So, we're agreed then. Prior to 2000 it was just Great Britain, but now it's Great Britain and Ireland and therefore it's essential to reflect the fact that it's now a team representing two 'nations'.

Personally, I would leave the red and blue V's on the shirt, but I'd also add two more in green and orange, as per the colours on the Irish tricolour flag. Alternatively I'd make the shorts green and the socks orange. I'd either drop GSTQ completely, or I'd have the players sing both GSTQ and then the Irish national anthem.

Loved the Ashes series between Aus and Gt Britain. Was weaned on them as a kid when they were played every 2 years post WW2. Saw my first match in 1948. Was also at the the Hull v Aus game in the same year. Attended all 3 games when we last won the Ashes in England(1959/60) and all 3 games when we last won in Aus.(1970) Believe they switched to playing every 4 years from the 70's.

Experiment to play the first match of the 1963/64 Ashes series at Wembley was a dismal failure attracting a crowd of around 14,000 and was never repeated. The Aus. team was star studded- Gasnier, Langlands, Raper, to name a few and hammered us (Gasnier 3 tries). Was working in London at the time.

I’m sure there is a desire to show representation for Ireland. Are there any Irishmen who are good enough to be in the squad? McIlorum maybe but not any proper Irishmen.

The desire is there but the practicalities are not. And the same goes for Scotland and Wales.

The RFU are in a stronger and easier position. They will always be able to find at least one Scot, Welshman and Irishman to fit into a squad who are good enough. We don’t have that luxury. However even then the RFU faced severe criticism from Scots when they didn’t play any in a recent Lions series. Yet the team was still called the British and Irish Lions and still represented all of Great Britain and Ireland including Scotland.

I get were not going to get much buy in from Irish people if there’s no Irish in the squad but that doesn’t mean we still can’t call the team British and Irish Lions. They are the best players from that region.

According to that logic we could expand the concept further call it the British, Irish and European Lions, without any Irish or European representation.

On the other hand we could legitimately select Theodore Fages , Antoine Gigot, Julien Bousquet, and Remi Casty as representatives of France, and James Keinhorst as representative of Germany, and it would be a true northern Hemisphere team called the British and European Lions.

You could but it sounds daft.

I get your point and it's a good reply. I was more talking about the issue of jersey and anthem. Just don't think the RFL should call the team British & Irish Lions if they dont bother representing the Irish nation on the jersey and choose to stick with an anthem praising the British Queen.

That's not a genuine effort to make the brand British and Irish inclusive.

If you're looking for a reaction you'll get a more detailed one when I'm not confined to mobile....... But in terms of the motherland, the Irish had a written language before the brittons and your main source of culture arrived with a French knight in 1066......your religion stems from a syphilitic king unable to get it up and your modern politic is blame Johnny foreigner...... At one stage you owned 2/3rds of the worlds surface....... Now you're beholding to Luxembourg...... Tell Me more about the motherland.....

I suppose that what they're hoping is that in future years (2024 and beyond) that there will be some Welsh, Scottish, Northern Irish, and Southern Irish players who will be good enough to make the team and squad on merit. Good luck with that, because I think RL would need to be producing a lot of talent in those nations in order for some to get through for GB and Irish Lions. I'd imagine any great Welsh or Scottish RL players would be targeted by RU and offered big money to switch codes - much like RL did the other way round with the likes of Johnathan Davies back in the 80's and 90's. I get that it's not quite the same because RL isn't amateur so it can at least try and offer something to persuade players to remain, but RU has got a lot of financial muscle nowadays and can offer the opportunity to play maybe 10 international a year in front of packed crowds in big stadiums.

Personally I think it's a flawed concept anyway. I mean, even if say a brilliant Welsh player came along, what you would be doing is putting them in the Lions for one tour, and then sticking them back in with a load of inferior players in the Wales team for the next three years.

if they are playing 6 games at test level (3 v aussies, plus nz, tonga and png) then i think something would have to be midweek or you are looking at a 7 week tour (given a week to warm up plus the games). i know tours used to be this length but in the modern game i think they'll look at 4 to 5 weeks max. they could well take a large squad with a top line 17, plus a sort of development team to play the midweek games - they could well play tonga in nz on a weds, for example, then the nz national team at the weekend. there might be a chance of a type of select team to play them as a first warm up in midweek as well

In context...

What are "brittons?" Are they similar to buttons?

Further on in the text, I need to inform you that the correct English is "beholden."

Try to brush up on your English spelling before you post, will you?

Ireland isn’t part of Great Britain or the United Kingdom, but it is part of the British Isles archipelago. It’s a geographical name for all the islands in this series of islands in this archipelago.

The British Isles is not a political term. Take politics out of it and all these islands are still part of the British Isles archipelago, the name was given by the Romans not any British political fists. Great Britain was termed on the back of the name of the archipelago because it is the largest (the real definition for great) island of the archipelago.

So the term “British Isles XIII” is exactly what this team should be called if we want to include Great Britain, Northern Ireland, Republic of Ireland, Isle of Man, Bailiwick of Guernsey, Bailiwick of Jersey and 6000 other islands, as they are all part of the British Isles.

We are a sport, not a political regime. I for one couldn't give a flying fiddle about the politics or history of Britain and Ireland in this matter....

In rugby league, it's Great Britain, and we wear the iconic jersey..... It's for English, Scottish, Welsh and Irish, and if an Irishman takes offence, he doesn't need to make himself eligible or support the team.

We are Great Britain RL, we wear our iconic white jersey with blue and red V... and that is THAT!

No, according to the recent articles, we are the British and Irish Lions, or Great Britain and Irish Lions, and the chances are the badge will again contain the words British Islex XIII.

As has already been said, we shouldn't include Ireland and put Irish in the team name and then treat them as if they are an irrelevance. That's arrogant and disrespectful.

Personally, I'd prefer if it was just Great Britain Lions (e.g. English, Scottish, and Welsh), but I don't decide the team name or the make up of the team.

Why thank you Manfred. I see the moderators at wwwTotalfacistrl.com haven't sniffed you out as an agent provocateur as of yet, but I'd steer away from being too obvious if I were you.....John and his ilk don't take kindly to strangers over there





Fair enough. It is your ball and you can play with it as you see fit, but the reality is that the only EU land border you are set to have soon is with the Republic of Ireland, so rather than beat your chest and bang your drum, I'd be taking a slightly more conciliatory stance and adding a green hoop on the socks and adding the "& Ireland" to the name....

...by the way, the 21st Century called and asked if you'd like to join it?

Not if it means every single thing has to have a political undertone....

It's Great Britain RL, if that doesn't include Ireland, so what, I couldn't give a rats whether it does or not, but we shouldn't change the name or the colours either way. Why not go the full hog and get rid of GB and just be the European Union Unicorns, but then that wouldn't be fair on the non EU countries, so let's be 'The Rest of the World Rainbows', but then that wouldn't be fair on the aliens, let's be the 'Universal Gender Neutral, Normal isn't Normal, Uber Snowflakes"...

Let's just quit international sport, it's just not inclusive enough...

spectacularly missing the point is an understatement.......In 1908 when the First Ashes tour took place, Ireland was part of Great Britain.....in 1922 Ireland left that arrangement after 700+ years of oppression, leaving behind 6 counties populated by English Protestants during the "plantation" of Ulster under James 1st some 410 years prior.....thereafter the other code refer to their side as both the British Isles and then the B&I Lions after this independence was gained.....why would an open and normally level headed sport such as Rugby League, that has led the way in inclusiveness deny an Irish mans right as a foreigner to be acknowledged as one?

Your John Bull bravado smacks of Jingoism and a slight tinge of right wing doctrine.......no matter the birth heritage of any of the players, if you're going to pick an Irishman it must be acknowledged in the name and the branding....

Then they should be acknowledged as a 'foreigner' by not being eligible for GB, though residency will get them in anyway. If they want to play for GB, they can, doesn't mean the name or colours need to be changed. They know the brand, they know the colours, if they want to represent GB, they can, if they're not happy with the name or colours, they stick to just playing for Ireland. Quite simple really....

It's like saying Australia should change their name to Australia and the Pacific Islands, and incorporate the red of Tonga, Blue of Samoa etc.... it's ridiculous.... if players choose to make themselves available for representation, then they accept the team they are representing...

The thing is where do you stop with this “Great Britain and Ireland” name? Because that doesn’t include the Isle of Man, Bailiwick of Jersey or Bailiwick of Guernsey. So should we be called “Great Britain, Ireland, Isle of Man, Bailiwick of Jersey and Bailiwick of Guernsey Rugby League” just to get every official bit of the British Isles into the name in case we ever have players from those places representing us?

Or should we just be called “British Isles XIII” as we have been for decades and decades anyway?

As I’ve said, the British Isles archipelago includes all of Great Britain, Northern Ireland, Ireland, Isle of Man, Bailiwick of Jersey, Bailiwick of Guernsey and 6000 other islands. Great Britain is just the largest island of the archipelago.

Just don’t call us Great Britain, or Great Britain and Ireland because that doesn’t include everyone. Call us the “British Isles XIII Lions”. We don’t need to change the kit. The kit is the kit, it’s iconic and should be left alone.

We have the badge already:



We don’t need to worry about anything else.

Great Britain is the name of the island where the game is mainly played. Job done.

Absolutely, Great Britain is the name, the shirt is the shirt, like it or lump it..... if you wanna be a part of it (whether English, Irish, Scottish, Welsh, Pakistani, Indian etc etc), then be a part of it. If you don't like that not every country is represented by a colour or in name, be a part of something else, but we are Great Britian RL.

How many Scottish, Irish or welsh born players do we think will make the squad?

Regards

King James

we won't know until Wales, Scotland and Ireland announce their RLWC 2021 Squads

Even if all 17 were born in England, does it matter? England is still part of the UK/GB, no matter how you look at it.

Even if all 17 were born in NSW, all 17 if good enough would be selected for Australia.....

I’d be getting onto Tyson Frizzell if I were the coaches because he doesn’t have an ounce of Aussie blood in him but plays for them. Will Regan Grace cement himself as one of the best wingers in SL by then?

They’d be my two for now. Let’s hope in fifteen years time we’re talking about five or six.