of imports!

I actually think the "work out which Rovers players are quota/non-fed/exempt" game is the hardest game I've played in a long time!

So, at Hull FC, we have:

Quota:
Craig Fitzgibbon
Mark O'Meley

Non-Fed:
Craig Fitzgibbon
Epalahame Lauaki
Sam Moa
Mark O'Meley

Quota Exemption:
Epalahame Lauaki - Tongan passport
Willie Manu - Tongan passport
Sam Moa - Tongan passport

Non-fed Exemption:
Willie Manu - Signed for Castleford in 2005

So Hull can sign one more quota/non-fed player...
Or 3 more quota players that signed over here BEFORE 2008 and one non-fed player...
Or 2 more quota players that signed over here BEFORE 2008 and one quota/non-fed player...
AND as many as we like that are exempt from both the quota and non-fed list.

Rovers have benefited from the many foreign players they signed in their promotion year that had EU passports, but these players can sign for anyone in the league and still be exempt. That exemption will probably push their wages up as well if they are to move on.

Indeed. It should begin to trickle away soon though. Most Australian players come over in their late twenties, so most of those that signed pre-2008 will be pushing 30 or be into their 30s by now (Galea and Vella are both 32, Newton and Fisher are 29). Hull KR may well have made things very difficult for themselves - Over the course of the next 3 or 4 years they're going to have to find or produce 6 Super League quality British players.

In 3 or 4 years time, they will have been in SL for 7-8 years so they won't really have much of an excuse NOT to have produced any by then to be fair. They've got plenty of time to do it still, so there's hardly any pressure really.

they couldnt bring donald back as the players who were here pre 2008 only keep their special status on the provision that they stay in superleague. As soon as they leave superleague they lose the status. They can change clubs within superleague but they cant retire then come out of retirement.

Is it TRUE that Willie Mason may actually appear on these shores this year?

Has the jumping through hoops competition finished yet?

I think the people have a right to know




or will this drag on like the "we are getting a new ground " saga of several clubs and a sod of earth has yet to be turned for some!!!!